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-   -   Daves Game Hint (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78803)

Chris Fultz 10-30-2009 12:39 PM

Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dlavery (Post 880370)
Game hint? "Game hint!" Did someone say "game hint?" Oooo-o-o-ohh! Guess it is time to get to work....
. . .


OK, i didn't want to hijack the thread where Dave posted this, but i think this is a real hint. I know that Dave is into Mind Mapping (where you related thoughts all over the place and come up with something brilliant - Al Gore does this stuff all the time).

So, take this hint above and lets turn it into the 2010 game idea.

"Game Hint, Game Hint, Did someone say Game Hint". That sounds like a direct quote from one of those adult beverage commercials.

The commercial is for a product that features a silver train and snow.

This year, we had a playing field that was like ice (relates to the snow above). And what has even less traction than that? TRAIN TRACKS, a direct link to the commercial above that Dave is mimicking in his response.

I also know that AndyMark (who was part of the wheel supply last year), is located in an industrial park area that, to get to, you have to cross what - RAILROAD TRACKS. Yet another link to the train idea.

And the way trains work and transfer power to their wheels is an awesome yet simple engineering feat.

So what is the game - Robots have to drive around the field doing something (to be revealed at the next game hint) and then get themselves onto a set of railroad tracks that are hidden in a snow like material. The robot will have to be able to drive on the playing field AND the train tracks to be effective.

And you thought rigolith was tough.


PS - Happy Halloween :]

(back to work, lunch is over)











ow to

Daniel_LaFleur 10-30-2009 12:43 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Daves hints are never so straight forward.

The real hint is in the 3 dots at the end, which is a morse code 's'.

We'll get the rest of the hint over the next few weeks ;)

yodameister 10-30-2009 12:49 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Fultz (Post 880510)
OK, i didn't want to hijack the thread where Dave posted this, but i think this is a real hint. I know that Dave is into Mind Mapping (where you related thoughts all over the place and come up with something brilliant - Al Gore does this stuff all the time).

So, take this hint above and lets turn it into the 2010 game idea.

"Game Hint, Game Hint, Did someone say Game Hint". That sounds like a direct quote from one of those adult beverage commercials.

The commercial is for a product that features a silver train and snow.

This year, we had a playing field that was like ice (relates to the snow above). And what has even less traction than that? TRAIN TRACKS, a direct link to the commercial above that Dave is mimicking in his response.

I also know that AndyMark (who was part of the wheel supply last year), is located in an industrial park area that, to get to, you have to cross what - RAILROAD TRACKS. Yet another link to the train idea.

And the way trains work and transfer power to their wheels is an awesome yet simple engineering feat.

So what is the game - Robots have to drive around the field doing something (to be revealed at the next game hint) and then get themselves onto a set of railroad tracks that are hidden in a snow like material. The robot will have to be able to drive on the playing field AND the train tracks to be effective.

And you thought rigolith was tough.


PS - Happy Halloween :]

(back to work, lunch is over)











ow to

Oh dear...Isn't it a bit early to get our minds spinning with notions of game hints from Dave? :)

dlavery 10-30-2009 01:02 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Fultz (Post 880510)
OK, i didn't want to hijack the thread where Dave posted this, but i think this is a real hint. I know that Dave is into Mind Mapping (where you related thoughts all over the place and come up with something brilliant - Al Gore does this stuff all the time).

So, take this hint above and lets turn it into the 2010 game idea.

[blah blah blah]

Chris -

You are seriously out to screw up people's Halloween weekend, aren't you?

Fun, isn't it? Welcome to the team! :D


-dave




/

JaneYoung 10-30-2009 01:21 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yodameister (Post 880514)
Oh dear...Isn't it a bit early to get our minds spinning with notions of game hints from Dave? :)

It's just short of November so we're right on time. I haven't burst out laughing yet - so it's not in full swing.

Andrew Schreiber 10-30-2009 01:21 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
First, Chris I am now mad at you. VERY mad :mad: See how mad I am?

Second, Dave is a jerk. Nice, funny guy, but he is a total jerk. He knows full well that anything he does out of the norm (ie changing his customary dot to two dots or three dots or even a slash) Will spark a response. Don't feed the troll people! If we ignore him maybe he will stop teasing us.

Third, I am going to fan the flames, not so much because I care but more because I am curious how long this thread will take to reach 100 posts. Look at Dave's last couple posts, see if there is a pattern. The Morse code seems likeliest but if it doesn't spell out anything don't forget to check multiple encodings or anything else.

(I mean these comments in the nicest possible way. Just to clear up any potential confusion, I really do think Dave and Chris are wonderful people)




-../---/-./-/..-./././-../-/...././-../.-/..-/.

yodameister 10-30-2009 01:42 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 880520)
It's just short of November so we're right on time. I haven't burst out laughing yet - so it's not in full swing.

