Next Year's Game?
 

Now that Atlanta is over, it is time once again to start the rumors and ideas for next year's game. What are your ideas?

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

i want to see stairs! :D

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Less human player...

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...more cowbell!


I would expect a game with unique flooring a la this year's FRC and FTC offerings.

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i would love to see them bring back the pull up bar.

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What I would like to see in next years game:

- non spherical game pieces
- human players having less impact on the game
- robot oriented end game task, preferably as exciting, difficult, and as significant as 2004's end game was
- no rules discouraging doing well
- no more game themes (like they had this year)

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Before Kickoff, some people on my team were talking about an underwater game (probably because one of the clues was a fish).
*shrugs*
Personally, I am looking for a game with a simple concept, but a challenging task.

Can't wait for next year!

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Human players threw the game this year for most teams, except for those with amazing robots (dumpers such as the winning alliance had), so next year I'd like to see something that relies a bit more on the robot itself. People said driving around would be tough this year as well, and it didn't seem like many teams had an advantage over another, aside from being good at pinning, or the "Bump and Dump", as some called it :p Also, from what I've seen, spectators get bored by Lunacy, and find it hard to follow.

So overall

Less reliability on human player

More reliability on robot itself

Incorporation of something into the game that makes one element of the robot able to swing the game, instead of the HP**

Make the game easier to follow, and more exciting for spectators

Make the game more interesting and challenging for veteran teams*

*I've seen rookie teams, especially at week one regionals, who have a robot in shambles of wire, wheels, and aluminum, while vet teams had a fully functional bot, but looking at the rookie teams at the championships, they were right up there with the oldest vets, who were sorta disappointed with this years game.

**This year was a year where the HP really stood out in the game, and could easily throw it, depending on the alliance and team itself. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but veteran teams weren't impressed.

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i'd like to see more robot interaction like we had in 07 and 09 especially between alliance members. im also kinda expecing them to try to level out the playing fiel like they did this year with the wheels and floor.

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I want a barrier in the middle of the field that presents a challenge in crossing, yet crossing it provides a significant game benefit. Say a 12" wall separating the two halves of the field.

I liked that Lunacy took veteran teams outside of their comfort zone. Too often in years prior the veterans would take their drive base down off the shelf and not have to think about it. Even in 2004 when there were steps, many teams really had no problems if they couldn't climb them.

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i think they should do something with less human playering would be nice a bar would be nice and maybe something were a couple team s might make a robot with a drive train similiar to the cajuan crawler i think that would be awesome

and i would like some defense would be nice they added it again this year but not that many teams saw it as important an di think if either of those alliances had soem D they coulda taken out the best scorers on thier opposing alliance in the finals

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Go the opposite direction with the flooring....VELCRO!

If the bond is strong enough it will provide an equally slow and boring game as the majority of Lunacy matches provided. Although I sense the scrapping of a few CIMs in the process of driving:D

I also think they need to bring back the big ending. Weighed appropriately to the rest of the possible points. Something that not everyone can do but at the same time does not require a substantial weight requirement to accomplish (i.e 2007s "Rampbots" ). I am thinking more like 2003, king of the hill--it was a fight to keep position and some teams specialized at this task with suction and brakes-- and 2004, the chin-up bar--limited positions on the bar, not every robot specialized at the task, but still did not req. large weight cache to be set aside for it either.

The 2006 bonus was alright, it did not require specialization but it was also no contest when getting up to the top of the ramp, they were on opposite ends of the field. the only challenge was getting 3 on 1 ramp.

Basically I think if they do include an endgame it should:

-limit the space to five, this creates competition for space and provides an advantage to the alliance who gets there more efficiently.

-Make it simple enough for rookies to complete/accomplish while also making it challenging.

enough rant, an idea popped up.

Playing off of 2004, you take the bar and you literally raise it, at the beginning of the match is starts at 5', until you hit the 1:30 mark then it starts to rise at a constant speed up to the 10' height at the 1:00 mark, continuing up to 15' with :30 left in the game. You would have to weigh what you can do on the floor against what you can do if you hang and at what point you would have to cut bait and leave.

