Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I don’t like saying this, and I’m not quite sure how, but I think someone has to say it now, before the build season gets here.

Over the past 6 months or so, Chief Delphi has become increasingly negative in tone. This is disturbing on a number of levels. First, I haven’t seen a real reason to go this route. Second, this is the off-season, when normal levels are slow, cheerful, mainly in Chit-Chat, and sometimes thoughtful as members reflect. This last year, CD has been busy. VERY busy, compared to normal, with a series of discussions on the new control system, new structures, pilots and their results, and similar items.

There isn’t really a good reason to go the negative route. I mean, there is the news coming out of FRC HQ, but that’s a mixed bag for teams—and can help some teams. Yet, almost every time somebody puts up the news of a new post from Bill’s Blog, it’s only a matter of hours before somebody else complains about X aspect of the post, which is prophesied to be doom for another party. (All right, so I exaggerate a bit.) I’m guilty of this too, though to an aspect of a post of Dave’s that I probably misinterpreted. Remember, we’ve had major competition changes before, and we survived. We even thrived. So what’s different about this one? It can’t just be the change; there must be a reason people are just plain not liking this one. I’m not sure what it is, other than maybe secrecy, and this one's kind of open compared to some.

As I said earlier, CD has been surprisingly busy for the time of year. Lots of people are on and posting, and that’s good. But the last several years, around this time, people were speculating on the next game, developing prototypes that would never work (until they posted them and got some constructive criticism), and having fun in the Chit-Chat forum. This year, people are making their opinions, nice or not, known about the changes that FRC HQ (in the person of Bill) is letting us know about. Some are keeping it positive or even humorous (there was a bit of satire in one of the threads on the new control system). But many are complaining, and some are making unfounded comments that are then being refuted, sometimes nastily.

What’s going on here? When did this change begin? What’s the cure for this?

I’m not going to say that CD should shut down or be a “FIRST is great” forum. Those are the worst two options of many. But what I am going to say is that we all need a break. Go outside and have fun. Get away from the internet for a day or three. Go watch a sports game in person--preferably one that you don't have to go to because of X relative being in it. Have a snowball fight, if you have snow already. Come back refreshed, ready for another year, and then make your break a little earlier next year.

(Oh, and Brandon… If you have anything that needs CD to be down for a couple hours to implement, might I request that that implementation happen soon?)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

well said, i do agree that it seems "it" has hit the fan on here, and theres alot more anger and negativity lately for some reason

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I will take a whack at answering your question. People in general do not like change. Why is this change any bigger than in the past? Because people are having change all around them. The main thoughts going through their heads are "Will I get a raise/bonus this Christmas?", "Can I survive if I get laid off?", "After 'Jen' got laid off, I'm not sure if my job is secure,", "I heard the Smiths from down the road had to sell a car/move to a poorer neighborhood/draw from Timmy's college fund,". This economic crisis has people's world crashing down. Without going into what caused it or how it should/shouldn't be fixed, I can tell you people look for something that they do not expect to change. Some people found this in FIRST. People need somewhere to look that is their comfort zone. We may not be able to be their comfort zone but we need to see that the world is not pleasing the people as much as it was back when previous changes were made.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

The Old Chief Delphi is with IFI. (I kid, really, I don't know enough of about the programming, electrical, engineering stuff of the control board to take a stance...)

Seriously, I think the problem is that people just don't like change. I don't think you can entirely blame someone or criticize someone for being negative about change when its human nature to do so. Could we all deal with change better? Of course. Should we expect everyone to go along with the change without saying anything? Of course not.

Edit: as Rich later elludes to, its more the situation (change) than the individuals.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I've noticed this for quite some time, and because of it (and a few other things) I don't visit or attend ChiefDelphi as much or interact with the community.

This may from what I've been brought up on, moderating communities run by a very young entrepreneur, but when I see this the first thing I think of is the administration and the rules (no offense). Whilst a administration cannot manage everything, it certainly make a community nicer. Yeah, people can still disagree, but it doesn't have to be as fumming as it is now. ChiefDelphi is a large forum (or I see it as one), but all that takes is a reliable leader with several moderators.