While that is true, I don't want to use the processor space in my mind entertaining thoughts of the new game...yet, there are already too many applications running at once.:ahh: Brain initiating shut-down sequence.

Mike Soukup 10-30-2009 01:42 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
In a few weeks you'll discover that Dave's secret message is none other than "Be sure to drink your Ovaltine."

Josh Goodman 10-30-2009 03:11 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
It's amazing how the second I hit college I stopped caring about game hints. I think I've taken on the lazy attitude of "The new game will come eventually, just like every year." Unless of course this year the Grinch steals the 2010 Game. :ahh:


//

David Brinza 10-30-2009 03:19 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Yes Chris, this is just what we need: a thread dedicated to speculating that a game hint is imbedded in dlavery's post suggesting it's time to create a game hint. :rolleyes:

Fortunately, the clocks turn back an hour this weekend so we have even more time to explore this topic.

Chris is me 10-30-2009 03:25 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I believe a different post Dave has made is a game hint. If I knew where it was I'd link to it. But I basically read it, thought "that really doesn't make any sense", then gasped and started wondering if it was a hint...

BrendanB 10-30-2009 03:31 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I bet you that Dave sits at his computer, calls his co-workers over and says this, "Hey guys! Watch this. Let me start adding dots and say odd phrases and see how many kids go crazy over it!"

Watch. There probably all sitting in his office laughing their heads off.;)


Dave, you have power over us, and some of us have school and work to focus on, DON'T GET US DISTRACTED!!!!:yikes: please Geez I can't wait until some real game hints come out.:D

IndySam 10-30-2009 04:16 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Dave, Dave who?






-.. .- ...- . / .-- .... --- ..--..

Koko Ed 10-30-2009 05:42 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Josh Goodman (Post 880532)
It's amazing how the second I hit college I stopped caring about game hints. I think I've taken on the lazy attitude of "The new game will come eventually, just like every year." Unless of course this year the Grinch steals the 2010 Game. :ahh:


//

Welcome to adulthood.
Remember, patience is your friend. Denial is your shield. Bitter disinterest your salve. Your endless hours of crushing workload will be your strength.
Good luck, soldier.

ATannahill 10-30-2009 05:52 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Koko Ed (Post 880556)
Welcome to adulthood.
Remember, patience is your friend. Denial is your shield. Bitter disinterest your salve. Your endless hours of crushing workload will be your strength.
Good luck, soldier.

I am not sure if I should spotlight or run in fear.

JaneYoung 10-30-2009 05:55 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by rtfgnow (Post 880557)
I am not sure if I should spotlight or run in fear.

Well, explain part of it first.

What does 'bitter disinterest is your salve' mean?

Koko Ed 10-30-2009 06:12 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 880559)
Well, explain part of it first.

What does 'bitter disinterest is your salve' mean?

It's means your immune to the effects of Red Herring because you don't care about them.

Tetraman 10-30-2009 06:13 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I don't really believe in hints anymore except for the ones that they make official. I've grown up and because of that I don't really see any reason to keep "loading coal" into the fire and "chugging" along with off the wall ideas. I mean over the years I've litterly raged like a "smoke stack" trying to "engineer" some answers to Dave's de-"rail"-ing. I'm serious, if I ever find him, I'm gonna kick his "caboose", get the rumor mill back on "track" and just tell everyone not to go "all aboard".




=:=:=:=:=:=:=:=:=

Richard Wallace 10-30-2009 06:43 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
A game hint from Dave? Right before Halloween?

It can't be a treat, so it must be a trick!

MikePres 10-31-2009 10:43 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
there are a lot of O's there...

GBilletdeaux930 10-31-2009 03:03 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I'm not one to think too much about hints but somethings going on. Dave has had been quite active in the last two-three days compared to other months. And either he's having way to much fun with us, or his ending "." is part of the hint now because his most recent closer has been "-." which is an "n" in morse code.

Taking all these closings since the "game hint game hint bler bler bler" it says SII N. SII is the stock market abbreviation for SMITH International Inc. which supplies machines and such for oil drilling. Its stock, as it looks, has seen quite a drop off lately.

I honestly think he's just having fun with us. But hey, lets humor him.

ATannahill 10-31-2009 03:12 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by GBilletdeaux930 (Post 880646)
I'm not one to think too much about hints but somethings going on. Dave has had been quite active in the last two-three days compared to other months. And either he's having way to much fun with us, or his ending "." is part of the hint now because his most recent closer has been "-." which is an "n" in morse code.

Taking all these closings since the "game hint game hint bler bler bler" it says SII N. SII is the stock market abbreviation for SMITH International Inc. which supplies machines and such for oil drilling. Its stock, as it looks, has seen quite a drop off lately.

I honestly think he's just having fun with us. But hey, lets humor him.

as a brooker would say "BUY BUY BUY"

MrForbes 10-31-2009 06:45 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I almost sort of guessed the true meaning of one hint about last year's game, so I can't participate this year.