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I'd like to see a return of the triangle, it's been 5 years since Triple Play.

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A more 3-D field. 2004 with the chin-up bar and the steps was cool. Even if we just had a grid of 2x4's across the middle 10 feet of the field it would force teams to develop a way of crossing no man's land. (Walker bots anyone?)

A reason to change robot orientation (I mean similar to flop bots but on command instead of only once)

No More Bumpers

CAN utilization on the Jaguars.

No more penalization for excellence.

Multiple game pieces. ex, Red alliance has to score tetras, Blue Alliance has to score Bins. Green Alliance has to score soccer balls. Force teams to come up with multiple manipulators in a year or a very general purpose one.

Three 2 team alliances. We seem stuck on 2 teams, mix it up a little. This won't change the number of matches at all for eliminations, just instead of 8 alliances we have 12 but only 1 pick each. (Serpentine debate ENDED!)

A game piece that is readily available and not too expensive.

No more exotic flooring, stick with carpet, most teams already have carpet to practice on.

Less reliance on a single supplier to provide the wheels.

Breakout boards for the CRIO that don't look like they will explode if a dog sneezes.

Driver stations that are reliable.

No judgment calls for refs or inspectors. (G22 was, in my opinion, up to the discretion of the refs entirely)

No more attempts at "leveling the playing field"

More support for struggling veteran teams instead of the constant mantra of "Start new teams" we need one of "Support the existing base"

I might come up with more later but for now I would say I have a short list :)

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i think going off that i dea though you would also have to have diff point values for when you got on the bar or instead of making it raise up do a three level bar like the goals in '06 have two low ones 8"-10" and one high one like 12"-15" and off corse the higher would be owrth more points but could only fit 1 robot and teh two lower ones could both fit two

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Thats a different thing, but put on with a lot of help from a FIRST team. I'll be there, give it a try if you can! June 12-14 in Phoenix.


Next year's game? hmmm...it would be nice to have non-spherical game pieces, but having them move fast is also nice for the spectators, so round might be the best way to go because it's so easy to make balls fly.

It's tough to make a non-flat playing surface that a kit bot will be effective on.

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Dave Lavery came by the 234 pit and signed an a mock up of the trailer that will be auctioned off at the IRI. He put his name and "See you on Mars."

Could FIRST be having a new regional or is this the first teaser for 2010...

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I think FIRST needs to start using non-spherical game pieces. A couple years back they had a non-level playing field and that was challenging. My favorite would be an underwater challenge; as cool as that would be, I doubt it could happen for 2010, but would probably be the most exciting!!!

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How about the possibility of a non-uniform rough surface, rocks (small ramps with velcro on the bottom) that are randomized before the match representing the possibility of different landing sites. I know it's themed but it has potential.:rolleyes:

Would the Aquarium be used for the Championship.

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Actually, yes, 2010 will have the first Martian Regional, it will be co-sponsored by NASA and the ESA and be held at Olympus Mons. Registration for this new regional will open with the rest of the events. Due to long commutes however teams will be unable to compete in other events next year should they attend this event. Also, volunteer registration is being handled differently for this event, it is already open and waiting for volunteers.


By the way, I apologize for this but I figured I could have some fun with my 500th post :)

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They'll run awfully behind schedule, as the the volunteers won't show up for another 2 years!

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FIRST is so crazy about safety, so I can guarantee that the game will not involve water. If a robot happened to break, then that would be a huge safety hazard. Water can destroy a bot and that is not what FIRST wants.

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OK- we do this every year....

what I want to see is a game that involves the following

1. greater use of sensors in robot function
2.manipulating an object and placing it horizontally through a hole- maybe blindly
3.the ability for robot interaction to change score
4.no penalties for high scoring performance
5.the ability for robots to descore others
6.few restrictions on robot design- unlike this year's dance of the refrigerators

for a game piece- CLOWNS- there I said it again......