I don't really want to start a argument or anything, but like I see a lot of things that could be different, and I don't really see ChiefDelphi as a place of 100% gracious professionalism which is especially important when it is linked as the most popular FIRST forum. What image does this place onto FIRST when its community/members aren't exactly gracious?

*hides before something blows up in the internets*

-Tanner

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

This is a public place and we are a subset of a larger culture that right now is in the midst of global recession and dealing with a lot of mistrust of leadership on a grand scale - governments, large business, financial institutions, etc.

The world at large right now is grumpy, thus Chief Delphi at large right now is grumpy. The same can be said of my workplace, and many places I go right now. Individuals in all of those places still find a way to rise above it, but it's a smaller percentage in times like these.

Don't try to make more of it than it is.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I agree with Mr. Kressly on this.

I mean, Chief Delphi has grown, and the people who use it during the regular season find it to be such an excellent resource, that they often come back to get the latest analysis of FIRST gossip during the off-season. When someone says something like the bagging system is good (just as an example) I'm sure someone has a reason as to why it's not good, and then he/she wants to post his/her opinion on the topic.

When you have *so many* people together in one place, you can't expect everyone to be all jolly and happy. You can't moderate how people think or how they feel, so moderating what people...*put* wouldn't be in anyone's best interests. Granted that posts that are rude or offensive are out of bounds, but other than that, I see no reason why someone should not be allowed to post his/her qualms about something.

Change might be the largest factor here, but there's no pleasing everyone. As a community of intellectuals, or some-what intellectuals, we have to accept that in whatever we strive to do, there will be some pessimism, there will be some optimism, but as long as we don't forget why we are in FIRST, we'll all come together in the end.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

And every day bring us closer to Dec 21, 2012. :ahh: I'll bet that is having an effect...

Blake

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Maybe more and more people have stopped giving the "powers-that-be" the benefit of the doubt and are now treating news with a more critical eye than before?

Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
Fool me multiple times over multiple years?

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

In all seriousness, I think that some of the changes that occurred previously (eg: switching to a new radio when IFI was around a number of years ago) weren't publicized before the season, but instead were publicized after kickoff. So previously, there weren't as many targets to shoot at this time of year. I'm not saying that's totally it, but it might be one of the contributing factors.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I'd have to agree and say that's pretty accurate. I'd go as far as saying that recent posts have not been in bad taste though. Most of what has been written is productive or at least provokes thought and criticism. Even if it is criticism that's a little harsh, everyone needs to remember that posts on here need to be taken with a grain of salt. Same goes for those posting reactions to other posts and comments. I've read it someone before on here that "you people take this game too seriously" but I think a better way of saying to just relax and think out thoughts would be to take everything with a grain of salt.

Anywho, I still say JVN's post is pretty accurate as to why CD's been a little more confrontational recently. But its not that big a deal IMHO, it all just depends on how you let it get to you.

This is a public forum, anticipate a confrontational attitude when arguing about topics. GP and anything like that don't need to be dragged across every plane you cross. For this I'll quote someone I look up to on this matter:

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I thought it was 12/12/12. Ah, no matter.


My opinion is that there is more offseason activity on CD because there are more people on CD. FIRST has grown a bit in the past 5 years, CD mirrors that.

Couple that with the increase from FIRST in communication, at an earlier time, than in the past (e.g., control system '09, driver station '10). This is a good thing, by the way.

More posts + more time to complain about things = more negative posts than in the past. A predisposition to complain because of the economy helps too.

This is speculation, of course, I did absolutely no research to come to these conclusions. Maybe someone else wants to follow up on that.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

sounds like government work... jk jk

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I thought we only had to worry about that if we were Mayan?

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

What happens when you have people who come from many diverse experiences and opinions and who are passionate about the same area of interest, goal, opportunity, or challenge?

What helps with communication and deepens understanding, awareness, insight, and knowledge? What doesn't?

I think Gracious Professionalism can cross every plane easily, helping to bring respect to the discussions and even the ability to agree to disagree without being detrimental to the opportunities that arise in this forum.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

The old Chief Delphi merged forces with Huskie Brigade to form Team 51 "Wings of Fire".