DonRotolo 11-01-2009 09:54 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur (Post 880511)
The real hint is in the 3 dots at the end, which is a morse code 's'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MikePres (Post 880616)
there are a lot of O's there...

Quote:

Originally Posted by GBilletdeaux930 (Post 880646)
his most recent closer has been "-." which is an "n" in morse code.

OK, so what does
S O O N
spell?

I am sure Dave is just trying to tell us...
Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur (Post 880511)
We'll get the rest of the hint over the next few weeks ;)


(Honestly, I feel a bit sorry for the guy. He can't write anything without it being hyper-analyzed and considered a hint. Imagine how frustrating that can get. Bitter disinterest is surely his salve.)


-.-

Nick Lawrence 11-01-2009 10:28 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I won't have any part in this massive trickery!

-Nick

--.-....---.-.--...-.--.-...---...--.-..-.--...---.-.-...---..-.--..-..-.


morse code?!

Big Kid 11-01-2009 01:54 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Just for the heck of keeping myself occupied the translation of .../../-. is SIN, but more letters are soon to follow i think lol, maybe hes SINGing


- .-- --- / -- --- -. - .... ... / .- -. -.. / ---.. / -.. .- -.-- ... / ..- -. - .. .-.. / -.- .. -.-. -.- --- ..-. ..-.

Andrew Schreiber 11-01-2009 01:56 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Kid (Post 880733)
Just for the heck of keeping myself occupied the translation of .../../-. is SIN, but more letters are soon to follow i think lol, maybe hes SINGing


- .-- --- / -- --- -. - .... ... / .- -. -.. / ---.. / -.. .- -.-- ... / ..- -. - .. .-.. / -.- .. -.-. -.- --- ..-. ..-.

Just as long as Karthik doesn't join him.

ATannahill 11-01-2009 02:51 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
actauly his last five posts has been

...
..
..
/
-.

or

S
I
I
/ (no translation but used to divide letters or words when Morse code is written out)
N

Just like GB posted at http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...6&postcount=21

Nick Lawrence 11-01-2009 06:34 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Trigonometry -> Triangles?

Where's the Cosine? :)

-Nick

Big Kid 11-01-2009 06:37 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
or its spanish as SI is yes

lbarger 11-02-2009 12:10 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
The three dots have spaces between them. A single in Morse Code dot is the letter "E". In amature radio, the "E" is pronounced "Echo" to avoid miss interpretation with other letters such as "B"(Bravo), "D"(Delta), "P"(Papa), "T"(Tango), etc.

So what if the 'hint' is "Echo Echo Echo"? We plate in a cave, or canyon where we can not see the robot at all times from the drivers' stations. Alternatively, we are repeating a game from years ago.

Just wanted to put forth another tangent. :D

XXShadowXX 11-02-2009 12:50 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Two things;

1) Trains could be fun

2)WHY DO YOU ENJOYING OUR SUFFERING SO MUCH?!?!?!?!?!?11?!?!?!/1?!!?!?

Danny Blau 11-02-2009 03:20 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
so I've heard people talk about trains, and snow and I know how much we all love teamwork,
so this video came to mind, it doesn't make any sense for a game but its really cool
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tF2ZP...eature=related
and for more fun watch the videos of them trying to get the plow out

they end up using 6 locomotives and an excavator
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=06rMZ...eature=related

have fun Danny B

skimoose 11-02-2009 06:01 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Morse code was used heavily by the railroads, but there was another signaling system that was also employed by railroads which was expressed in dashes and ohs or dots. That was the system of train whistle (or in the diesel age air horn) blasts. This is not just the engineer having fun, the sequence of long and short blast has meaning.

Here's the North American system, other parts of the world use different signals.

Sequence What it means:
Succession of short sounds Used when an emergency exists, or if persons or livestock are on the track.
When train is stopped. The air brakes are applied and pressure is equalized.
– – Train releases brakes and proceeds.
o o Acknowledgment of any signal not otherwise provided for.
o o o When train is stopped: means backing up, or acknowledgment of a hand signal to back up.
o o o o Request for a signal to be given or repeated if not understood.
– o o o Instruction for flagman to protect rear of train.
– – – – Flagman return from the west or south.
– – – – – Flagman return from the east or north.
– – o – Train is approaching public grade crossing(s). This is known as Rule 14L in almost all railroad operating rules.
– o Inspect the brake system for leaks or sticking brakes.

Dave says All aboard!

Chris is me 11-02-2009 06:15 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Have you guys considered the possibility he just typed the period an extra time or two at random to make you guys think there's a hint there?

I wish I was Dave, this must be so fun.

NorviewsVeteran 11-02-2009 06:22 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I bet he's almost chocking on Krispy Kreme he's laughing so hard right now.

