Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Lol something that just reminded me of this.

"President Bush; great president? Or the GREATEST president?"- Stephen Colbert

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

I don't understand how anyone enjoyed Lunacy, just my opinion.

EDIT: I guess the internet has trouble with sarcasm, I didn't mean that statement literally.

Luncay wasn't 100% horrid, yes I enjoyed it, but I don't like it compared to other games.

I made my statement because I find it funny Dan is shocked by people criticizing Lunacy, then is so bold to say nobody could like overdrive.

I'm not trying to be mean, I just find it funny.

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

I don't understand how anyone can not enjoy any FIRST game.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again, the GDC has never failed.

Every year, we have to work like crazy to design, build and operate our robots
Every year, we are kept awake, thinking of how to make our robots better
Every year, the competitions are as amazing experiences as ever
Every year, someone builds something that makes us go "WOWW!!"
And every year, someone is inspired.

.02

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Well, that is great that you have an opinion. I also have an opinion and it differs from yours. Maybe some day you can understand how people can have different ones.

No seriously, I wasn't a fan of Lunacy, just my opinion. I didnt think it was as amazing to watch as Overdrive. I do believe this is because I too enjoy a good drive train. I also enjoy a cool manipulator. I didnt see any truly awesome ways of scoring this year. (Opinion again, Im sure people will disagree with me here but hey, Im ok with that)

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

This just blows me away. well said

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Lol, i love that people are that upset about my silly comment about overdrive

maybe its because i perfer games that resemble real sports more. I think they are interesting to watch and more accessable to the general public. I feel the best games have high robot to robot interaction, lots of moving game pieces, and clear offense and defensive strategys

i didnt like overdive because there was little to no robot to robot interaction, a single dimension game, and no real defesnsive stratgy since there was to great of a chance of getting a driving backwards violation or contact outside of the bumper zone
i just remember the only match i enjoyed that didn't envolve my own robot or a friends robot was the national finals

on the other hand, i greatly enjoyed watching every match in Aimhigh, matches with interesting robots in Rack and Roll(including starting a "This is Awesome" chant during the match that i believe was the highest scoring match ever in the game) and i LOVED watching games in lunacy


oh and by love that people are upset i mean find it sort of commical and not litterally "YES IM CAUSING CHAOS!"

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

I disagree on this point, but being part of the military, my opinion here may be invalid. No matter what the challenge, high explosives always achieve their intent. Always.

Anyway, all satirical opinions aside, this game really did force teams to push the envelope... As long as their newly created envelope fits inside the rigid and ridiculously strict bumper rules.

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Every year, at the kickoff I profess to dislike the new game and every year at the end of the season I declare my admiration for that year's game; this year was no exception. I can't wait to see what comes next!

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

I thought lunacy was a great game for this year. with the new control system, I thought is was really important to have a game that a decent driving bot could be effective.

Human players were the main scorers for most teams (yes there are tons of examples where this is not true, but sifting through the data HP players accounted for more than 50% of the scoring) which made it more about the team experience.

This year the big programming and chassis stuff was very much controls related. Traction control systems of different levels of complexity yielded distinct advantages.
Creavitity of the fan drive system helped those that had the weight and did their homework. While not necessary to win, the properly implemented system were beneficial.

As far as watching it from the stands, Lunacy had the same problem as Soccer, Hockey, or Demolition Derbies. If you don't understand what is going on it is hard to recognize a great tactic from wreckless hitting.

That being said the rules are much more simple than say Football or "Zone Zeal" where you needed to read a manual before you had any clue what was going on.

Some like people like hockey/soccer, some like football, others like baseball/cricket.

Thank you game design commitee for another wonderful game. In general I like all of the games (but there are usually a few rules that I don't like).

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Craig, I got a good chuckle out of this.

As far as Lunacy being the best game ever, you'll never prove it. Everyone has their favorite game so saying any game was the best ever is just asking for a debate.

Even though I liked Lunacy, Would I say it's the best ever? No. It was my favorite to drive in, by far, after having Driven at various levels in every game since Triple Play. This year was the First year in my memory where a good robot wasn't a win, but a good driver almost always was.

Anyway, at the end of the day, this is about Inspiration and Recognition. I know for sure as I know anything in this world that I was inspired and so were most of you, so I think Lunacy Served it's purpose.

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

There were matches that involved real clean defensive strategy that won matches that I recall. I realize that this match did not happen during the regular season, but it proves the point.

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

That certainly does not describe Lunacy. There has yet to be a worse game for accessibility to the public in the 9 years I have been doing FIRST.

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

I didn't like Lunacy for the many reasons. Before I post my reasons, I would like to make something clear: I am not trying to place blame anywhere.

1) The field flooring was way too expensive for teams, especially in this economy.
2) The availability and cost of the balls. How do you design a robot to hold 40 balls when you could only afford to buy about 10?
3) It was boring to watch - at least for me. I could hardly follow what was going on. I prefer a game where a team knows what their score is by looking on the field. Yes, the real-time scoring was there but it was not reliable.
4) Punishing teams for building good robots with the serpentine draft and taking away super cells.
5) Standard wheels for everyone.
6) There were only about 4 types of designs for a robot - BORING!
7) If a team was dead during a match, it killed the alliance. Dead driver stations and other control system issues decided many regionals.
8) Some robot rules were way over-designed and over-complicated such as the bumpers.

The outcome/good:
1) The game let teams who were nobody last year emerge as champions at regionals. But it was not because they were able to build a good robot - it was because of luck, standard robot designs, and a game that leveled the playing field for everyone.
2) The new look of the playing field was different and kind of exciting. The concept of the game is really cool and a change from the carpet was welcome. Just not for a game like Lunacy.

Overall, I cannot say that I liked Lunacy at all. In my book, it goes down as being one of the worst games ever. Sometimes I feel that the rules butcher the fun of the competing. I'm looking forward to a more exciting 2010 season.

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Thanks! But I seem to recall a cute little two-wheeled purple machine that helped knock us out in the quarter finals was pretty cool, too. Just another example of multiple solutions to a similar problem.

One thing I consider when looking at "best game ever" descriptions is what use a competitive robot can be put to in the post-season. In other words, are the machines... on their own... as cool as they are when they are playing the game?

In that respect, I think Aim High gave our team it's best legacy in terms of an entertaining demo robot. Combine that with the fact that the game, itself, was exceptionally cool and relatively easy to watch, understand, and score in real time, and that would count as my "best game ever".

I have yet to experience a "bad" game, however, and have enjoyed them all. This year the playing field was certainly an interesting change-up. I was expecting maybe some type of pea-gravel pit, or perhaps a barrier for robots to go under (or over), but the low-friction idea was fun and will keep teams from getting too specific on their off-season drivetrain R&D for a few years to come.

And while I'll certainly give the GDC credit for coming up with these game ideas, really, the reason they are fun is because of the ingenueity and attitude that the teams bring with them to the competition. The GDC deserves credit for putting together a good game, but we are the ones that turn it into a great game.

Jason

Re: Lunacy = Greatest Game Ever
 

Agreed.

Every parent I talked to this year said they had no clue what was going on. Having 6 mobile goals and 120+ game pieces flying around everywhere is a lot more confusing than 4 balls, 4 lines and 2 bars.