Eric - you should search before you post.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

:D
And that's the Chief Delphi we know and love. In the midst of a somewhat serious discussion - total silliness! Yay Collin!

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

"The wise speaks because he has something to say. The fool speaks because he has to say something."

'Nuff said.

:P

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

The Mayan calander? Just because it ends, (resets?) doesn't mean the end of the world, just time to change calanders. Ours ends every year (duh!) and it doesn't signal the end of the world. Just the end of the calander. On the other hand, I plan to have three days of parties (one before, the day of, and the day after) just because. Why not? :cool:

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

That depends, though. It's not just the end of the calendar, but rather the end of a cycle of the Earth. December 21, 2012 is the first day of the 14th b'ak'tun (13.0.0.0.0). Most Mayan records simply do mention it as essentially the turn to a new calendar and/or a massive new year's type celebration.

However, according to some records, some Mayans believed that we were living in the "fourth world," and each of the previous three had ended at the first day of their 14th b'ak'tun. One monument refers to (though partially destroyed) "black[ness] will occur" at the end of the thirteenth b'ak'tun and makes references to a Mayan god generally accepted to be associated with war and the underworld.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I am so out of here...but wait, where would I go?

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Well, I'm waiting for clues from the GDC. It will be so easy figure where to go!

(My feeble attempt to make this feel like the "Old Chief Delphi");)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Did this thread just progress from negativity on CD --> end of the world???

Either way, we just need more engineering related threads to talk about, rather than just talking about changes in the rules. Everyone used to build/design and post drive systems/offseason projects, and I have seen only a fraction of what I feel is normal.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I guess you just don't understand how important CD is to some people. ;)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Nothing a little bit of duct tape can't fix.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Since this thread may have morphed into the end of the (Mayan) world, here's an interesting story on what happened to the Mayans:

"Whatever happened to the Mayans?"

Aren't there some "lessons learned" in that article???

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Just think of the possibilities for the 2013 game clue(s).

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I don't want to drag this thread further off-topic, but I've always wondered what the difference is between 12/12/2012 and 12/12/1912, 12/12/1812, etc. They're all 12/12/12 :/ All of the "OMG 12/12/12 WE'RE GONNA DIE BECAUSE IT'S FREAKING 12/12/12" comments that I see everywhere always annoy me for that reason.
I always figured that all of this "end of the world because the Mayan calendar says so" business is just a result of the Mayans not calculating far enough into the future, and modern people just mis-interpreting that. I mean, come on, we can probably calculate into the 3000s with our fancy computers, but they didn't have any of that :rolleyes: Maybe they just gave up after that point.

Back on topic...
I don't believe that I ever really knew the "old" ChiefDelphi, because I joined in 2007. I wasn't really active until mid-2008, but I can still see a definite difference between now and this time last year. As someone has already stated, there seems to be a lot fewer "Hey guys, I CAD'ed a new swerve module, any suggestions?" threads and a lot more topics related to things that are occurring outside of the "shop", such as community service, cool robotics-related articles in magazines and papers, and A LOT of discussion on the items from Bill's Blog. I know that it's not always all about the mechanical aspects of the team, but it's nice to see what other teams are doing to improve their gameplay (after all, building the robot is kind of a big part of the team). I find a lot of the discussions on the chances for 2010/the blog entries to be really interesting, but it's not long before they end up going wayyyy over my head and start discussing logistics that I really don't need to know.

I think that this mightttt be because of the poor mentor/student ratio on CD. I see A LOT of mentors and college students making posts and having conversations, but I don't see a lot of students posting. I'm not really intimidated by adults that I don't know (well, okay, I am when I'm face-to-face with someone, but I'm the kind of person who opens up and talks a lot more when I have a computer in front of me), but I know a lot of students who are, and that may also be hurting the discussions. I cannot and will not speak for everybody, but people in general just have a natural fear of being wrong and being yelled at/scolded/told that they're wrong. Adults seem to get over a huge part of this fear at some point, but the students are still in school, and we've been trained to believe that being wrong is a bad thing. I know that a lot of kids are doing some really great things on their team, but I never see any of this being posted about, and I think that it's because of the intimidation factor.

