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ATannahill 15-12-2009 11:44
[BB]: News and News
 
Posted at 11:41.

Good Morning Teams,

Keep an eye out. Sections 4 and 5 of the 2010 FRC manual will be posted very soon.

New in Section 4 Robot Shipping:
We need your help to make the FedEx donation stretch as far as possible so we don’t exceed the total and have to pay extra like we did last year. What can teams do? Keep your robot crate as light as possible. Freight shipments are charged by weight, so the fewer pounds FRC teams ship this year, the further the FedEx donation can stretch. You can make a difference by carrying that extra toolbox in your car rather than shipping it in your crate, or deciding to pack 1 drill rather than 2. Every little bit helps!

As part of this effort, FRC has decided to raise the overage fees for teams whose crates are heavier than the 400 pound limit. We hope that this will provide even more incentive to keep crate weight down and not have FRC exceed the FedEx shipping donation. Pack carefully.

New in Section 5 Awards:
We won’t be using FIRSTAwards.org anymore. Instead, Team Main Contacts will assign up to four students in TIMS as Award Submitters. The student Award Submitters will then be given access to the award submission section of the new Student Team Member Information System. The site opens for submissions at noon EST January 12, 2010 and closes at midnight EST February 18, 2010. Decide now who’s going to be responsible and make sure your Main Contact gets their names into the system.

Plus, there’s a new Coopertition Award. All the details are in Section 5

News on the FRC Staff:
Late last week we bid farewell to Neil Rosenberg the FRC Engineering Manager. Neil had a positive effect on FRC during his three years with us and will be missed. We wish him and his wife the best as they move to North Carolina to begin the next phase of their lives.

We’re looking for a new Engineering Manager and have had several inquiries from the first community. The position is posted here

25 days until the 2010 Kickoff
See you there!

Zflash 15-12-2009 14:57
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
The Sections are now available for viewing.

Lil' Lavery 15-12-2009 15:12
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Haven't read the full awards section yet, but it seems the new Autodesk Award(s) is basically the same as it previously was, but with additional products allowed in conjunction with the existing ones. It's one award, but with two categories, one for Inventor and other 3D Design products (only awarded at CMP) and one for animation (Maya and/or Max, and additional products) awarded at Regional and Championship level. :D

IndySam 15-12-2009 15:18
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Hmmmmmm

Coopertition Award, the award will be granted to the team that earns the most Coopertition bonus points during the competition

Rick 15-12-2009 15:19
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Unless I read section 5 wrong, the following awards will be given at the division level at the championship:
  • Engineering Inspiration Award
  • Entrepreneurship Award
  • Excellence in Design Award
  • Gracious Professionalism™ Award
  • Imagery Award
  • Industrial Design Award
  • Industrial Safety Award
  • Innovation in Control Award
  • Judges Award
  • Quality Award
  • Rookie All Star
  • Rookie Inspiration
  • Team Spirit Award
  • Website
That is quite a few awards to be given at the division level. Maybe this was done to save time during the championship finals?

Akash Rastogi 15-12-2009 15:26
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricksta (Post 888405)
Unless I read section 5 wrong, the following awards will be given at the division level at the championship:
  • Engineering Inspiration Award
  • Entrepreneurship Award
  • Excellence in Design Award
  • Gracious Professionalism™ Award
  • Imagery Award
  • Industrial Design Award
  • Industrial Safety Award
  • Innovation in Control Award
  • Judges Award
  • Quality Award
  • Rookie All Star
  • Rookie Inspiration
  • Team Spirit Award
  • Website
That is quite a few awards to be given at the division level. Maybe this was done to save time during the championship finals?
Most of those awards being given at the divisional level would be awesome, but I also saw that the WFA was listed as a Divisional award. What's up with that? Not having a single winner for each of these awards takes away much of the pride that comes with winning something at CMP.

Greg Needel 15-12-2009 15:27
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ricksta (Post 888405)
Unless I am reading section 5 wrong, the following awards will be given at the division level at the championship:
  • Engineering Inspiration Award
  • Entrepreneurship Award
  • Excellence in Design Award
  • Gracious Professionalism™ Award
  • Imagery Award
  • Industrial Design Award
  • Industrial Safety Award
  • Innovation in Control Award
  • Judges Award
  • Quality Award
  • Rookie All Star
  • Rookie Inspiration
  • Team Spirit Award
  • Website
That is quite a few awards to be given at the division level. Maybe this was done to save time during the championship finals?

Thats where I am also. But in reading the descriptions of the awards it is not clear. It is a big change if this is true and kinda takes away the prestige of winning one of these awards at the championship level.

Additionally I wonder how this will change the way they distribute teams into the divisions. I would hate to think that one division is much stronger for and award than another. As an example the 2nd best site in Curie is better then the one that wins in Newton because of a random distribution of teams.

Chris is me 15-12-2009 15:53
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Coopertition bonus points. That doesn't exactly sound subjective like a safety token or something. Interesting award...