(search out "Send in the Clowns" for a game we came up with years ago)

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BATTLE BOTTS!!!! LOL i know its against Gracious Professionalism but in light of the War in the middle east, i think we need robots with flamethrowers and chainsaws to replace the men on the front line!

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For the past few years, it has been a flat terrain. I think the game is going to be all about climbing over or going under obstacles.

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yeah, I mean, who ever heard of a flat crater? they're supposed to be curved up at the edges

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I would love to see the return of the Autonomous Bonus. After all, we are building Robots, Robots that can be operated as a Robotic system.

I would also like to see an end of game task with a bonus as well.

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I want a game piece that is readily available and interesting - how about a nerf (or other readily available foam) football?

As for terrain, I'd like something that is visually impressive to conquor. "Ice" didn't really do it for me. Maybe "logs" or "debris"? A grid of 2x4's could make for some interesting drive trains, especially if they were of varying heights.

EDIT - In response to Mr Bill - how about optional autonomous? You choose how long your robot is in autonomous (up to the entire match), and accumulate bonus points (somehow) for it. Maybe we bring back the pressure pads and have the drivers stand on them to be in autonomous.

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I agree, extra autonomous points would be handy. Or just something that trigger something early in the game like in 2004(FIRST Frenzy).

I would also agree that seeing a more 3-D playing field would be good. Less just moving around, and more having to get up and over stuff.

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A game that...

...doesn't involve containing a surplus of small gamepieces within the robot. This is just so we avoid refridgerator robots.

...requires a single, simple robot function that relies more on strategy and driver skill than robot design (2005 and 2007).

...has a balance in points earned in autonomous, teleop, and end game (2008)

...has ever-changing optimal scoring opportunities (2005, 2007).

...has game peices that teams can easily make themselves (2005).

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I feel that FIRST should return to carpet being the main floor. It reduces cost for teams in making practice fields and for FIRST in making the competition fields. The game needs to be much more spectator friendly, being able to tell what is happening on a basic level for people who aren't in FIRST. I agree on the less restrictions, this year the robots were forced into a limited number of configurations. It would be nice to see the return of size and weight classes like in 2006 Aim High. Human players should not be able to win a match for a robot that can't score, and be the majority of offense in the match. Maybe have one robot have a secondary goal attached such as the trailer per alliance while also having main goals in the field. Have a recyclable scoring piece, too often was the action limited or stopped due to a lack of orbit balls on the field. Autonomous mode having a task to give a team a greater advantage at the beginning of match such as 2004. Have three scoring type pieces, one being a sphere (ex 2006) as the main piece but worth the least. Have a square like piece that is limited and gives more points or some sort of bonus. The third piece being a triangle like shape that would behave similarly as the square piece scoring wise. The sphere being recyclable throughout the match and the other two pieces being limited in quantity and possibly time at which they can be played. Keep the penalties to a minimum and they should not throw the match heavy in either direction. Have goals accessible by navigating over a different type of terrain for each different goal. An example of this would be a hole above the player station at each end, a ramp or pull up bar used to bring the robot up to score the other piece and at each corner a place for the third game piece. Also please lets have a cheap and easily accessible set of game pieces, my vote Nerf balls!:D

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Optional bumpers. Please.

Failing that, I'll take bumper rules that are crystal clear from Kickoff.

The readily available game piece is a great idea. Could that return?

Oh, and could the GDC keep Dave, Aidan, and Bill from dropping hints for a year?

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Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Nah, those are old hints and don't count. Amethyst was 2005, banana and clownfish are standard Dave gags from year to year (Havabanana Productions does the game animation each year...)

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Yay I'm not the only one who found the 15 point Super Cells to be too much power for the human players. I would love to see more originality. This years game had very few ways to do things well it was either Archimedes' Screw or a step up with bands of some sort there were far too many robots with a design that I had seen before.

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I would like to see:

-3 Alliances, 2V2V2. It would make things more interesting and different.

-Some kind of an hazard in the center or staggered around the field.

-Autonomous points please, something that will let us be real creative with auto. mode.