Anddd I don't know where I'm going with this :confused: I'm very bad at writing out what I'm actually thinking, and I'm not very good at communicating concisely. It all makes sense in my head... :o

Edit: Oh yeah...that's right. Negative comments. Negativity->fear of posting because of a natural feel of being wrong->downsized conversation->??

I feel like I just went really off topic in the other direction :/

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I've actually taken to only checking CD 2-3 times a day (and only once for more than 2 minutes at a time). I find myself amazed at the amount of free time that I have :p

I'm almost curious what it would be like if we learned conclusively that the end of the world would be on a certain day. Sounds like science fiction, but it is a strange thought. I personally doubt that the world will end in 2012, but at the very least no one will begrudge me if I'm wrong :rolleyes:

Y2K. Sorry couldn't resist.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Kara, you've touched on some great points.

One that I've thought about is the graduation/moving on factor. For example, there may be preseasons where maybe one or two people catch the CAD bug and have a great time designing and introducing their work into the Image Gallery for discussion opportunities and viewing. Then you may have preseasons where that doesn't happen. There could be a cyclical aspect of this that is not being looked at or thought about. It's a way of noticing and acknowledging that one person (and their absence) can make a difference when it comes to inspiration and impact.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Can I repeat this enough?

Also, FIRST has shifted from the national and global community into whatever it is now with as much grace as a fat kid off a diving board.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I think it is related to multiple prophecies, but I tend to avoid those things. Additionally, the difference between 2012 and 1912 is simple, we have the internet to perpetuate mad rantings and theories.

Ive been on CD since my freshmen year of HS, been an active reader since then, occasional posts until my senior year then I started posting a lot more. There has been a change, I think we can all see that. I think if we went back and looked through older posts that this is not the first time CD has changed tones, nor will it be the last.

However, I do agree with Eric, there has been a lot of negativity in posts lately, I won't deny that some of this is my doing. Is this a bad thing? Of course, I know that one of the reasons I am willing to even venture into the technical forums is because I know this place is focused on learning and the free exchange of knowledge. Short story from last year;(Now for my usual disclaimers, very few people would ever tell someone they are an idiot on here, don't take this as me saying JVN would call anyone an idiot for making an honest mistake)

It is my personal beliefs that part of the cause for this is the climate right now, watching the news lately things have been very charged. Everyone is nervous, those that arent nervous end up being nervous because the people who are are acting strangely and it worries them. This causes a nasty problem for the CD community, some of us are bitter about things (be it FTC, the new controls, FIRST, work, what have you...) this leads to some negative postings by them. This aggravates someone else who then posts negative posts elsewhere and irritates someone else. There is a really simple solution to this problem, don't post when angry. If something ticks you off take a walk, throw a tennis ball against a wall, play a game, just do something that relaxes you. Come back 20 minutes later when you have cooled off and then ask yourself why you were so irritated. Chances are it wasnt for any good reason. If you still think you had a good reason for being ticked off you need to go back and read why they said what they said to you. Did you deserve it? Then ask yourself if you really need to respond to it, does it add anything to the discussion or is it just some petty hit to your ego?

Summarizing the last book, THINK BEFORE YOU POST!

Addressing Kara's post; In the 6 years Ive done this, the countless thousands of people I have talked to, I never got over that fear of opening my mouth and cramming my foot in it. I doubt I ever will. Know that CD is a safe environment to learn to talk with a foot in your mouth. The vast majority of people on here will never think less of you for making a mistake as long as you learn from it. There is absolutely nothing bad about being wrong. Being wrong simply means you can grow more, when people tell you that you are wrong it means you have a logical path to grow on. In fact, I prefer when people tell me I am wrong to agreeing with me, it means that the person respects and cares about me enough to help me better myself.(well, that or they are just a jerk but that sounds a lot less nice so can we just ignore that possibility? kthxbai) This is a theme I always tell students right from the start, I admit I don't have all the answers, I don't know everything. This is going to be a learning experience for me too and that just because I say something it is NOT always right. I would hope that most people on here would not have such an inflated ego that they think their word is law .Except Brandon, his word is law... don't tick off the site admin :)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

It has nothing to do with them not calculating far enough. In fact, they calculated further than that. But, some Mayans believed that 12/21/2012 (note that it's NOT 12/12/2012) would be the end of the fourth cycle of the world, and has importance in their astrological calendar.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Can't we all just agree that nothing will happen on that day?