EricH 11-02-2009 07:49 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
We all have one-track minds this time of year, don't we? Personally, I think he's just messing with our minds. Somebody remind him to be caught eating bananas, Jello, and Krispy Kremes near the field next year.

JaneYoung 11-02-2009 07:50 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris is me (Post 880893)
Have you guys considered the possibility he just typed the period an extra time or two at random to make you guys think there's a hint there?

I think Dave is capable of teasing and annoying us on many levels, in many time zones, through various dimensions, and on a regular basis. We are not necessarily naive or gullible but we still fall for whatever mischief we think we detect. I can't even imagine the stuff that goes undetected. That must be highly amusing in itself.

And I say - thank you, Dave, for your humor, your silliness, and your ability to keep this fun even when we are so mean to all of you on the GDC after Kick Off.
--
I like all this train stuff - I'm learning a lot.

dqmot17 11-02-2009 07:55 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
S
I
I
/ (no translation but used to divide letters or words when Morse code is written out)
N

a.k.a. si in or "yes indiana"
i say indiana jones. that has trains....
EDIT: Or with the echo idea:
C:\dLavery>Echo "We are robotics geeks"
yep
C:\dLavery>

dlavery 11-02-2009 08:10 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by skimoose (Post 880888)
Morse code was used heavily by the railroads, but there was another signaling system that was also employed by railroads which was expressed in dashes and ohs or dots. That was the system of train whistle (or in the diesel age air horn) blasts. This is not just the engineer having fun, the sequence of long and short blast has meaning.

Art -
I still remember when I was finally 56-1/2" inches tall.

-dave



/

HashemReza 11-02-2009 08:30 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Hmm. Fun. More bits to gnash over :)

56 1/2 inches...thats 4' 8-1/2". Sound like size limitations for bots this year? Or a field element?

Oh, dear. The Falcons/Saints game is about to start! I'll think about this during the game...maybe.

ATannahill 11-02-2009 08:39 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dlavery (Post 880907)

/

again nothing, I'm guessing he did it like that because he has no idea what to spell and is putting off a decision.

NorviewsVeteran 11-02-2009 09:01 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
So everyone is clear, 4' 8 1/2" is another train reference. It's the standard width of train tracks (or gauge, if someone wants to run with that too).

dqmot17 11-02-2009 09:32 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
So, FIRST is turning into the For the Inspiration of Science and Trains? That makes sense... Not a whole lot of re-branding will be needed....

HashemReza 11-03-2009 02:05 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
According to Wikipedia:

"In England some early lines in colliery (coal mining) areas in the northeast of the country were built to a gauge of 4 ft 8 in (1,422 mm)...

George Stephenson used the 4 ft 8 1⁄2 in (1,435 mm) gauge (with an extra half-inch of free movement to reduce binding on curves) for the Liverpool and Manchester Railway, authorized in 1826 and opened 30 September 1830. The success of this project led to George Stephenson and his son Robert being employed to engineer several other larger railway projects...

The influence of the Stephensons appears to be the main reason that the 4 ft 8 1⁄2 in (1,435 mm) gauge became the standard, and its usage became more widespread than any other gauge."

Thank you, Wikipedia, and Norviews for the context :)

XXShadowXX 11-03-2009 02:33 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Alright where to trains leave us where...:

The game is based on tracks;
-Robots move on tracks.
-Certain robots move on tracks.
-Move on Tracks for Bonus points.

The game involves train like movement;
-Alliance moves like a train.
-We pull trailers (again).
-Alliance moves like a train for a special period (start/end game).

The game involves train-like properties;
-Alliances must use combined force to move game pieces.
-Alliances must pull/push game pieces

Train Construction:
- Alliances need to haul objects, place objects, and hammer objects to score.
- Alliances need to build something out of game pieces.

What else you got?

Q. Sheets 11-03-2009 02:48 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Being here for a while, 6,462 mi doesn't seem like much. It's only a distance between these two places.

-.-

Collin Fultz 11-03-2009 10:24 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
What about 2008's game pieces, the track balls?

Could we see a new use for the old game piece?

JaneYoung 11-03-2009 10:52 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Collin Fultz (Post 880982)
What about 2008's game pieces, the track balls?

Could we see a new use for the old game piece?

I thought those things were awesome.

Danny Blau 11-03-2009 03:36 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
After reading Bill's Blog today and in his past posts he talks about the current field being developed as the "Delta" field this could simply be the forth iteration of the FIRST field with cost savings features added for the expanded number of fields OR it could also mean that the field/field elements will change from match to match or even during the match.

Another possible hint came when he talked about the use of the classmate PC this year as the driver's station, in the blog he said they played some matches, changing sides, and changing alliances with out problems this could mean that alliances will be changing throughout the course of the match.

the Dartfish software that is being tested for this year is used to overlay video replays of multiple actions, it's been used with '06 robots shotting at the goal and I have also seen it used in air racing to compare the path each plane took around the course. This also hints at the changing field, the Dartfish replay would allow everyone to see the robots doing their tasks as the field changes.