-No more balls, no more tubs, nothing round...... maybe bins again? It's been a while since we have had bins.

-Rules that wont limit how we can build.

-Something that is really fun to watch from the stands.

-Or maybe a combo for a few games like; In Auto mode you can take a stack of bins (already loaded) to an area of field , then drop them (while still being stacked). One robot has a trailer attached to it while another robot has to stack bins on it. The other alliance and knock/remove the bins from the trailer. Then for bonus points at the end the robot with the trailer must climb a steep incline and park the robot on top.

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I knew about the banana and the clownfish. The amethyst was the one I was missing, that was a bit before my time.

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They wouldn't ever do an underwater game just because of where would you do it? Most regionals are played in high school or college gyms that wouldn't be able to hold up the massive amount of weight of a pool. Plus think of the cost of that much water and then what would you do with it?

It's easier just to stick to the ground.

I love the idea of uneven game fields. Ramps, holes, whatever. It really adds complexity to the game if lets say you have carry a large game piece around to score.

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Would be nice to see some more autonomous oriented challenges, as well as less impact from the human players....

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I like the Ideas of a feild that gets randomly changed for each match and the 2v2v2(even though this would make getting stuck with partners that are unmoving or break harder on the teams aligned with them).

My biggest wish is that autonomous scoring means something. I realy liked seeing bots that scored in auto even if they missed half and i think the should have been rewarded for that rather then get the same that they would have in tele.

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2v2v2 would probably result in 4v2.

A little story that has been told before:

In 1998 (the last year of 1v1v1), there was an interesting occurrence. Top seeds on Friday didn't make it into the elimination rounds. None of them. FIRST started examining the matches and noted that the two lower-seeded teams were ganging up on the higher seed and causing them to lose. This could not be shown to be intentional, by the way, but was what was observed. 2v1 sound fair? (Well, unless you get 67 or 71 or 217 as the 1, but even then...)

So in 1999, the announcement was made that since collusion could not be prevented, it would be required. Meet the alliance system!

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How about auto at the end of tele-op? That would make a different challenge, and it can have a strong auton/endgame in one.

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I'd like to see a bonus worth quite a bit (30-50 points) in the form of some object that can be possessed by a team throughout the match, and that would be awarded to the alliance possessing the object at the end. To balance the score, a team holding the object could be unable to score points for the main objective. This could allow for a Capture the Flag element for the game.
It would also force teams to choose whether to design their robot to score, hold the bonus, or both, and strategize about when to stop scoring and grab the bonus.

Also, return to the auto-bonus, end to convoluted bumper rules, and a carpeted surface please.

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Neat idea, but I think it would result in an anti-climatic ending for a lot of matches. The last few years have all had end-game bonuses that sometimes require desperate maneuvers from the drivers, and it makes for exciting endings.


For next year's game, I really want to see something other than a flat field. It's been too long since the last time we had field elements to climb on.

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The Championship may be over, but we still have several months left for offseasons- it's not over yet! However, if we're going to start thinking about next year so early on, I'll throw in what I'd like to see. I generally like games where strategy is very important to gameplay. I'd also like to see some task or game bonus that is very difficult to complete and carries a very high value or multiplier.

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I think there should be moveable obstacles, like if they did it this year, it would be a fake boulder and you could move it to slow others down. I liked the moving goals, but what if they made it where there the entire goal would be movable, like you could move it to your teams side for sight advantage, or play keep-away. not like lunacy, but make a part in the kit where you can quickly attach or release, or make your own. We could do a terrain event if there where more advanced chassis parts.
An obstacle course would be cool. and you have to move varying weights to your teams goal area. Make some surfaces rotate and others slick others move in one direction (conveyor belt). maybe a beginning and end autonomous. Beginning, get to a goal area for points, end get to your starting area. Light playing objects are too easy, Round is too easy, but the effect of a ball able to roll everywhere is nice. Maybe a ball bearing surface on the objects, like a mouse wheel, except a lot more.

A year where wheel's are not allowed!!!!!!!
Like legs, hovercrafts, etc.