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

well technically, i believe it was the mayans that believed each town had to sacrifice a beating heart every morning to insure that the sun would come up the next day, and assuming that every town across the world is no longer sacrificing beating hearts to their Gods, i think we should be ok as far as the universe collapsing

but just for kicks and giggles, can we delay/perform the final test of the Large Hadron Collider on 12/21/12 just to freak everyone out

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Nah, I am sure something will happen that day. I mean, I intend on going in to work that day.That right there is something happening... I might even do some work that day too. (Work as in what Im paid to do not as in work done on an object)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

What fun is that?

I don't seriously believe the world will end, but I do believe in being informed. In other words, don't dismiss something, no matter how silly, without knowing the facts first.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I'm pretty sure that days will start getting longer after that date.

That would be fun, but expensive. The LHC uses a lot of electricity, and it has a planned shutdown every winter so the power can be used to keep people warm instead of making pretty flashes of light. :)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Amen. My thoughts exactly.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

On the contrary - I am very, very confident that several extremely improbable events will occur precisely at the end of the Mayan 4th world.

One of them might be a sudden large increase in the extent to which all Chief Delphi users are excellent to each other.

Blake

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I predict the GDC will release a game hint on that day that will cause our heads to explode. (Based on prior experience...)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

You gotta love this thread, long soul searching posts about the content of CD twisted in with posts of Mayan calendars and the end of the world.

I love this place!

(and I get to learn things too, bonus time!)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Last time "they" said nothing would happen for Y2K, and the whole world changed. Suddenly, websites built with frames and animated GIFs weren't cool anymore, everyone forgot what Tamigotchis were, Doug and The Angry Beavers were canceled, "Help I've fallen and can't get up", Razor scooters replaced skateboards, Furbies tried to take over the world, and then a really crappy version of Windows called ME came out. The worst part? Still no monorails and flying cars.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

As much as we have veered off topic right into talking about the uncertainty of someday three years away, no one is being negative.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I've gotta agree.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Ditto to that. You can only stand in front of that fan so long before you need to change your clothes...

I like change. I can buy my lunch with it. Unfortunately these days change may be all we have left.....

WC :cool:

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Given the recent postings, I don't think there is a topic to be off, so......

Perhaps no one is posting drivetrain designs because of the curve ball Lunacy threw at them - everyone is afraid of being required to use jello mold wheels on playing field surfaces covered in empty peanut shells.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Interesting take and has not been broached on this thread. I also have to wonder if a lot of the traditional design work has been published on here many times over. Used to see a lot of shifting transmissions and (NBD) DeWalt was breakthrough but now you can purchase several flavors from AndyMark.biz & Trossen Robotics & BaneBot. Add that to IFI, AndyMark, and even FRC teams selling kit chassis material and designs along with the latest craze of swerve-drive units.

I am for all of the above. My post asks the following: What are the veteran teams with design and machining support cooking up in their shops this off-season? Provided they aren't a beta test team.:confused:

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Now that NASA has knocked the moon out of its old orbit, the Moon might crash back into the Earth on Dec 21, 2012. I recommend completing any prototyping experiments in time for the 2010 or 2011 seasons. ;)

Blake

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

1189 is going to see if we can put together a workable swerve drive. Apparently we've been trying to do it for years, but we've finally come up with a concept we are confidant we can make work.
*Shrug*
Should be fun.

Wow, I'd never really thought of it that way.
Still, to think that the world would end...the only thing out of the ordinary at my house was the toilet breaking. :p
Maybe I'll get a sequel for 2012.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I hope I'm not going too far in saying this: a lot of students are afraid to post designs here on CD (and even some adults) because of the lack of discretion others give while posting comments/suggestions/feedback about a design. I know I personally would rather only hear comments from people like JVN, Adam Heard, etc. than from other students but that's just me. I used to (and still do) have the dumbest design ideas in my head and would totally brush aside a suggestion or comment from someone but then look back at it and realize how big of an idiot I was in not initially taking the person's advice. There's a vast community of designers in FRC who only share their designs and ask for feedback from certain people via things like facebook and whatnot. There's also people who I think got tired of hearing the same exact crap from students about their designs when they were kind enough to post models of their amazing gearboxes/innovations (people like Andy Baker used to post some amazing stuff.) There's a reason why a lot of engineers don't post CAD or designs on here anymore, and its not because they love being secretive. Its just the type of attitude people give off in their comments, and the type of attitude comments are taken with (in my case).