Danny B
"67 days until kickoff " Bills Blog

J93Wagner 11-03-2009 06:19 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DannyB1259 (Post 881015)
the Dartfish software that is being tested for this year is used to overlay video replays of multiple actions, it's been used with '06 robots shotting at the goal and I have also seen it used in air racing to compare the path each plane took around the course. This also hints at the changing field, the Dartfish replay would allow everyone to see the robots doing their tasks as the field changes.

Would teams ever have access to these replays after the match?

EricH 11-03-2009 08:30 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by J93Wagner (Post 881036)
Would teams ever have access to these replays after the match?

I doubt it. That could be legitimate--a performance review-- but it has the potential--serious potential-- to open up a can of worms that is best left closed. I'm talking, of course, about instant replay.

Danny, I'm pretty sure he's simply referring to the testing; during a competition, each individual control system has to be able to connect to the field from any one of the control stations, no matter what is in the other X stations on the field, and then disconnect and reconnect in any station again, in whatever pattern the field is looking for. I don't think we'll see changing alliances during a match; imagine what that would do to eliminations...

DonRotolo 11-03-2009 09:46 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
With all the train references, perhaps we'll need to get some TRAINING this year...:p

Danny Blau 11-03-2009 10:08 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881054)
I doubt it. That could be legitimate--a performance review-- but it has the potential--serious potential-- to open up a can of worms that is best left closed. I'm talking, of course, about instant replay.

Danny, I'm pretty sure he's simply referring to the testing; ... I don't think we'll see changing alliances during a match; imagine what that would do to eliminations...

I agree that instant replay could get messy; in pro soccer they use instant replay only as treat to the fans, all the referee's calls are final as soon as they are made.

The reason I bring up changing alliances is because it was talked about when designing a VEX game for a local competition and one idea was that if you controlled a certain game piece you could high jack a robot from the other alliance. However without having the VEX bots tied into a field control this would have been impossible to control and difficult to follow for the fans. With FRC though the alliance could be changed, the field used to controls your red/blue LED lights anyways and for eliminations; its all based on what teams are on alliance with the most points at the end of the match and thats the way you start the next match. If your alliance thinks they can win alone this give motivation to prevent a switch and if you think your done for your going to try and switch. the strategy would be all messed up think if red spent the whole match scoring on themselves and then at the end switched sides to steal the win. FIRST is always looking for ways to make things harder and more interesting and this would sure do it.

but hay I could be completely wrong
Danny B

EricH 11-03-2009 10:22 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DannyB1259 (Post 881080)
With FRC though the alliance could be changed, the field used to controls your red/blue LED lights anyways and for eliminations; its all based on what teams are on alliance with the most points at the end of the match and thats the way you start the next match. If your alliance thinks they can win alone this give motivation to prevent a switch and if you think your done for your going to try and switch. the strategy would be all messed up think if red spent the whole match scoring on themselves and then at the end switched sides to steal the win. FIRST is always looking for ways to make things harder and more interesting and this would sure do it.

Imagine this scenario: You pick your alliance (or, the top 24 robots are chosen and randomly placed on alliances) for the finals. First match comes up, and robots A, C, F win because they're on the same alliance at the end. (Alliances were originally A, B, C vs D, E, F.) Match 2 comes along, and A, B, E win. Now who goes on? A certainly should, because they've won 2 matches. But B, C, E, and F have one win apiece and D has none, so A has to play again instead of advancing. That's the mess you get into. So you have to have a completely new format for eliminations, one where individual teams advance, or alliances are locked after the first match, or some other similar nuisance.

In addition to totally confusing the teams, not to mention the Joe-off-the-street types we want to see us and the VIPs, you have to figure out how to assess the penalties that happen (which alliance gets the disable/DQ when teams are switching) and all the rest of that stuff.

It's not impossible. It's just crazy to do. Technically possible? Sure, if you can tell the robots that they just switched (and the drivers, for that matter). But it's your worst nightmare in terms of tournament play and who advances.

Now if the entire alliance simply switches colors, that's another thing (and almost pointless).

Danny Blau 11-03-2009 10:40 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
All I'm saying is that it would be possible, it would really shake things up and its not like FIRST hasn't gone with crazy in the past, I know the first time I hear that we would be playing on fake ice I thought it was crazy, six weeks is crazy, helping a team that's your opponent later is crazy but it happens all the time.

it would bring a new level of cooperation to the game and would really make things interesting.

It has more chance than a water game but only slightly, anyways I'm still hoping for it (well both actually)
Danny B

keeping the water game hopes alive

Nick Lawrence 11-04-2009 10:23 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
What a mess.

