Re: Game Hint #1
 

I also thought that teams were not aloud to use monitors...

Re: Game Hint #1
 

These are the game pieces for the FTC game, Face-Off. The FRC game has not been released yet.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Oh goodness, you've "fed the sharks" again...

:p

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I did searches in this thread for the data tagging they've done on the moonfish and also what they are prey to. I came up short, was that stuff mentioned?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I dont think so....

Re: Game Hint #1
 

check it out...

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i checked answers.com (http://www.answers.com/topic/opah) but couldn't find anything on what eats them. alothough there is some other stuff there.

Edit: also checked Encarta.msn.com (pretty much useless). Thats all the places I know to check.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Originally Posted by Elgin Clock
Although, there seems to be a lake in that town in the shape of a shark! Ahahahaha!

I was hoping someonelse would pick up on that.

The main predators are humans great white sharks and mako sharks. hence the possible signifigance of Opah Oklahoma's "Shark" Lake.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

One question I can not find a definitive answer for is: "Why is opah called moonfish?"
I see a couple opinions, but nothing certain. I have my thoughts on why, but until I see a concrete answer I will avoid spewing out another suggestion for game possibilities.

So, can anyone help?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

hmmmmmm,... i've been reading this thread for hours now,...
but still pondering

hhhmmmmm

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Check out this animation from NASA about multiple levels on Mars
http://www.nasa.gov/mov/295588main_mro20081204-480.mov

Any comments Dave?

Fish Farmers? Re: Game Hint #1
 

Here's an interesting paper that might be tied to the Opah hint and using the new camera system:

Computer vision and robotics techniques in fish farms


Abstract:

This paper presents new low-cost systems for the automation of some fish farm operations. Particularly, computer vision is applied to non-contact fish weight estimation. Stereo vision systems with synchronised convergent cameras are employed to perform fish 3-D segmentation in tanks and sea cages. Several pre-processing algorithms are applied to compensate for illumination local variations. The approach applied for fish 3-D segmentation consists in detecting in both images certain fish features. Once these points have been detected and validated in both images, the fish are 3-D segmented by applying stereo vision matching considerations. Fish weight is estimated by using simple length-weight relations well known in the aquaculture domain. The paper also briefly describes robotics systems for fish feeding and underwater pond cleaning, which can be also used to implement the above mentioned computer vision techniques for the fish estimation.

Hmm?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I'm assuming that since they can be in excess of 100+ pounds, the only predators would be sharks and a few others.
Soft, white meat which tastes pretty good but they are ugly!

Re: Game Hint #1
 

yea it has very limited vision and lives in open waters in many differnent terains


possible limited vision for driver and u have to navigate open terrain??

Re: Fish Farmers? Re: Game Hint #1
 

This sounds like a reasonable guess. We could possibly be doing something involving grabbing something (fishlike possibly) out of a tank or other holding area, using an arm, and different items are worth different points, giving an advantage in autonomous mode to teams using vision stuff.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i noticed something new (huzza!)

in the above paragraph it mentions the "pectoral flapping" method of swimming

maybe we have to use a new method of getting around the field.

this would fit in with the bills blog post early in the semester that warned against pre-planning your design due to some sort of change (paraphrase).

any thoughts?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

well the FTC had those stupid rough terrain sections, maybe they're just going to scale them up or make them worse.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

A variation of the Sharks and Minnows game, w/o the water

(I have to say it- WATER GAME! *_* jk)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

MARS LAND ROVER REMAKE!!!!!

Re: Game Hint #1
 

didnt think of that but that could be a possiblity!

good thinking

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Does this mean you are going to start singing? :)

I looked up some hyponyms and other names for moonfish..there are a few.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Actually the expression I should have used is closer to "regurgitating another possibility."

What I'm looking for is more along the lines of their behavior that might lead to them being referred to as "moonfish". Do they feed more at night? Do they use moonlight to see in the dark? Is it just because of their shape?.....