Me being a thick headed student

Me still making some dumb designs

Starting off with not-so-smart designs

What happens after you learn from Adam Heard, Andy B, Pink, Poofs, etc..

I love being able to get feedback from engineers and experienced students, but not on a public forum where sometimes I'd rather not have another inexperienced student post about a design. There's a bunch of design sharing that goes on outside of CD and I really love the people who've help me learn about the stupidity of my designs and how to start making practical things: Adam Heard, Sean Cantrell, Andrew Schreiber, Brandon Holley, JVN, Ed Venator, etc..

P.S- These are all things RC and I have experienced together and learned from the same people.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Great showing of progression, this brings back memories. CD has really helped me learn a lot about robots and helped me keep CAD'n.

I don't think I post/upload a ton of CAD anymore, not that I stopped doing it or I want to hide the drawings of 17 year old. Just I'd rather just IM or ask people directly instead of starting a discussion.

CAD - 4 Inch Wheel
Machined - 4 Inch Wheel Done a few days ago.
*Almost done, lathe op needed*

For some reason people tend to say stuff is not practical and not worth doing. But there are times where you just want to try new things. Like I just had to try machine out this wheel. So I did and it only took 15 minutes for both sides at my work. Thanks to heavy machining last year. I learned a lot of lessons such as how much to machine/what to machine out.

I would love to see CD start buzzing with more machined parts and CAD.

-RC

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

It takes a lot of courage to post your work in CD, no doubt about it.

I understand what Akash is saying and I respect that. I also know that a lot of learning and comprehension takes place in CD. Students learn to become better not only in CAD or design but in communicating their opinions and learning to ask questions in an appropriate manner.

It's great that you all still have access to the people that you respect and admire but who is going to lead the way for the new members of CD that bring earnestness, interest, and passion with them, if everyone stops posting?

This is just a thought. I totally respect your post, Akash. I'd like to see CD start buzzing, too, RC.

Jane

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I believe the SeQuel is the unicycle model of the Segway and is due out in 2011, not 2012. HTH.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I've read all the posts on this thread so far, and have found many of them intriguing. However, Akash's post is the one has struck me the most.

I guess I can see how getting feedback from someone that doesn't know the software could get annoying. But I just find it harmful to the CD community to not post on these grounds. I mean, if I see something on a thread discussing 3ds max...I admit I'm ignorant. However, I still have value to CD in posting my ideas there. I can suggest something that would make it look better even if I can't suggest how. If its not possible, I just learned something. If it is possible, the modeler has a challenge.

Just remember, your going to be drafting for idiots at some point. Why not get used to it?

Holding back on a great design due to a bit of uncalled for responses seems a bit weird to me. Afterall, one of the best teaching methods is questions.

I could go on about this for pages, but I think I'll simplify this to a sentence:

Restraint in sharing an idea, is a constraint on learning.

Please post anything that might be educational to others or yourself, and you will find that a part of CD will be revived.

PS: I will probably discuss my ideas on the increased negativity in a future post. I just thought this is long enough for this one.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Wow! This is one of the weirdest threads yet on CD.......

At the start I was set back in my chair trying to understand the comments... then it changed... then it changed again skirting many subjects.

I truly believe what we are seeing, like Rich has said is a mirror of the stress of the current world.... mine included....I mean who would have thought that after 37 years of teaching I would get layed off..... who would have thought that Team 65 and Team 47 would be forced to merge due to the closing of a school..... who would have thought that I would be in the 6th week of school (I was rehired after a hard battle) and I would still have NO classroom materials, tools, equipment and it is all sitting at the old school waiting for persons un-named to ship it to the new school.... who would have thought....