No more constrained to bumper space, arms make it more fun.

Lunacy was too boring. Overdrive was awesome, you could really get into it and the game was usually a very close score.

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One of our coaches thinks that this past year was jsut camera practice and that this coming year is gonna NEED the camera to perform the task.

Personally, I dont have any preferences of what I think should be done, but it should be something that makes people think not just outside the box, but outside the box that the original box is in.

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A few things:

-You should be able to win the match by preforming perfectly (with the robot alone) in the bonus. Im a real fan of the 2007 bonus. Getting two bots on top of another was great. If you pulled it and got those 60 points the game was pretty much over.

-Human player fouls should never cost the robot and alliance partners the match. On more then one occasion, including with us, I saw human players get penalties for small things like putting the tips of your fingers across the appropriate plane that cost the entire alliance the match. Im not sure of the solution but it needs to change. Maybe asking teams to have several human players ready and having teams switch when one commits a penalty.

-I loved the defensive aspect of Lunacy. Truly you should be rewarded for creating a great and powerful drive trains. There should never be a hitting penalty and always have bumper rules.

There are lots of things that they can do. I don't want to suggest specific pieces for the GDC to make but I hope they can follow these basic concepts.

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i would like to see:

• jaguars with CAN enabled
• no more "mandatory" wheels
• return of the giant CIM/gen 2 gearboxes/more than 4 cims allowed- let battery life limit teams, not rules
• more durable game pieces- no 03 bins (i heard they broke all the time), no 97/07 pool rings (constantly getting popped), and definitely no 09 orbit balls that break when you breathe on them
• along with that, a flooring that is more durable- during traction/slip tests, we were powdering the fiberglass regolith)
• no more penalties for being good
• less restrictions on bumpers- this year's were a big pain...
• allowance of other, non MK batteries
• targets not mounted on opposing robots- the camera can only go so fast
• more emphasis on defense- like 06
• size classes like 07
• hybrid mode (minus the bad IR boards of doom)
• and a DS that doesn't die upon actual use

i think this would make a better game

i know some of you disagree, butthat why it's a forum, we can discussthis stuff

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

I would say, the big thing I would like to see is more auto. Lunacy barely had any bonus for good programming, which means a good portion of many teams became irrelevant.

Also, I would like to see a challenge, with arms and shooters, maybe a really high goal, or maybe a bar that was spring loaded way up..... *Looks up* that would release a bonus object (or maybe a flood of small scoring objects), it would be a cool bonus and encourage arms simultaneously.

Also a more strategic game would be good (triple play was nice). And the humans were way too powerful

But most importantly:

- MORE AUTO

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Definitely less focus on camera like sensors. Yes, I know FIRST is extremely proud of NI's camera this year, but to be honest, with many cameras in years past, not only is it hard for most teams to calibrate, but the lighting is never the same from competition to competition.

I agree about multiple game pieces. For example (a mix between 2009 and 2007) shooting balls into a movable goal but for extra points, lift the goal up 2' at the end of the match. Or hurdling, herding, or lapping in 2008.

No more than 3 alliances. Think about the controversy this could cause with 2 alliances that have close teams on it. It becomes a 2 on 1 and in my eyes, strategy from the beginning that is trying to take down 1 alliance and not necessarily win is smart, but non-GP.

And finally....please. More freedom. As someone else said in this thread earlier. No more refrigerator bots.

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I really like what people are saying about making the game "3D."

The hanging bar would be sweet, someone mentioned either a slowly rising bar, or multiple height bars that would be cool and challenging.

FTC was cool this year with the uneven floor. Maybe we have hills in portions of the floor that would be difficult to go over and if you could its faster and easier to score; but to keep it simple for rookies and not as "elite" teams, they can drive around the hills and still compete. Or better yet those teams could have another way to score that would have simplier terrain to traverse.

I say bring back the Tetra!

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I have to agree, a more 3-D terrain would be very exiting... maybe a feild simulating moutinous terrain? I like that idea! Perhaps 2011?

Though I do agree with the game designers that bumpers are good. Perhaps they should merely be... optional?