I like the traditional round-robin tournament style. :)

-Nick

Lil' Lavery 11-04-2009 10:55 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881083)
Imagine this scenario: You pick your alliance (or, the top 24 robots are chosen and randomly placed on alliances) for the finals. First match comes up, and robots A, C, F win because they're on the same alliance at the end. (Alliances were originally A, B, C vs D, E, F.) Match 2 comes along, and A, B, E win. Now who goes on? A certainly should, because they've won 2 matches. But B, C, E, and F have one win apiece and D has none, so A has to play again instead of advancing. That's the mess you get into. So you have to have a completely new format for eliminations, one where individual teams advance, or alliances are locked after the first match, or some other similar nuisance.

Who says an entire alliance has to advance/win? ;)

EricH 11-04-2009 11:49 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery (Post 881123)
Who says an entire alliance has to advance/win? ;)

This is true. What I was thinking (assuming a 3x3 game) is that the first 3 robots to win 2 matches go on and start as an alliance. This would take 3 matches, assuming my above scenario, possibly 4.

Of course, this does introduce the luck factor in a big way, so it may not be feasible.

J93Wagner 11-04-2009 12:56 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881054)
I doubt it. That could be legitimate--a performance review-- but it has the potential--serious potential-- to open up a can of worms that is best left closed. I'm talking, of course, about instant replay....

What I was referring to was if a team wanted to make a video using the video that was shot from the regional authority, would they be able to use it?

EricH 11-04-2009 01:52 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by J93Wagner (Post 881146)
What I was referring to was if a team wanted to make a video using the video that was shot from the regional authority, would they be able to use it?

Any team has access to the video drop behind the curtain near Pit Admin, if they want to have it. They just need their own recording device. It's the same feed that the main screen uses.

GaryVoshol 11-04-2009 03:01 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881150)
Any team has access to the video drop behind the curtain near Pit Admin, if they want to have it. They just need their own recording device. It's the same feed that the main screen uses.

At an SRE-run event. Other lower-cost events, YMMV.

And I'd think that the video drop would be near the field (the curtain which Eric mentions), which is not necessarily the location of Pit Admin.

Lil' Lavery 11-04-2009 05:11 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881132)
This is true. What I was thinking (assuming a 3x3 game) is that the first 3 robots to win 2 matches go on and start as an alliance. This would take 3 matches, assuming my above scenario, possibly 4.

Of course, this does introduce the luck factor in a big way, so it may not be feasible.

Who says anything about luck? What if there's a controlled trigger that causes teams to switch alliances? It would just become some very chaotic, sophisticated, and twisted strategies. ;)

Karibou 11-04-2009 05:38 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery (Post 881179)
Who says anything about luck? What if there's a controlled trigger that causes teams to switch alliances? It would just become some very chaotic, sophisticated, and twisted strategies. ;)

You ARE turning into your dad...


And that wouldn't be a very audience-friendly game :/ or a scout-friendly game, for that matter.

dlavery 11-04-2009 06:32 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Karibou (Post 881184)
You ARE turning into your dad...


And that wouldn't be a very audience-friendly game :/ or a scout-friendly game, for that matter.

Meh, audience understanding is over-rated anyway. I mean, think about it - big crowds actually continue to gather year after year to watch cricket matches, and NOBODY understands that game!


-dave



....

EricH 11-04-2009 06:36 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Like father, like son.

Let's see, so far it's been SII N. Dave just used 4 dots, which translates to "H".

sinh--Oh, no, not hyperbolic functions!!!!!

dqmot17 11-04-2009 07:40 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
This just proves that off-season FIRST guessing is just as bad as the prisoners getting tortured by the barney theme.

Karibou 11-04-2009 08:38 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dqmot17 (Post 881198)
This just proves that off-season FIRST guessing is just as bad as the prisoners getting tortured by the barney theme.

That's not necessarily torture! It could be worse, it could be the Hannah Montana theme song...

lenny8 11-04-2009 09:49 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Karibou (Post 881211)
That's not necessarily torture! It could be worse, it could be the Hannah Montana theme song...

Agreed. :D

GaryVoshol 11-05-2009 06:34 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Karibou (Post 881211)
That's not necessarily torture! It could be worse, it could be the Hannah Montana theme song...

There is such a thing? Please, keep it away from me.

BrendanB 11-05-2009 09:06 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dlavery (Post 881193)
Meh, audience understanding is over-rated anyway. I mean, think about it - big crowds actually continue to gather year after year to watch cricket matches, and NOBODY understands that game!


-dave



....

Depends on what country you are from because for the big crowds you mentioned that is their definition of a good Friday night.

Karibou- now all I can think about right now is the Hannah Montana them song. Oh well, at least it is better than Taylor Swift IMHO.




..//...

JaneYoung 11-05-2009 09:35 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by HashemReza (Post 880952)
According to Wikipedia:

"In England some early lines in colliery (coal mining) areas in the northeast of the country were built to a gauge of 4 ft 8 in (1,422 mm)...

