Re: Sorry--clarification on the rules about motors?
 

An important note - yes, I am responsible for creating and maintaining inspection procedures and documents and acting as the intermediary between the GDC and LRIs. I am NOT the official interpreter. Official answers always need to be obtained from the rules and Q&A responses.

But I still stand by my statement that I don't care when motors were manufactured or whether they were used on a previous robot. They're all the same. PARTS is PARTS (emphasis on the BOLD lettering to coincide with Section 8 syntax).

The reason why MECHANISMS aren't allowed to be re-used is to enourage teams to design and fabricate entirely new robots every year. But even in that case, how can I reasonably expect the inspectors to know what was developed for 2006, 2007 and 2008 for YOUR robot and therefore cannot be used in 2009? That's an impossible request BUT we should rely on the GP of teams to comply with that rule. Inspectors cannot test every rule.

Russ

Re: Sorry--clarification on the rules about motors?
 

In regards to the 2008 Q&A response regarding replacement CIMs, I've always interpreted the rule to essentially stipulate that you are officially permitted to replace broken parts from the kit. It would be a shame if you broke ANYTHING in your kit and were not allowed to replace it (for "free" when accounting on the BoM).

In the case of 2 extra CIMs for a total of 4 on the robot, any "new" CIMs that are obtained and used are obviously NOT for damaged/missing motors but are additions to the 2 from the KoP. I don't care how you get them as long as they have the same P/N. They do, however, need to be included in your BoM cost with the current retail price and no reduction for age.

Russ

Re: Sorry--clarification on the rules about motors?
 

I would note that the rules are essentially the same as 2008 rules <R58> and <R59>. Was this ever an issue before?

Re: Sorry--clarification on the rules about motors?
 

Kevin,
I was basing my opinion on this,
<R50>
Motors from previous robots shall not be used in addition to those provided in the 2009 Kit Of Parts. They may be used as direct one-to-one SPARE PARTS for those provided if the provided part fails or is damaged. They can only be used if they are identical to the part being replaced.

As Russ has pointed out there is no way for inspectors to know when or where you obtained your motors. I have always seen this rule as one of those rules that gives the competition a virtual real world constraint. The same is true of components or mechanisms used on a previous year's robot. How would I as an inspector know or be able to identify such an item. This is where GP comes into play. I expect that a robot team has followed GP in the design and construction of their robot because GP demands that I do. Pretty simple, straight forward, and perhaps a little naive, but that is the way we operate. Inspectors are here to attempt to level the playing a field a little but we are really present to make sure you are ready to play. We will go out of our way to make sure you are ready by getting you help, pointing out where you robot could be improved or where it might need to be brought up to standard. Above all, we want your team and the other spectators to be safe, have a great experience and do your best. Inspectors are not present to prevent you from playing, they/we want you to play and play well. You might be our alliance partner someday.
BTW, you guys had a great robot last year and a memorable team. Keep it up!

Re: Sorry--clarification on the rules about motors?
 

After Eric pointed out the rule I missed I agreed with your interpretation Al, based on the letter of the rule.

The GDC has clarified and CIMs used in previous years are legal provided they have the correct part number

Re: Sorry--clarification on the rules about motors?
 

Official response found on the US First forums:

FRC2175
As written <R50> would appear to limit using 2.5" CIM motors used on previous robots to being used for spares only.

Can CIM motors, up to 2, (with the correct PN as specified by R51) be retrieved from previous competition robots and used on a 2009 robot provided that the total number of CIM motors used on the robot is 4 or less?

01-22-2009, 07:25 PM
GDC
Game Design Committee
Default Re: <R50> and previous years CIMs
If the CIM motors scavenged from a previous-year ROBOT are of the identical part number, identical configuration, unaltered, unmodified, and still in "out of the box" condition, then they may be used as the 1 or 2 additional CIM motors permitted under Rule <R51>.