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one word: Carpet

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One rule: no wheels allowed.

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I think something like Laser Tag would be really cool. it would be a challenge, but it would be really cool to see what kind of robots people would come up with and what kind of terrain the designers would make for the playing feild.:D

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Well i think human players should be more of the game..maybe have them go against the robots...lol....well maybe something with paintball guns,,,,underwater,,,,floating....hovercraft maybe?

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I would like to see the return of a meaningful autonomous where points are earned, with a bonus for the team in the lead. Spinning in a circle is not exactly hard. Let the programmers do their thing.

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Something where there are smaller blocks that you have to build up to make bigger blocks. Which ever team has the bigger structure wins, and each alliance can also picks up balls to shoot at the opposing team's structure. In between the two there is a short wall that stops robots from switching sides.

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I'd like to see a game piece that is nearly a cube, but with one dimension a few inches longer than the others. I would also like these game pieces to weigh at least 4 pounds each.

The return of friction to the majority of the field as well as to the robot locomotion system.

A game in which large manipulators are necessary. I also want to see robots being allowed to expand outside of their starting configuration like 2004 and prior, as long as out of bumper zone contact isn't penalized for incidental contact. (I love large unfolding manipulators)

Like them or not, I think bumpers are here to stay for the foreseeable future though.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

[Compleatly_off_but_entirely_necissary] Water Game? :D
Battle Bots?
Allowence to put speakers on robot's?
[Compleatly_off_but_entirely_necissary]

I'd like a 25-30 second autonomous where there is a bonus or multiplier for scoring.
Also, Less focus on the human players, A LOT less focus.
Longer lasting batteries
No bumpers(I mean, it'd make matches a bit more fun to watch)
Non-Round shaped Game objects(Inflatable cube?)

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Overall I liked the basic concept of the game but it had several flaws.
A few things I enjoyed from this year:
1. A return of defense. Though most of the big elimination alliaces didn't rely on this much, many matches were won with defense.
2. Way less robot penalties. I hated all of the touchy penalties in 2008. (Although HPs cost many teams this year wins due to simple mistakes).

Things that need to be changed:
1. Way less HP importace. As a HP I cosistantly scored 1/4-1/3 of my alliaces score and I'm only average. Also HPs had way too much importance with the end of the game bonus.
2. More attonomous please.
3. Optional bumpers.
4. Please don't limit our drive train again. This takes away so much diversity between teams.
5 Just stick to carpet. Our team had no way to test our robot on a comparable surface this year because there was no way we could afford the flooring.

Heres what I think would be a good game.
Have a game field with a 5 ft. wid ramp run across the middle. On each side of the field there are 2 bins for each alliace. The robots would try to collect an assortment of game pieces such as round nerf balls, nerf footballs, and some sort of cube object and deposit them in thier bins for points. At the end of the match robots could try to move the bins across the field for extra points along with battling for a position on the ramp.

Just my thoughts

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This is EXACTLY what I was thinking. Game objects are on side A, scoring spots are on side B, there is a substantial barrier in the middle. I was thinking of a 4x8 on edge, but 12 inches is OK too.

Or, a wall across the field three feet tall, with a steep ramp/bridge over it on both ends, and a tunnel through it right in the middle. Either go short or climb well -- either will do.

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Autonomous mode: Robot opens bag of ice
Tele op: Put ice yogurt and fruits into blender and make smoothie
End Game: Deliver smoothie to human player

Whoever downs the smoothie first wins.

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I would like to see:

- multi-level & multi-surface playing field
- multi-object scoring
- moving goals
- less human player
- robot being used to gain access to different levels/heights (2007 end game)

last and the one that most likely won't happen:

- robot interaction that drivers won't know about that determines something in auto that goes into effect in end game (roulette scoring bonus/multiplier)

This would make it harder to tell who is really going to win. This past year if a team was wining by an outrageous amount (100-20) you could kind of guess they were going to win but but with closer scores at the end of a match (70-60) with human error in real time scoring teams could have pulled ahead which makes the win more exciting.