George Stephenson used the 4 ft 8 1⁄2 in (1,435 mm) gauge (with an extra half-inch of free movement to reduce binding on curves) for the Liverpool and Manchester Railway, authorized in 1826 and opened 30 September 1830. The success of this project led to George Stephenson and his son Robert being employed to engineer several other larger railway projects...

The influence of the Stephensons appears to be the main reason that the 4 ft 8 1⁄2 in (1,435 mm) gauge became the standard, and its usage became more widespread than any other gauge."

Thank you, Wikipedia, and Norviews for the context :)

Not to take anything away from our pop culture of today but this post intrigued me. I spent a couple of hours reading about George and Robert Stephenson and the information was interesting, inspiring, and created a couple of moments that made me think. If the opportunity arises, do some research on this father and son, especially regarding the father's education or lack of. His accomplishments were achieved in spite of it and his setbacks were affected by it. His son followed a somewhat different path and it looks like his education influenced that.

There's no hidden reason in this suggestion - the opportunity to read about the Stephensons presented itself and I took advantage of it and may explore it further. Bottom line, I think many of us take going to school for granted and we shouldn't. That's what I thought about.

Richard Wallace 11-05-2009 06:02 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881194)
... sinh--Oh, no, not hyperbolic functions!!!!!

Reminds me of Impure Mathematics.

Chris Fultz 11-05-2009 08:31 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Karibou (Post 881211)
That's not necessarily torture! It could be worse, it could be the Hannah Montana theme song...

You know, it is interesting that you mention Montana.

Montana has the lowest level of train miles per acre of any state in the continental USA.

And now we are back onto that whole train idea.

GaryVoshol 11-05-2009 09:00 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
But Montana was already a hint ...

RoboMaster 11-06-2009 12:59 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I think it might be helpful to create a list of dots/dashes/etc from all of Dave's recent posts. He seems to be doing this elsewhere, not just where we are posting about it. Like, can we make a search for his posts and then compile all the custom signatures into a list in order by time?

Also, I think it is very significant that he quoted skimoos when he posted about the alternative to Morse code. That, along with the distance reference and a couple other things, seems to be pointing to trains.

But I do think 50% that he's just messing with us. It probably just vaguely has something to do with the game and could be interpreted in many, many different ways, if at all, just like all the other hints.

EDIT:
Here's the list ever since he's stop posting just one period.*

. . .
..
..
/
-.
---
/
-
....

Which is in English:
SII NO TH

Hmm, doesn't make much sense (yet!), but at least it translates correctly from Morse. So there's some meaning in that. Maybe the Morse code message itself is encrypted by another code. Does anyone have a detective, cryptographer, or riddler for a parent or mentor on their team? Help us out with all of Dave's hints!

If anyone wants to do their own decoding, I recommend Wolfram Alpha, which can do Morse code. And it's absolutely amazing in general anyway.

*However, I think someone mentioned that one dot in Morse is an "A", so maybe one of his dots counts in the message. ASII NO TH? AASII NO TH?

EricH 11-06-2009 01:51 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RoboMaster (Post 881391)
EDIT:
Here's the list ever since he's stop posting just one period.*

. . .
..
..
/
-.
---
/
-
....

Which is in English:
SII NO TH

Hint Is O, scrambled up to SII NO TH.

OK, I'm out of my league on codes. I'll chalk it up to Dave messing with our heads, with eager assistance from Bill and Aidan as needed.

Chris is me 11-06-2009 01:57 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
When he gets around to posting "U" and "T", the official Game Hint will have been released. Count on it. :D

RoboMaster 11-06-2009 03:17 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris is me (Post 881401)
When he gets around to posting "U" and "T", the official Game Hint will have been released. Count on it. :D

Exactly, it will be something like that. :D

Nice job with the un-scrambling. Good idea. Now we just need to make him post a lot so he can finish the phrase! Haha now we're manipulating him! Well, actually, it's easier said than done. And maybe he'll stop posting so that he doesn't have to reveal more. Hmm...

JaneYoung 11-06-2009 10:30 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by RoboMaster (Post 881403)
Exactly, Haha now we're manipulating him!

Right.

BrendanB 11-06-2009 10:35 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 881439)

WOW! That woke me up. (Late night)

I bet you it will be some thing like still no game hint you losers! Just my guess. Can't wait until we start getting some real game hints.:] Like moon fish!

psychomonkey 11-06-2009 12:27 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I think it's funny how last year, when presented with a picture of a fish, people were actually pulling it apart in photoshop to figure out the text on the other side of the page that it was scanned from. Kinda makes you wonder how crazy it's going to get this year. I do seriously hope that we play on a solid surface this year though. It was much more exciting when the robots were fast. We should all make guitar hero robots and have them compete. WITH REAL GUITARS! YEAH!:D

EricH 11-06-2009 01:34 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
We have another letter, folks. In the punctuation thread, Dave ended with "..".