Stresses like these influence a persons attitudes... and yes posts (like mine... I am very sorry) where they just need to vent.

We cannot see all that is impacting the "Community of FIRST" however we should all take a second and extend a little understanding, a little tolerance and continue to support each other.

Now more than ever the Community of FIRST needs each other and the support system it has developed over the past 14 years. Many great comments, many great answers and many great people all sharing a vision to make the world a better place...... each in their own small way.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I've been reading this thread with not much to add, but I can't echo Akash enough. I posted one "design" which was really just a paper napkin drawing at the beginning of the summer about an undetailed crab drive concept I was interested in pursuing (resources have made that rather hard, so I'm post-phoning for now). I got about two pages of responses, and the first few responses were students telling me that my boxes (representative of components) would not work, and then telling me I labeled components incorrectly. It was easily my most frustrating week on CD.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Posts on here should consist of more than grammar or vocab corrections. If that is all you have to say than it is better delivered through a pm.

On the subject of posting designs, the poster has as much responsibility to be cordial as the replier. Anything posted on here should not be posted to just show off, you should post for the benefit of you and others, you can show others a new way to do something. If you post something than you should be prepared to take some comments wanting to help you. I know I have a problem with receiving constructive criticism. One person has posted something on here and received some comments that he didn't like and called the poster something that I am unwilling to re-post. This person is still posting designs. I like seeing designs and learning more about the mechanical part of the robot. I hope people will post more, not just to lighten the mood around here but to help me learn and help the community grow.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

If you can't take bad comments about designs you submit (even stupid ones) your going to hard time being a designer.

One of the hardest things for an engineer to do is submit his ideas to be reviewed and commented on by others. CD is just like real life, you get all kinds of feedback from stupid to excellent.

Many times these unhelpful comments will come from people who will be signing your paycheck. It can be very frustrating but you need to learn to live with it.

Learn to listen to all comments, good and bad. It will make you a better Engineer.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I should save myself by mentioning that I appreciated the critisicm/suggestions I recieved. I did not appreciate people telling me unhelpful-hoopla, for the sake of posting.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I respect that suggestion as I know it from my engineering classes. Note that I never mentioned not being able to take negative comments, though. They just need to actually be constructive. By "bad" comments, I think of a comment about a design that states something obvious (or something that's already been mentioned by the OP) and gets repeated over and over (or as Katie put it- hoopla) I know I've added my share of hoopla in the past.

I like what's written in bold:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...58&postcount=6

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

The fact that you've grown to the point of recognizing your that early comments you made may have been "hoopla" is a testament to why we need to be wary of some of the things happening here as expressed in your previous post. How will the next group of CDers be inspired to improve their CAD skills (topic of choice)? How will aspiring CADers get hooked into this shadow network if the posts from these experts recede deeper and deeper into the archives?

Another overlooked benefit of posting designs here is that they are beneficial even for those of us who have no aspirations to be CAD experts or designers. I open almost every CAD drawing I see pop into CD-Media despite having CAD skills that could be described as poor. I do this because I never know when these threads will spawn ideas, or when knowledge gained in these threads will be applicable to something my team is doing, even if it's completely unrelated.

I'm not suggesting that everyone should post every idea they sketch out on here, some members here are clearly very prolific designers and if they posted every last idea they came up with we'd be buried in content. What I am suggesting is that people should not hesitate to post ideas they think are particularly interesting, not just for their own benefit, but for the benefit of those who are now where you once were.

I understand that some of the comments you may receive on a post may not be helpful, but be honest with yourself, how much time do you really spend filtering those comments out? Those comments are posted by students that are likely eager to try and contribute, students that are truly excited about what they are doing; although the comments may be obnoxious at times (believe me, I know that feeling) we must remind ourselves that our goal is to encourage these students so they remain excited. "Obvious" comments are not the reason that we should stop posting ideas here on CD, they are the reason we must continue or increase our efforts to share our knowledge with the CD community.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I truly want CD to continue to be a place where students and engineers can still post designs and ideas. Like Scott (Indysam) says, receiving critique is tough, but it is required process in continuous improvement.

