Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

An interesting idea that I was thinking about the other day:

Assuming that FIRST has extra fields available, and assuming (yes, I know what happens when you assume...) that they could make some room in the convention center pit area for those extra fields (fields ONLY, not bleachers or anything), how about this: each division has a 2nd field in the pit area. Broadcast video of each division's pit field to the screen at the division's main field. Run a match on the main field, then while that's being reset, run a match on the pit field. Audience watches remotely from the dome. Set up the schedule so that each team alternates between the main field and the pit field. This helps address the concern of more matches causing issues with the round-trip-time to the dome, as every other match would be a much shorter walk from the team's pit.

While it would be suboptimal watching half our matches over a video feed rather than in person, you'd presumably still get just as many matches in the Dome as you do now, so the "remote" matches would basically just be an added bonus.

As a variation on the above idea, use the same idea but run the remote matches on the pit practice field starting mid afternoon on Friday (or even just on Saturday). This way no extra fields are required (though the practice fields would need all the electronics and gear that they don't otherwise have) and very little extra space would be needed. I'd be willing to sacrifice practice field availability after Friday morning to get more matches in...

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

Some of you need to think of the WPI protection. Every field generates a code for each robot it sees, unless you can sync the fields or change the codes between matches, you will have a problem. I am waiting to hear how it turns out for the teams on Einstein.

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

For anyone that has participated or worked the FTC field at Championship, this will seem somewhat obvious... Space is not the major driver for keeping the fields separated. The space is not acoustically configured to place fields such close proximity to support more fields. In other words, The 4 divisions provide decent air insolation to keep the noise of the other divisions to a minimum. Add that third field on each side and you get a lot of noise bleeding across. On FTC we have a number of issues because of the loud FRC divisions on each side (not faulting that, I'm just saying). Einstien doesn't have that issue because the divisions are then silent.

Another issue I'd like to raise is that if you did 8 division of say 60 (I saw this in another post), The finals would be very hard to view for a large number of people. I've, at times, been with teams that are in the last division to finish and end up almost on the ends of the dome with very bad angles to see the fields. Adding more teams would make it even harder.

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

However, this gives teams less cool down in between matches. Which means it's harder for a team to make any needed repairs and still get to their match on time. So they have to choose between trying to get something repaired, and showing up at their next match. It also provides an extra drain on batteries for any team that uses batteries heavily. I know my team (1771) burns through a battery a match, and with the increased turnaround time, we would run out before the day was through.

And fans don't like not being able to watch their teams, even if they see the same amount in the dome. They'll also see the bunch that isn't on the field, and be upset about that (at least some will).

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

They already change the WPA encryption on the field between matches. The part that would probably need some real work would be updating the division match results database from two different fields.

I suspect that a field breakdown could do some serious schedule scrambling.

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

Having two fields per division would effectively have the same effect on the number of matches as cutting the division size in half (but without losing the depth of team diversity). Right now there are 87 teams in each division, and adding a second field onto each would increase the number of playable matches from 7-8 (as it has been in previous years) to probably around 10-12 matches.

There are a lot of smaller regionals who run 12 match qualifications without problems, and as long as you have at least four battery chargers it's easy to keep up with changing a battery every match. I'd very much be in favor of having two fields per division, with the second field in the pits. It would be like the days of Epcot all over again. ;)

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

I too loved the way the Epcot fields were setup. However, being a realist the combination of almost 400 FRC teams coupled with the FTC and FLL Festival teams really cuts your options as far as facilities able to handle the influx of people/equipment.

By the time teams get to Atlanta it's going to come down to experience and most of all, even though we don't want to admit it - luck. That's just the way it is.

As far as being able to run 12 matches in qualifying, there were NO regionals this year that ran 12. Here's some interesting figures from the LI Regional Thread.

Venue Matches each x Teams = Good Crew Number
LV 9 48 432
Colorado 7 48 336
Seattle 7 64 448 !!
Sac 9 44 396
Haw 11 34 374
Toronto 8 59 472
Palm 9 44 396
Long Is 11 46 506 Wow
Tex 7 63 441
Boil 11 35 380
Chesap 7 55 385
Sil Val 8 47 376
Portland 7 54 378

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

You are correct, no regional did 12 matches. That doesn't mean the district events didn't.:D

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

Good point! I see some of the district events with almost 40 teams doing 12 matches. Very Impressive!

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

I don't think the issue here is having two fields. The issue is needing 2x the volunteers for each field (a total of four times as many volunteers for the entire event). There's just no possible way you're going to find that many qualified, competent people.

Re: How about eight divisions on four fields
 

Cory makes an excelent point. however, it should be noted that the Field Reset/Queing possisions are usually hot pickings on the Volunteer list. (unlike saftey glass advisor). I signed up for Queing/Field Reset, and was assigned as needed. Most likely i will end up helping the NASA crew with the webcast/archive.

I think 6 fields can be done, (this includes getting volunteers for these six fields) using the practice fields as playing fields starting friday afternoon...

ie: the practice field that Galileo and Newton would share would go something like this

1:03pm Galileo QM 29
1:09pm Newton QM 30
1:15pm Galileo QM 32
1:21pm Newton QM 33

where Galileo Field in GA dome runs 2x as many matches as the split field in the pits

1:00pm Galileo QM 28 (GA Dome)
1:03pm Galileo QM 29 (Pits)
1:06pm Galileo QM 30 (GA Dome)
1:12pm Galileo QM 31 (GA Dome)
1:15pm Galileo QM 32 (Pits)
1:18pm Galileo QM 33 (GA Dome)
1:24pm Galileo QM 34 (GA Dome) ... etc.

the only issues with this would be the robot WAP Key's and the Scoring software. I think if it could be done, it woudl be worth it