I'm thinking along the lines of needing to use the vision system. You must admit, FIRST has put an emphasis on it in the past.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Dave has been too quite. You would think he would have dropped a couple drops of blood in this clue feeding frenzy by now.:confused:

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Maybe we already figured out what the clue is............?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Or maybe it is his evil plot to drive us all to insanity by remaining silent.

Mwahahahahaha! <--(what dave is saying right now)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

So far, all we have are two fishes and a bit of morphology text. Based upon this information, I predict that the game will involve capture the flag. /Nostradamus

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Isn't moonfish a prison term? I think it is. It its a term for one of the inmates that is marked to be "taken out" by an opposing prison gang. Maybe there will be an actual inmate in the ring and it will be our job to kill him without him breaking out. 2 members of the team will work guard duty and one will hold the knife. This game will be awesome!

Re: Game Hint #1
 

:eek: :ahh: :eek: :ahh:

:P

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Wow. Speculation hurts my brain. Anyway, the most likely solution to this hint is that we'll be fishing in a box or somewhere where the drivers can't see. There will be game pieces of different colors, and different colors will be either different points or for a different alliances (like the trackballs last year.) FIRST wouldn't have included the camera unless it was needed for the challenge.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

The exact term in jail is just "fish", nothing more.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

me too my mind is just about about mush after all this hint talking...

PS if youre from sfa why dont you drop on by on our team see if you could help us out during build season we could alway use the help...were from lufkin its going to be our second year...and a good one from what ive read so far

Re: Game Hint #1
 

if i can find a way to get to lufkin id be glad to help.

Edit: i currently don't have a car

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i highly doubt the game has anything to do with water... and the writing probably is insignificant to the hint. maybe the name of the fish means something? lampris guttatus is the latin name.

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/im...ine=1139719011

Re: Game Hint #1
 

wow... i havent heard that one before:rolleyes:

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Could they be indicating the circles on the fish?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I kinda like an idea of robots having to traverse a walkway suspended above water and drop objects into a pool with holes in it for points - thus the robots do not have to interact with the water and the new systems provide depth perception
(if it is even water -- I doubt)

FIRST n00b - crazy ideas

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Any Pics of this?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

my rough sketch

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I don't know if this has bee posted but i think it's a sun fish... is that a clue?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

It could have something to do with a torch and neck based on the latin name.
BTW @ pinballwizard96 won't the bots fall in the water possibly?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

walls, rails, barriers, call it what you want

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I found this when increasing sharpness and contrast. It has poka dots or a grid. Robotic checkers?
I also found something else and will post it later. Don't know if this is any help...

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Here's the next thing I found... a cryptic message? Also, there seems to be a blotch where nothing seems to be in the upper portion. I think I see letters hidden into it. I made this by sharpening the image multiple times.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Speaking of picture findings the language in the pic can be read better when you inver the colors. sorry it's still a bit blurry
Attachment 7006

Re: Game Hint #1
 

So I'd like to appologise in advanced if this has already been discovered, but has anyone found where this picture came from? if it was from a book what was it's title? To me that seems like the best chance we have for getting an edge. (however futile this attempt is, its still fun!)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

May I just say, the control system quick start guide refrences attaching wires to a "shank". I would not throw out my Prison oriented game just yet!

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I doubt that there will be water anywhere in the task. Water+ electronics do not mix, especially when people are handling them.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

What about him???

Re: Game Hint #1
 

nooooooooooooooooo....

you messed up the screen size

lol

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Well, if the water is ultrapure(lacking salts) then water is acualy a realy good insulator, but I agree that it probaly wont be a game which water is involved. Mostly because of how hard it would be to keep the water ultrapure...