RC and Akash... what you guys are experiencing is a transition of roles. For a few years, you have been the guys who have posted designs on here, and then you get feedback. Some feedback is good, some is not so good. Now, you have gained experience and expertise, and your designs are getting very good. You see some people with less experience than you critique your design and these critiques are not as helpful. Therefore, your desire to show designs here is less. However... what is happening is that more and more people are LEARNING FROM YOU.

As you look up to folks like Adam, JVN, and others, people are now looking up to you for inspiration. They may not tell you that you inspire them... but you do.

So, keep doing what you are doing. People appreciate what you do. I love seeing your passion in design and your willingness to post things for the world to see. I am sure that three are many other people, coast to coast, who also appreciate your work.

As for the few negative comments that may come out once in a while, I say we fight that with more positive comments. It's easy to drown out the naysayers with a nice helping of encouragement. Feel free to poke me once in a while for assistance in helping drown out negativity. I often get too busy, with my head buried into a project, that I don't pay attention to some things that I need to.

Sincerely,
Andy Baker

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I design software for a living. Part of that design process is to run multiple design reviews where I bring in my peers, representatives from each dept. in the company, as well as customer/partners. In other words people who have a stake in the software being developed.

There is nothing like sitting in front of a group of people ripping apart your design. Or having to explain over and over again why you design things the way you did. It can be frustrating and humiliating.

Kind of like posting a design on CD.

But in the end somethings happen:

First, the other stakeholders learn from the discussion and have a good appreciation for what is being developed. Education has occurred.

Second, my design gets a thorough analysis by people that use the software and may see things differently than I did, probably pointing out legit flaws or short comings. Designs are improved.

Third, I get better at defending my design decisions. Definitely a valuable skill, especially when you are trying to convince the engineers they need to write the software in a particular way. More education has occurred.

And ultimately, I am the designer, so I get to decide what I do with the feedback. Some makes it into the software, and some gets ignored. But in the end the world is a better place for having done the design review.

So keep posting your ideas to the CD thrashing machine and make use of the positives and learn from the negatives.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

6 months huh? That's about the last time I posted heavily on this site (April).
Don't make me come back & whip all of you back into shape people! :yikes:

Let's hear less talk of change, & more actual change for the better!
Starting now... and... GO! :)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

You heard him folks, this is Elgin's fault.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Ahahahaha! Yeah, all my fault because I left. My bad people! :p

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Whoever posted this thread is right, it can be hard at times to make sure you think twice before posting. I committed offense and I didn't realize it until someone else pointed out how bad it sounds to someone else.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

We've lost the feeling that we are all of the same FIRST family. Family members fight and disagree, but we are still family.

When was the last time you posted in the birthday thread? Check it out. Only a few people posting.

We're family. Start acting like it or no game hint for you!!!

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Can I hold you to this? If so I am going to start acting like a jerk! (I for one would like to keep my December free from game hint threads)

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

I think that we are dealing with the results of the impact of social networks and groups forming either formally or informally. Social networks are making inroads into the social fibers of our cultures. They can enhance communications in some areas and destroy communications in other areas. They can be a useful tool or a destructive one. Bottom line, individuals make up communities in our schools, our towns, our cities, our countries. Individuals also make up communities in social networks and in forums such as Chief Delphi. How much, how little, and how well thought out the contributions made by the individuals are, determines the strength of the fibers that make up our communities and our cultures.

It is that simple. It's that technology thing again, and the wisdom that should accompany it.

Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?
 

Which is exactly why CD is so popular! It is so refreshing to come to a public forum that is not filled with vulgarities, "FIRSTIES!!1!", "+1 tbh" and all the other bullplop that fills the Interwebs. People generally post well-thought-out ideas, concerns, suggestions, and topics here, often take the time to proofread and check spelling & grammar, and we end up with a forum bursting with passion. Whether it's discussion of the new game hint, control system, or a really cool transparent drive train, the people that use CD are not only academically inclined, but care deeply about issues discussed here.
Unfortunately, sometimes this passion manifests itself in negative ways (but not nearly as harshly as one would find at a random Internet forum) and we should be aware of that - make sure our messages are clear, and if negativity is encountered, be sure not to take it personally; use it as a learning tool.