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Game Piece: Construction Cones
Game Field Elements: Jersey Barriers

Bring back the rules from 04 (no bumpers, and wedges were allowed)

prety much the opposite of the things i listed in the lessons learned, the genitives thread

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There's another competition for that. Let's stay on dry land. (Preferably carpet.)

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what if they set it up so you couldnt actually see the field and you used the camera to see where you're driving? it would be an interesting challenge and something that FIRST hasnt done before.

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This is a fun idea. Bring full teleoperation to the competition -- control delay built in, operators have limited vision, and random changes are made to the environment. For example, have opaque control stations and a field that contains field elements that are moved around randomly just before the match starts. Almost any game could work, but I think something skilled and intricate (Triple Play) would be better than a skill and volume game (Aim High, Lunacy).

Having a control delay built in, especially a variable control delay, would put a premium on autonomous robot routines outside the autonomous period. It would also take sensor use to a new level. Interesting approach.

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I think there is something to take from this year in terms of designing the "perfect" game as well as things to never bring back again. I'd like to see..

1) Never penalize a team/alliance for doing well (G14)

2) Allow human players to introduce game pieces and in some cases do it strategically, but don't allow them to score. This is a ROBOT competition.

3)Strategy this year was huge and I think it's necessary for a good game. Avoid creating a simple dominant strategy, give teams flexibility.

4) Auton bonus. Simple as that

5) Probably unrealistic, but look into a bigger field. The massive tie-ups this year and in '08 brought the games down.

I'm looking forward to '10 already.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Hmmmm...sounds a lot like a water game! (check out team 17)

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

I dont know about ya'll but I loved the Robo Coach........... mostly because that was my old team's (145 at the time) strong point. Plus it never had a huge chance of teams getting it to work, I mean the CMU Cams (or whatever they where) got what a 3 or 4 year run before being replaced.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

i second the "- non spherical game pieces" mentioned at the beginning. It would bring out a lot more creativity then we had this year, with many dumpers and shooters.

Just my $0.02

--Philip

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

They're going to keep the playing field "leveled" somehow. Probably not Regolith again, but something like that in terms of making the veteran teams skip a beat.

I can guarantee you with the economic climate there's not going to be a huge expensive game piece like 2007. Simple will be the name of the game, and inexpensive ramps and goals will be used over giant spider things.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Sorry if someone wrote this already, but all me have to do is scan the market for toys that are no longer produced and we will find the game piece for next year.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

According to a pattern it will be a ball and maybe off road:D

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I like the smoothie idea. I'd be human player for that one.:D

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I can't believe that there is already a thread for this... actually, this is FIRST, so I can. I will be back on tomorrow (hopefully) putting up my ideas.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

The one thing I'm excpecting is to see the same flooring. If you look back on past games we always had the same rug, and it was still part of this years game, but I'm thinking will see this low friction surface again or perhaps something with an even lower coefficient of friction. In my opinion it was a little too high for what FIRST was trying to challenge us with, it looked like most drivers were able to adjust quite well even with or without traction control, and we never really saw robots sliding halfway across the field trying to stop.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

I like the idea of a 12 inch wall with game pieces on one side and scoring on the other, but what if the wall is taller, say 4-5 feet, and you have to climb over the top and grab a piece and return to your side to score it. and maybe a tunnel underneath that you could crawl through.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

There is a field with a 6 inch wall in the middle, each alliance gets a bin to deposit pieces in on only your side of the field.You get two bots on your side and 1 on your opponents side. You get auton bonuses for crossing the wall, and each piece in possession or scored at the end. during the game you try and put the pieces, a sphere, square, and triangle, into the bin on your side. At the end you get points for the number of robots on your side.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

As a twelve-year veteran, with more hours than I care to count here on CD I find this thread amusing. What happened to all the people who wanted a "different" surface about this time last year? Or "something besides balls"?

