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-   -   Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72919)

Dantvman27 25-01-2009 14:56

Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 


What The 2009 Astro-Machine might look like

NorviewsVeteran 25-01-2009 15:00

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Right now it doesn't look like much of a queue to the shooter. Not many chances to make it into the trailer.

Dantvman27 25-01-2009 15:02

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
It's only a model, don't worry

bixbyrobotics1 26-01-2009 19:34

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
What is that turntable?
We are looking everywhere for ideas and cannot find any...

IndySam 26-01-2009 19:40

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bixbyrobotics1 (Post 808472)
What is that turntable?
We are looking everywhere for ideas and cannot find any...

Check McMaster


http://www.mcmaster.com/#18635a52/=c093o

Lesman 26-01-2009 23:10

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dantvman27 (Post 807752)
It's only a model

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGAYk5VWkTw

R.C. 26-01-2009 23:46

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
We are doing about the same thing but we have a hopper and feeder system integrated together with a turret on top.

b williams 27-01-2009 08:01

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
How are you planning on getting the balls up to the top so the turret can shoot them?

AB755 27-01-2009 08:34

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
The build season seems to be taking a toll on the students. They have all aged quite a bit. :)

qwertyuiop[]\ 27-01-2009 08:40

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
this is pretty funny because it is the inverse of our robot. we have our collector at the top and our pneumatic turret on the bottom.

Pjohn1959 27-01-2009 11:40

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AB755 (Post 808785)
The build season seems to be taking a toll on the students. They have all aged quite a bit. :)

That's great. ( I almost fell off my chair)

I think that has happened to a lot of teams...:rolleyes:

teampronto 28-01-2009 01:20

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Not to diss any teams, but I don't really like seeing only mentors working on a robot. I've heard that's how it is a lot with the good teams, but it makes me sad:(

R.C. 28-01-2009 01:27

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by teampronto (Post 809494)
Not to diss any teams, but I don't really like seeing only mentors working on a robot. I've heard that's how it is a lot with the good teams, but it makes me sad:(

Sorry homeslice, but teams can be 90% mentor run if they want to be. FIRST is about working with the engineers and if kids get inspired by that then thatz great. No one for sure knows if their (ELITE TEAMS) bots are mentor built and this idea has been discussed over various threads. Lets not start that here. We are fully student run, so yeah. But we still have help from our engineers. The point is that Mentor built or mostly mentor built bots are ok IF THEY INSPIRE STUDENTS TO WORK HARDER OR IF THEY LEARN MORE.

-RC

teampronto 28-01-2009 01:47

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Yeah. I get what you are saying. It just seems like it would kinda ruin the point of a competition. I get that FIRST is about the inspiring and the learning, but really.. It can also bring down the hopes a spirit of other kids who ARE doing most of the work on their bots. Just my 2.

R.C. 28-01-2009 01:59

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by teampronto (Post 809504)
Yeah. I get what you are saying. It just seems like it would kinda ruin the point of a competition. I get that FIRST is about the inspiring and the learning, but really.. It can also bring down the hopes a spirit of other kids who ARE doing most of the work on their bots. Just my 2.

Your not alone with that, when I started FIRST in 2006; I felt the same way. Why do Poofs, RAWC, Pink, Beachbots do so good and kick our butts. They are so mentor built. WRONG OR RIGHT. They have a great offseason, great mentors to help create fantastic bots. I at first did think that they cheated and now I have come to accept the fact that those teams just rock. Itz kinda like sports, Yankees have enough money to buy the best players and the best equipment. But don't u want to beat those teams ever? What fun would it be if everyone was equally matched. I would like to take time and thank all the 6+ year veterans for making this competition so awesome and for creating killer miller bots. I really don't care if a group of engineers build a bot or students, I just wanna learn and have great build and offseason. Also I want to give back to the FIRST Community as much as I can.

2.75 Weeks left have fun teams,
Good Luck

-RC

Justin Montois 28-01-2009 02:18

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by teampronto (Post 809494)
Not to diss any teams, but I don't really like seeing only mentors working on a robot. I've heard that's how it is a lot with the good teams, but it makes me sad:(

All I'm going to say is be careful. This has been discussed at great length many times on this site and turning another thread into a Mentor Built V. Student built debate thread is highly unpopular.

If you want to join in on that discussion please refer to some of these threads..

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=66536
^^Most Recent

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=40514

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=60094

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=45496

^^Older for reference

R.C. 28-01-2009 02:21

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 340x4xLife (Post 809514)
All I'm going to say is be careful. This has been discussed at great length many times on this site and turning another thread into a Mentor Built V. Student built debate thread is highly unpopular.

If you want to join in on that discussion please refer to some of these threads..