Re: Game Hint #1
 

True, but the second a robot hits the water, the purity of the water is compromised... even if there's no grease or metal filings, the oils from the hands that touched it would contaminate it... and then you have circuts frying!!! (Always fun!)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Alright so the fish in the picture is called a sunfish and this same fish in Portuguese is called a peixe lua which means "moon fish". Now this implies that there is sun and moon... this could lead to the assumption that the sun and the moon is inferring to light and dark which could lead that it may be based on inferred trackers.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

MAybe we're tracking another light this year (perhaps not green this time..perhaps an infrared light trackign system?)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

As has already been well established, this hint is a photo of a "moonfish", with the operative words here being "moon" and "fish". Of these, I feel that "moon" is probably the more significant. In fact, the second half of the clue, "fish", is most likely a "red herring" (pun definitely intended) designed solely (pun again, not really intended) to draw allusions to the fabled "water game".

That's why I'd like to see more discussion about how "moon" could be a relevant clue. Many people have suggested a "lunar surface" for the gamefield. But why stop there? There countless other aspects about moons as well. For example:

1) Moons are "satellites". They travel in elliptical orbits around a central object.
2) Moons exert a gravitational tug on the body they orbit. Our moon effects the oceans, causing the tides. (Ooh! More allusions to a "water game"!)
3) Moons pass through multiple phases (waxing/waning, gibbous/crescent, full/half/quarter, etc.).
3) The etymology of the term "moon" shares the same root as the word "month".
4) The length of a lunar month is 29.53 days, or roughly 29 or 30 days.
5) Moons are integral components of eclipses (both lunar eclipses and solar eclipses) in which the view of one object is obscured by the alignment with another.
6) The goal of NASA's "Apollo" program was to land a man on the moon.
7) Many lunar dieties exist, such as Selene, Diana, Luna, etc.
8) Our moon has many features known as "lunar maria" (Latin for "seas"), such as the "Mare Tranquillitatis" or "Sea of Tranquility". (Whattayaknow? More "water game" clues!)
9) Folklore says lycanthropes (werewolves) transform from human into a wolf-like creature during a full moon.
10) Many expressions involve the word "moon", such as "Once in a blue moon", "The man in the moon", etc.
11) The moon is made of green cheese. Or so I'm told. ;)
12) And the list goes on and on...

Personally, for this clue, I like the significance of item #4 above the best. Firstly, news of this Hint #1 broke on Thursday 12/4 and it was officially released on Friday 12/5. Exactly 1 lunar cycle before kick-off. Coincidence? Yeah, probably. But very convenient, nonetheless. :)

Secondly, consider the idea that our moon's lunar month is roughly 30 days. Or better still, "30 units of time". Now, instead of "days", think "seconds". "30 seconds". Could this clue be a hint that this year's autonomous period will be extended to "30 seconds"? What better way to show off the capabilities of the new controller and LabView software than to put greater emphasis on the autonomous operation of the robots?

In fact, this summer I and a group of other FIRST competitors had the opportunity to meet Woodie Flowers at a National Instruments conference. One of the first questions he asked the group was if we would like to see more time given to the autonomous portion of the competition. In light of the above speculation about the clue, that question now seems a bit more prescient.

But then again, what do I know? This is all pure speculation and wild, baseless conjecture. Maybe the clue just means that "moons travel in orbits" and "fish travel together in schools" and that the competition will be various schools teaming up and driving in circles around the playing field. Nah. That's just silly. Surely, FIRST would never think of creating ridiculous a competition where everybody just drives around the arena like it was a race track, now would they? ;)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

this could be hinted to a free for all match and no teams

Re: Game Hint #1
 

hey i wonder if this wild idea means it'll be another one of those years where all the teams are on one alliance. (I'd like to see a 4 alliance year maybe once)

Re: Game Hint #1
 

possibly but it could be inferred targets in the shape of fish that the robots have to pick up using a crane like a fishing pole with a magnet at the end to pick it up:ahh:

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I really hope that autonomous isn't extended. It tends to be the most boring part of a match, is really hard to get right, especially for small, newer teams (like mine!) and overall dosen't provide the excitement of human driven competition. That being said, you make a great deal of sense for this thread.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

btw this could be an extended auto period and inferred reading in this period

Re: Game Hint #1
 

when i looked up the information on the Opah is that there is little known about this species biology and etomology

Re: Game Hint #1
 

nice job there you found the host site for that pic
so let's try to take clues from it shall we?
posted here: http://www.hawaii-seafood.org/opah.html

Re: Game Hint #1
 

This is my one post of wild unfounded speculation:

Multi-colored LAMPs on the field as navigation aids.