Another I.

SII NO THI

Chris is me 11-06-2009 01:38 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Can you safely ignore the I since he said in the post "This is not a hint"?

...unless that's what he's writing.

Oh.

AcesJames 11-06-2009 03:31 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
SII NO THI...

Hmmm....probably realistically going to turn out to be this

THIS IS NOT _ HINT

It's going to be This is not a hint, I bet. We've already gotten all of the necessary letters to make it except the A, which will probably be his next letter :p

EricH 11-06-2009 03:49 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AcesJames (Post 881498)
SII NO THI...

Hmmm....probably realistically going to turn out to be this

THIS IS NOT _ HINT

It's going to be This is not a hint, I bet. We've already gotten all of the necessary letters to make it except the A, which will probably be his next letter :p

We still need another T, H, and N, and an A.

BrendanB 11-06-2009 04:25 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
If he post yet another "I", we know that either 1. It can't be "this is not a hint" 2. There is yet another phrase he is spelling or 3. it really is nothing to what he is saying, just a game. A game that we all keep playing.:p

hipsterjr 11-06-2009 07:01 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
"SII NO THI"

see nothi n g


my guess

BEEKMAN 11-06-2009 07:54 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
"THIS Is NOt It" only needs one 's', and two 't's......makes sense, we're all talking about sorting and going green, and recycling in the other thread, so maybe, just like last years game, we're all off....

RoboMaster 11-07-2009 12:42 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
I think Eric's first try was getting somewhere:

maybe:

hint is so
hint is os

Dave McLaughlin 11-07-2009 02:37 AM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
It might just be me, but I think Mr. Lavery is just trying to hack into the Main Frame with all these dots and dashes. I'm probably wrong, but I'm just saying... Mr. Martus, you might want to go check the Main Frame...

Karibou 11-07-2009 03:06 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Am I the only one who, when reading "sii no thi," feels like I'm saying "sign o' (or "of") thee"?
I feel like the next word should be apocalypse...

Danny Blau 11-08-2009 07:49 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
the first sequence that Dave left was ". . ." as three dots this is "s" but including the spaces (.-.-.) its a question mark

?II NO TH

NO might not mean "no" it could be "know"

and the IIs could be roman numeral

with these assumptions its "question to know..."

Danny

JB987 11-09-2009 12:43 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by XXShadowXX (Post 880953)
Alright where to trains leave us where...:

The game is based on tracks;
-Robots move on tracks.
-Certain robots move on tracks.
-Move on Tracks for Bonus points.

The game involves train like movement;
-Alliance moves like a train.
-We pull trailers (again).
-Alliance moves like a train for a special period (start/end game).

The game involves train-like properties;
-Alliances must use combined force to move game pieces.
-Alliances must pull/push game pieces

Train Construction:
- Alliances need to haul objects, place objects, and hammer objects to score.
- Alliances need to build something out of game pieces.

What else you got?

Maybe Dave's favorite song is "Crazy Train" by Ozzy O. and Black Sabbath with lyrics, "I'm going off the rails on a crazy train".

Daniel_LaFleur 11-09-2009 12:49 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JB987 (Post 881775)
Maybe Dave's favorite song is "Crazy Train" by Ozzy O. and Black Sabbath with lyrics, "I'm going off the rails on a crazy train".

I thought his favorite song was the "Truckin'" by the Grateful Dead :p

EricH 11-09-2009 07:18 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
If somebody in the DC area has a tranquilizer gun, could they target Dave?

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...5&postcount=66

Oh, and it's a trailing space.

DonRotolo 11-09-2009 08:03 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by EricH (Post 881816)
If somebody in the DC area has a tranquilizer gun, could they target Dave?
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...5&postcount=66

I second that, for the same reason.

Andrew Schreiber 11-09-2009 08:05 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Rotolo (Post 881821)
I second that, for the same reason.

How many votes do we need for this to pass? Add one vote from me.

hipsterjr 11-09-2009 08:26 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DannyB1259 (Post 881695)
the first sequence that Dave left was ". . ." as three dots this is "s" but including the spaces (.-.-.) its a question mark

?II NO TH

NO might not mean "no" it could be "know"

and the IIs could be roman numeral

with these assumptions its "question to know..."

Danny

Even though I think this is reading into it too deep, I really like the hypothesis.

Karibou 11-09-2009 10:26 PM

Re: Daves Game Hint
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Schreiber (Post 881822)
How many votes do we need for this to pass? Add one vote from me.

And one for me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dlavery (Post 881815)
And I am pretty sure that the plural form of aluminum is "6-pack"

-dave

/

Alright, it's going to be another 3vs3 game. The robots must be cylindrical and made completely of aluminum. Matches will last 10 minutes - the amount of time it takes for Dave to drink a 6-pack of Diet Coke cans.


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