Just be patient with your new game ideas. Sometime around May 1 Mr. Lavery will post OFFICIAL threads about these sorts of ideas. I know from talking to to several GDC members that suggestions in those threads are all read and taken seriously. Not that they will necessarily use the ideas ... next year. They might wait a couple of years until you forget what you suggested.

Oh and anything Dave says might be a hint, or not. I think he thrives on creating ambiguity.

ChrisH

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

Maybe.

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It would be amazing if we had 2 bots per alliance

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

You 'oughta stop making me lose the game.

-Nick

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

How about 2 separate autonomous periods? One at the start and at the end? Or maybe just one, but it isn't at the beginning.

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For kicks, a game where the robot may only score in autonomous mode :)

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Put auto at the end of the game, where you deposit the scoring objects.

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Acquire a shooting solution, select an autonomous mode and step back on a rubber pad (similar to 2005) to score through code.

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a game w/ less human player interaction... after all, it's a robotics competition! lol

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

i think a simple idea would be to have "flying" robots. Make a ramp or something to jump would be really cool. or haveing a step system to jump onto.


I know the danger factor with the ramp would be huge tho (falling 120+ lbs robot not good)

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yes its true that the FTC game had diffrent terrain but there was no bonus if they were used. they also did not stop play it was easy to go around and there was no problem with them. it would be nice if they were going to use diffrent terrain in the future to give a bonus if they are used( if the terrain is not a large protion of the surface

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

I think it would be neat to have a bigger playing field with more robots. Watching the closing matches on Einstein was difficult from the 2nd floor on the far side of the Curie field. Even in some of the regionals hosted in stadiums... from the stands, the field looks really small.

This would also solve the problem of getting too many teams at one regional while still maintaining a good amount of rounds to play. Maybe a 4v4 or 3v3v3.

I also want to bring back the huge rotating beacon lights. They were a pain in the butt to mount and find weight for, but EVERYONE knew which alliance you were on. Either that, or require a lot more LEDs that can change colors to identify an alliance color.

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I would love to see an LED light, cylindrical in shape or maybe half of a sphere, that would show red or blue, depending on the alliance, from any directions, even the stands. Select a 3rd color for a disabled status and maybe a 4th color to show voluntary autonomous mode.

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If those come back, they should be left out of the weight. And have better covers.

In 2003, I was volunteering on Galileo. I'm pretty sure it was the Techno-Ticks that seemed to break the domes, on average, once per match. That may have been due to mounting or driver error, but going under the bar for them meant plastic on the field. My team didn't have that problem, as our light was mounted so it had to go below the frame if we went that route.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

I seem to remember them having their light mounted on a springy platform so that it would dip down as they went under the bar.

I may be thinking of another team, but either way, it apparently wasn't an effective solution.

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That would be them. Smash! (Unless they did it at low speed, which didn't happen often.) 4 pieces of surgical tubing+platform+light+bar=debris.

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NO MORE BUMPERS where did the tough metal on metal go? the bumpers make the robots look like bumper cars. i want to see damage, this way we can see how a team can make repairs in time before the next match. make a robot that can take a good hit. that's what i want to see in next years game. i understand that in 2008 if you didn't have bumpers you weren't going to last long in this game. Bumpers can go.

Re: Next Year's Game?
 

188 had a light on a pivot in 2003, spring-loaded with surgical tubing; it never broke during two regionals and the Championship. We'd just drive full speed (i.e. around 12 ft/s) under the bar, without regard for the light. It never seemed to matter.

I wouldn't really mind if they were part of the weight: everyone would be stuck with them. My bigger concern is that FIRST doesn't pick a model that has a grounded frame (as in 2000–2002).

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I would settle for optional bumpers. Give teams the option of protecting their robot (enabling some of the cool construction methods we've seen in the past couple years - there was a reason you didn't see many monocoque or sheet metal robots around in 2003), but also give them the option of eschewing bumpers for aesthetic or gameplay purposes.

However, please keep wedges illegal and restrict contact to the bumper zone (even if there are no bumpers). Otherwise you will see a proliferation of wedge bots because anyone who doesn't have one will be at a huge disadvantage (in most games anyhow).