Also, I just have a feeling that there will be an obstacle - such as a 12 inch high wall - that must be climbed for a team to be at all effective in the game.

Onward to January 3...

Re: Game Hint #1
 

this is a pretty good assumption except i think the colors are goals rather that navigation lights....

or maybe as navigation lights that help guide you through a maze and it is timed or something... ionno

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i was considering the shape of the fish and the fact that when there are fish one goes fishing. i also looked at the clues from last year and non directly related to the game. its an odd clue but i think the idea is small.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

A longer autonomous mode would be very neat. Kudos to this idea!

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Well last year the hint were the wires from the new Hybrid mode, so maybe this fish has something to do with the new controle system? I like the idea of game pieces being up on a raised platform that one must climb...

Re: Game Hint #1
 

LabVIEW has a great vision processing capability. Also with the new CompactRIO, we are opened up to a whole new world of sensors and gadgets (50 G's SHOCK RESISTANCE!!!). My guess is that robots of each alliance will have to work together to accomplish a task of some sort. As far as the fish? Sailors would give each other an Opah as a sign of good luck before a voyage. FIRST might be telling us, "good luck figuring out the hint!"

Re: Game Hint #1
 

The actual image appears to have come from
www.fish.gov.au/fishnames/photos/37268001.jpg

Australian fish commision

with the fact of the new regional in New Zealand there might be another avenue to search

Re: Game Hint #1
 

There's been a lot of talk about utilizing the vision capabilities of the cRIO and Labview. I think that this is a possibility, but it will not be a necesity to be competitive in the game. That would be unfair to rookie teams and teams without the programming skills necessary. And also, who's to say that everyone will get the camera mounted and working. In '06 many teams did not have the CMU Cam mounted either because they didn't need it or couldn't get it to work how they wanted. I really doubt that the camera will be a necessity.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i read earlier in this thread that this fish has four diffrent layers of skin all of which are different colors.
maybe four diffrent colors of light in hybrid and not just green???

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Oh, I doubt thats a coincidence at all. This definetaly furthers my conviction that the most important aspect of this clue is the fishe's name. Especially since it lacks any anatomically or behaviorally interesting specialties. THe only thing particullarly interstiing about the moon is that has allways been an objective for mankind, a.k.a "Shoot for the Moon." This, combined with the detail that this fish is a loner, and a prized catch, suggests to me that a possibility is:

There, along with other possible ways to score, will be a central, though difficult goal, or task that will be either highly valuable, or change the shift of points dramatically. However, unlike past central objectives, only one robot / team will be able to accomplish /attain it in a single round.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

put the picture in photoshop

desaturate it

then go to levels
and drag the black arrow all the way to the right

it makes the letters more visible

they are backwards and it looks like they're out of a book
the only one i can make out is "body"

also there is a silouhette behind the fish

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I just want to point out that earlier in this thread I think someone found the exact text of what is behind the fish on a website.

I wonder if/when we will get another game hint.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

We are all insane aren't we? I just want to build a robot now. :P

Re: Game Hint #1
 

could not have been this site... there is no stuff in the background, and the FIRST photo has it. the point is that there are so many spots with this photo out there, it will be near impossible to find the original host. the point is, this clue is probably only hinting at something basic, like the game name. I doubt there would do anything as drastic as using the name of the original picture host to figure out some other deeper clue.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

if you're doing that, you can just flip the canvas horizontally to see them not backwards... multiple layers of text on top of each other.
i think this has been covered though

Re: Game Hint #1
 

The New Zealand regional got canceled for this year. Also, Australia and New Zealand are rather different countries.