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=40514

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=60094

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=45496

Thanks for the links, I was trying to stay away from a debate. I know how those go;)

Justin Montois 28-01-2009 02:24

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rc_cola1323 (Post 809515)
Thanks for the links, I was trying to stay away from a debate. I know how those go;)

No problem, I don't want this thread hijacked like many many others have been :)

jsasaki 28-01-2009 03:18

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
lets hope nothing but the rover wheels touch the floor haha:D

GaryVoshol 28-01-2009 06:39

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
And how do we know those old guys(*) standing around with hands in their pockets aren't just thinking, "Man, I'm so inspired by what those kids can do!"

(*) I resemble that remark. :rolleyes:

teampronto 28-01-2009 13:42

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
OK people. Didn't want to get into this debate. Let's end it here. rc_cola1323 made an excellent point a few posts back. Thanks:)

Dantvman27 28-01-2009 16:10

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Wow... **face palm** ok well i didnt even relise it when i posted this picture but our robot has been student designed and student built! The mentors just happen to be the ones in the picture wow look at the can of worms i opened up


Team 241 takes prides in that the mentors teach and the students design build and drive

nahstobor 28-01-2009 16:15

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Is it just me or do some robots seem like they are playing Aim High? Just messing 241 the design looks great and simple. I feel like teams who can perfect the turreted shooter will have a big advantage this year.

MCahoon 28-01-2009 16:26

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Realize that this is a prototype, but it seems like the center of mass is pretty far back - given the motors/electronics/etc are mounted behind the axis between the rear wheels. Is there something under the rear of the robot to ensure it doesn't tip back? Also, is the rear of the frame indicative of the shape the competition robot will have (thinking of bumper rules and external corners).

I like the simplicity of the straight up and in ball feed path. Nice job of prototyping. Seems like I've seen a lot of wood on prototypes this year - including our own. :rolleyes:

Dantvman27 28-01-2009 16:28

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
There is a rear fifth wheel that only will contact the ground if it begins to tip, and it litterally is one prototype sitting on top of another, so they arnt exactly lined up, the final works like a beauty

jimbot 28-01-2009 18:02

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Picture! Picture! Picture!

Can your turret hit a moving target reliably? That was our worry with the turret design.

NorviewsVeteran 28-01-2009 20:19

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dantvman27 (Post 809853)
Wow... **face palm** ok well i didnt even relise it when i posted this picture but our robot has been student designed and student built! The mentors just happen to be the ones in the picture wow look at the can of worms i opened up


At least the worms had valid points.

wsansewjs 28-01-2009 20:43

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rc_cola1323 (Post 809507)
Your not alone with that, when I started FIRST in 2006; I felt the same way. Why do Poofs, RAWC, Pink, Beachbots do so good and kick our butts. They are so mentor built. WRONG OR RIGHT. They have a great offseason, great mentors to help create fantastic bots. I at first did think that they cheated and now I have come to accept the fact that those teams just rock. Itz kinda like sports, Yankees have enough money to buy the best players and the best equipment. But don't u want to beat those teams ever? What fun would it be if everyone was equally matched. I would like to take time and thank all the 6+ year veterans for making this competition so awesome and for creating killer miller bots. I really don't care if a group of engineers build a bot or students, I just wanna learn and have great build and offseason. Also I want to give back to the FIRST Community as much as I can.

2.75 Weeks left have fun teams,
Good Luck

-RC

This needs to go into the Spotlight List. Right on the dime.

-Josh S.

FIXIT 28-01-2009 21:18

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by teampronto (Post 809494)
Not to diss any teams, but I don't really like seeing only mentors working on a robot. I've heard that's how it is a lot with the good teams, but it makes me sad:(

The sophistication of some of the robots I’ve seen in the past is simply amazing. It’s hard to believe that students have the skill sets needed to design, manufacture, assemble, test, and program a robot in just six weeks and be a national contender. I’m not saying it is impossible, sometimes a well thought out and simple design with great team work is all you need. The way I see it, the students should build the robot and the engineers (mentors) tweak it during the process. Unfortunately, FIRST is a competition and some teams lose sight of the value FIRST offers to teach the next generation of technicians!

Dantvman27 29-01-2009 18:06

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jimbot (Post 809929)
Picture! Picture! Picture!

Can your turret hit a moving target reliably? That was our worry with the turret design.

The cannons distance and accuracy were was perfectly consistent. We trust that our programming will make a fairly strong targeting system

synth3tk 30-01-2009 12:01

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
The reason we sort of stood away from a turret design was because of accuracy, but it seems a lot of teams have overcame that challenge, and will probably be some of the better competition this season.

Kudos to those who can master the turrets!

Sean Raia 30-01-2009 13:18

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by qwertyuiop[]\ (Post 808787)
this is pretty funny because it is the inverse of our robot. we have our collector at the top and our pneumatic turret on the bottom.

So im guessing your strategy is to catch balls at the top and deliver them to the humans?