It feels weird not having a National EI or Rookie All Star award. Takes away from the "best in the world" aspect of a lot of these awards, but I guess the webcast won't run so long now?

Carol 15-12-2009 15:58
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Needel (Post 888408)
Thats where I am also. But in reading the descriptions of the awards it is not clear. It is a big change if this is true and kinda takes away the prestige of winning one of these awards at the championship level.

Additionally I wonder how this will change the way they distribute teams into the divisions. I would hate to think that one division is much stronger for and award than another. As an example the 2nd best site in Curie is better then the one that wins in Newton because of a random distribution of teams.

My guess would be that there was a mistake; that the wrong columns were checked on the chart and these are supposed to be CMP awards. Note that they have the Founders Award listed as division level as well, which doesn't make any sense.

Akash Rastogi 15-12-2009 16:00
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carol (Post 888413)
My guess would be that there was a mistake; that the wrong columns were checked on the chart and these are supposed to be CMP awards. Note that they have the Founders Award listed as division level as well, which doesn't make any sense.
Good point. That, paired with a WFA per division sounds like a mistake. Guess we'll just wait and see.

Jonathan Norris 15-12-2009 16:01
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndySam (Post 888403)
Hmmmmmm

Coopertition Award, the award will be granted to the team that earns the most Coopertition bonus points during the competition
Is this going to be the award for the team that scores the most for its opponent... or more likely has something to do with a unique aspect of this years game.

Nick Lawrence 15-12-2009 16:04
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Coopertition Award, the award will be granted to the team that earns the most Coopertition bonus points during the competition

Do I smell another Co-Opertition FIRST style game?

-Nick

Karibou 15-12-2009 16:05
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by IndySam (Post 888403)
Hmmmmmm

Coopertition Award, the award will be granted to the team that earns the most Coopertition bonus points during the competition
To me, these Coopertition bonus points sound like something similar to safety tokens. Instead of being given for safe practices, they might be points awarded by the judges based on how much a team....*insert verb for coopertition here*

Or it could have something to do with the game, but that's a discussion for the game speculation threads.

rsisk 15-12-2009 16:08
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Notice that the Coopertition Award is awarded by Performance, not Robot Performance as in the other categories, or "Judges" as most of the team awards are categorized.

So is this a crossover type of award, some combination of team/machine performance?

rsisk 15-12-2009 16:10
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
they might be points awarded by the judges based on how much a team....*insert verb for coopertition here*
That would make it very similar to the GP award. It's gotta be something different. And it can't be based just on an element of this year's game, what would it be given for next year if it was?

dlavery 15-12-2009 16:15
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karibou (Post 888419)
To me, these Coopertition bonus points sound like something similar to safety tokens. Instead of being given for safe practices, they might be points awarded by the judges based on how much a team....*insert verb for coopertition here*
...cooperts. (maybe. at least, based on the suggestions from this thread)


-dave


.-

Andrew Schreiber 15-12-2009 16:20
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Yay, the Autodesk awards didn't change too badly! I wonder what us Michiganders who don't have the cash to compete at MSC or CMP are going to do. I wonder if there is any chance that District events could show the submissions of the teams attending during lunch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rsisk (Post 888425)
That would make it very similar to the GP award. It's gotta be something different. And it can't be based just on an element of this year's game, what would it be given for next year if it was?
It COULD be based on a game element, perhaps the next couple games will include a Coopertition score. I hope not though. Something like that begs to bring up people complaining about calls.

I propose that the Coopertition award will go to whatever team helps rsisk across the road. ;) This would put an end to speculation as to why 217 crossed the road.

Whosurdady 15-12-2009 16:31
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
"FIRST does not celebrate being an incompetent jerk."
This was on the introduction, i thought it was pretty funny

Lil' Lavery 15-12-2009 16:33
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Note how it says see section 9 (The Tournament) for details on how to earn coopertition bonus points.

rsisk 15-12-2009 16:39
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Note how it says see section 9 (The Tournament) for details on how to earn coopertition bonus points.
Not nearly as much fun as rampant speculation.

Lil' Lavery 15-12-2009 16:56
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by rsisk (Post 888442)
Not nearly as much fun as rampant speculation.
I didn't say you shouldn't speculate, I just offered up some context to be used. If I remember correctly, safety tokens weren't mentioned in the tournament section in the past, making this seemingly different from them. And if it was points directly related to the game, it would be mentioned in that section instead of the tournament section.

So... what are they?

JaneYoung 15-12-2009 17:02
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lil' Lavery (Post 888447)

So... what are they?
cooperks...

EricH 15-12-2009 18:45
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Bill has posted that he is aware that Section 5 has some errors. They are fixing them.

bduddy 15-12-2009 19:14
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
I hate to be a spoilsport, and I am all for "coopertition"... but am I the only one that has sort of a bad feeling about this? For some reason I'm imagining the GDC discussing the smashing success of <G14> from last year, high-fiving each other, and deciding to give a new prize to whichever team best follows its equivilant rule this year. And then laughing evilly, for some reason (hey, my dreams never make much sense). I want and expect to be proved wrong, but still...