Wetzel

Re: Game Hint #1
 

you guys are fishing for the game.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Ahh , FIRST is in the air. Ok my personal opinion. If this clue was for a water game that would be too easy, FIRST wants us to think long and hard about this one. So im calling NO WATER game. It would be robot genocide. Thats my personal thought.

Cant wait to see everyone at kickoff!

Re: Game Hint #1
 

If you look at the source code for the page you get a cool hint:

Re: Game Hint #1
 

red herring

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I was unable to replicate your results. That is really funny though. I wonder how long its been there.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i just googled " were no strangers to love" and clicked on the youtube video. Then got rickrolled.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Plz no Rick Rolling in the fourms. i get Rick rolled everywere else plz not here too.:(

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Sorry Lenny, I was just trying to pass the time and maybe make a few people laugh. As of right now, I think that's what this post is: a place for humor. What good is a bunch of speculation about a picture of a fish?

Re: Game Hint #1
 

im probly the only person left that has read this entire tread and still reads it.:rolleyes:

Re: Game Hint #1
 

This is very interesting...
I was looking up information on opahs when I realized that I had heard of opah before for something. I looked up the acronym for OPAH and I found a project funded by the Navy on underwater robotics.

I searched around the Navy's website until I reached the recruitment page and my mom got scared and said you're moving with your auntie and uncle in Bel-air. I whistled for a cab and when it came near the license plate said "fresh" and had a dice in the mirror if anything I could say that this cab was rare but I thought now forget it, yo home to Bel-air.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Lets avoid the internet memes in our speculations unless the GDC actually gives us one. :o

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I agree with ttldomination about its not a water game. it looks like a hat or something but ill be waiting for hint #2. It might make it simple for us to figure the game out.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

lampris regius (latin) = torch royal (english)

try royal torch on goole search


http://www.google.com/search?q=+roya...x=&startPage=1

http://www.wildoceanseafoods.com/Haw..._Opah_s/66.htm

Re: Game Hint #1
 

they could be raising the weight limit for the robots.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Well that is mighty interesting... A few sites listing a flooring company in my own hometown is in a bunch of the first results. :eek:
Kinda crazy!
And, I may just need to pay them a visit. Maybe that means a new flooring for the field as opposed to the carpet of many years past.
That could be interesting.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

*hand up in the air* - I read the thread, too. (no surprise there, I love puzzles, humor, and hints)

And... this thread is rated as a 5 star thread - that can't be all bad.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

I'm reading the thread, also, and was here for the original post. I just think that everything possible has been posted at least four times, so I'm just skimming through it without posting.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

i read the thread and im still reading it

I'll admit it... its true....Im addicted to game hints :rolleyes: :D

Re: Game Hint #1
 

((((you are not alone))))


Finally a clue to the reason for the fish. Here is the connection. In the movie "finding Nemo" there are fish that group together to form various shapes. one of these shapes is similar to the 2009 game piece.

Logically, the GDC likes to rattle the cages of those who think "water game....." So they look for the name of the fish that created the shapes. Moon fish! However, they supply a picture as a hint and not the name of the fish.

Now, if someone here has a DVD of finding nemo, could you please look at and list all the shapes that this fish school formed in the movie. one of the items in the list will be the game piece for the 2009 game.

Please remember, that when the shape is found, that it is mine, MINE, mine, mine, MINE.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

please excuse my randomness....(you have been forewarned)

but maybe they are referring to this song...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ojydNb3Lrrs

Re: Game Hint #1
 

The list of shapes the moonfish make are:
Swordfish
Lobster
Octopus
Ship
Clownfish
Sydney Opera House
East Austraian Current(Waves)
Arrow
Trench

Im not sure how any of those relate to a FRC game piece, but you never know with the GDC.

Re: Game Hint #1
 

Really? You don't say? :rolleyes:

Re: Game Hint #1
 

All the insanity. Hmm the real hint... there is no game they want us to take off for the year and go fishing. Obviously. Jeez thats what the text says. Its subliminal messages.