Quote:

Originally Posted by synth3tk (Post 810970)
The reason we sort of stood away from a turret design was because of accuracy, but it seems a lot of teams have overcame that challenge, and will probably be some of the better competition this season.

Kudos to those who can master the turrets!

Yea the turrets all look good right now, wait till they get rammed a bit, slide around the field at high speeds and get a broken moon rock or two wedged in the turret. THEN we will see why dumpers prevail over turrets.

Dantvman27 30-01-2009 15:00

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean Raia (Post 811006)
So im guessing your strategy is to catch balls at the top and deliver them to the humans?



Yea the turrets all look good right now, wait till they get rammed a bit, slide around the field at high speeds and get a broken moon rock or two wedged in the turret. THEN we will see why dumpers prevail over turrets.


Lol, we do not fear broken moon rocks

EricH 30-01-2009 15:19

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sean Raia (Post 811006)
Yea the turrets all look good right now, wait till they get rammed a bit, slide around the field at high speeds and get a broken moon rock or two wedged in the turret. THEN we will see why dumpers prevail over turrets.

I'd like to introduce you to teams 33, 233, 217, 25, and I'm sure there are many more. Specifically, their 2006 robots. 217 had a turret, as did 25. They were the 2006 World Champion and World Finalist, respectively. The others finished lower down, say, division finalist to 217. Are there any questions? I'm sure they could easily handle damaged game objects, too.

Vikesrock 30-01-2009 15:27

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Our shooting mechanism is not quite finished yet, but it seems to me that the Orbit balls with 1 or 2 bands broken still provide enough resistance to compression to allow them to be expelled from these types of shooters. They certainly won't go where they are supposed to, but I don't think they will jam up as easily as you seem to think they will.

Flying Coyote 08-02-2009 17:19

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Excellent work team 241! Good luck to you during your competition. We have a similar concept (team 2594). Visit our posts: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...highlight=2594

8 days left! :ahh:

Elgin Clock 08-02-2009 17:22

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by teampronto (Post 809494)
Not to diss any teams, but I don't really like seeing only mentors working on a robot. I've heard that's how it is a lot with the good teams, but it makes me sad:(

If standing around with their hands in their pockets or arms crossed is your definition of seeing mentors working, I hope you start your own company one day & I can get paid to do that very same thing there!! ;)

synth3tk 08-02-2009 18:04

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by teampronto (Post 809494)
Not to diss any teams, but I don't really like seeing only mentors working on a robot. I've heard that's how it is a lot with the good teams, but it makes me sad:(

Not to hi-jack this thread, but our mentors do a good amount of work on the robot, and we are nowhere near a "good team", by any stretch of the imagination. But the students still do most of the work, and just about 90% of the design/prototyping. They've learned how to work on a team, how to use power tools, etc.

It can be frustrating to watch a robot that "seems" like it completely built by mentors totally dominate your "dinky" student-built bot, but it makes the next build season that much more interesting. The important thing in FIRST, is what the students come out with, not the by-products of that goal.

And I would love to work at that company also, Elgin! ;)

R.C. 08-02-2009 20:26

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by synth3tk (Post 816729)
And I would love to work at that company also, Elgin! ;)

I own it, itz called RC COLA CORPS. Anyone want to join?

boomergeek 08-02-2009 22:53

Re: Team 241's Turret Prototype ontop of the Harvester Prototype
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Elgin Clock (Post 816693)
If standing around with their hands in their pockets or arms crossed is your definition of seeing mentors working, I hope you start your own company one day & I can get paid to do that very same thing there!! ;)

As the first year mentor with his hand in his pocket, I can attest to huge contribution that students, mentors/teachers, sponsors and parents make to this team. Like most teams, the technical skill of our students and our mentors varies greatly. I'm learning from students in some areas and providing consultation in others. I'm very pleasantly surprised how much this robotics team reminds me of an extremely young professional engineering team: very chaotic with lots of informal training and brainstorming sessions to solve the inevitable problems that creep in. Actually, I was surprised that getting the robot built is really a minority of the problems needed to be worked out. This is about 40 person team (with close to 35 being students) finding their niche to make a contribution with the primary goal of inspiring students to solve problems for themselves. We have about 6-8 sub-teams and project management run by students.
Do mentors/teachers consult and have influence ?
Sure:
1) Nurturing parental and sponsor relationships
2) Teaching students technology and engineering: encourage:
a) safety, safety, safety
b) thinking about making it simpler, stronger, lighter and more reliable-
c) finishing it sooner, rather than later: a finished imperfect but workable alpha solution in the can, makes working on a potential beta a lot less stressful.
d) Use of math and physics
e) looking it up in reference material (including Chief Delphi!)
f) learning from failures as well as successes
g) not leaving a mess!

(For some reason, some teenage students sometimes don't think about these things)

BTW, I'm a telecommunications engineer by profession and I've never been part of a robotics team before.

Check out our web site at www.team241.org.


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