Paul Copioli 15-12-2009 22:15
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
I can tell you for certain that there is no plans for a division award for WFA. Nothing has changed from last year for the WFA.

FIRST already is aware of the typo and will fix it shortly.

Chris Fultz 15-12-2009 22:26
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
New in Section 4 Robot Shipping:
As part of this effort, FRC has decided to raise the overage fees for teams whose crates are heavier than the 400 pound limit. We hope that this will provide even more incentive to keep crate weight down and not have FRC exceed the FedEx shipping donation. Pack carefully.
At each of our events last year, we were declared "overweight" by as much as 80 pounds. We were surprised because we made an aluminum and lexan crate, and only had the robot inside - no tools, no batteries, just a robot and 4 tie down straps.

Before we opened the crate, we asked for a weight check. Each time, we were under 400 pounds and the extra charges were removed.

So, have a good idea of your total weight if you can, and be sure the uncrating group knows not to open the crate if you have an overweight sticker and want to get it checked. As soon as you open the crate, you cannot challenge the posted weight.

Chris is me 15-12-2009 23:08
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bduddy (Post 888508)
I hate to be a spoilsport, and I am all for "coopertition"... but am I the only one that has sort of a bad feeling about this? For some reason I'm imagining the GDC discussing the smashing success of <G14> from last year, high-fiving each other, and deciding to give a new prize to whichever team best follows its equivilant rule this year. And then laughing evilly, for some reason (hey, my dreams never make much sense). I want and expect to be proved wrong, but still...
Not to jump on you, but how do you know the intent of G14 was to "encourage coopertition"? Is scoring on yourself an example of "coopertition"? Who considers it so? Does anyone?

All assumptions about the intent of the 2009 and 2010 season aside, I'd bet any amount of money that the GDC is fully aware that many did not like G14. I mean, I heard there were some GDC members at the IRI talent show... :yikes:

Jessica Boucher 15-12-2009 23:43
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
It's too bad that there is talk that this is a typo. It solves multiple things in one fell swoop:

1.) Cuts down award time on Einstein. Although the awards do serve as a natural breakup of the speeches, we are typically on the tightest of schedules and carving out some leeway could be useful.

2.) Clearly shows the best of the division. I don't really care that the best on Curie may or may not be better than Newton, since we're going to spend the rest of the offseason discussing it no matter how the decision fell. I would rather see more teams be recognized for their work then wondering why one team actually won it over another division's team.

3.) Growth, growth, and growth. More national-level WFAs mean more areas of the country they can be locally associated with, means more growth for the award and the mission. There's tons of great deserving people out there - and like #2, more in this case isn't a terrible thing.

Chris is me 15-12-2009 23:49
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica Boucher (Post 888593)
It's too bad that there is talk that this is a typo. It solves multiple things in one fell swoop:

1.) Cuts down award time on Einstein. Although the awards do serve as a natural breakup of the speeches, we are typically on the tightest of schedules and carving out some leeway could be useful.
(Optimistic) Maybe this year FIRST isn't going to pretend finals won't go longer than 2 hours? Perhaps?

TKM.368 16-12-2009 03:24
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
4.7.3.1. US Teams Shipping to a "Mainland" Event
Teams will receive up to two (2) FedEx Express AIRBILLS to ship your robot to the mainland event and home. Shipping between events will not be covered under the donation.
Shucks. It looks like Hawaii teams participating at both a mainland regional and the Hawaii Regional will have a relatively useless second AIRBILL. Team 368 for example will use one AIRBILL to get our bot to the Portland Regional. The second AIRBILL would not be able to bring our bot back to the Hawaii Regional since "shipping between events will not be covered" and even though the Hawaii Regional is practically in our backyard, it is not technically 'home'. We would then try to use the second AIRBILL to have our bot driven back to our school...?

I hope that's an oversight as well :(

Travis Hoffman 16-12-2009 09:27
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Fultz (Post 888579)
At each of our events last year, we were declared "overweight" by as much as 80 pounds. We were surprised because we made an aluminum and lexan crate, and only had the robot inside - no tools, no batteries, just a robot and 4 tie down straps.

Before we opened the crate, we asked for a weight check. Each time, we were under 400 pounds and the extra charges were removed.
Amazing how that happens, eh? Especially repeatedly. Especially using those *calibrated* scales and *trained* individuals who know how to operate them properly.....:rolleyes:

You wouldn't want to think there's actual intent to defraud, but 80+ pounds off is ridiculous. They're either criminal or criminally-incompetent. If FIRST is going to charge more for overages, the people doing the weighing (Shepard employees?) must do it accurately.

Justin Montois 16-12-2009 15:10
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
The manual has been updated. Looks like the awards given out on the division fields will remain as they have in previous years. Kind of a disappointment but I'm not surprised.

24 days to kickoff...

Nick Lawrence 17-12-2009 07:49
Re: [BB]: News and News
 
I'm glad to see that these revisions have been made. I was quite confused.

-Nick


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