Re: Team of the Decade
 

Interesting note: 1114 has the best banners per year ratio. Assuming they would have gotten the average number of banners 1114 gets every year, they'd have the most banners in FIRST for the 2000s.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

What about 1114 in 2008?

-Nick

Re: Team of the Decade
 

While 1114 in 2008 was an extremely formidable machine and probably one of the top 10 "best" robots in FIRST history, it didn't dominate. Beatty in 2002 was dominate because it employed a chokehold strategy, where it could control all 3 scoring goals. No other game so far from that year on could a team do this because of the game rules (2009- cannot control offensive trailers because they are attached to your opponent, 2008- could only control one trackball, 2007- could only posses one ringer, 2006- arguable, but otherwise almost physically impossible to handle all 120 balls because of size/time restraints). 71 could single-handedly defeat teams all by themselves because of the simple fact that they could control and manipulate the movable goals without anyone interfering. 1114, while they averaged 5 or 6 hurdles a match, could be interfered with (see 2008 Galileo and Einstein match video) and could not simultaneously hurdle both trackballs while denying their opponents any hurdles. That's essentially what Beatty accomplished in 2002.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

Very detailed accurate account. Probably why the GDC has been more careful in making sure it doesnt happen again.:D
The rules, game design, and robot rules in recent years certainly has prevented it.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

You've brought up an interesting point.
I'd like to hear each of these oustanding teams mentioned, to give us a brief makeup of how their team is composed. As an inspiration to many other teams, I bet most would be eager to know, including myself.
I got a chance through our history to know 254/968 and hearing their story and seeing how they evolved over the years is very impressive and inspirational.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

I find it interesting that all of the teams that have been mentioned are in mainland North America.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

I don't find this particularly surprising. One reason is that the vast majority of FRC teams are from mainland North America. Also, of the non-mainland teams only a select few participate in more than one event unless they qualify for championships. These two things combine to make it very difficult to achieve the numbers/recognition of the teams being mentioned in this thread.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

Ian is correct, RUSH is not just Kyle Hughes (though she is an important part of the team) In fact, 27 wouldn't be the team it is today without the generous support of mentors and parents. As for team structure, the website goes into some detail as to the subteams roles and responsibilities. They have also published a toolkit detailing the methods practiced on RUSH.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

When John says dominate I think he means this:

If you played Beatty's 2001 or 2002 robots, even if you played your very best game ever, and you had great partners, you were still going to lose unless their robot malfunctioned.

1114 had a great year in 2008, but they were not unbeatable. The right alliance(s) could put up enough points to beat them.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

Cory is right. While it was tough to beat them, it wasn't impossible. 968/233/60 beat them in Einstein SF1-1 and would have eliminated them in SF1-3 if it weren't for penalties.

They had a great year, but weren't on the dominance level of Beatty in 2002...

Re: Team of the Decade
 

maybe in 2002 beatty was unbeatable
but now with how many teams there is in FRC I dont think any team/alliance is unbeatable its just a matter of finding the right robots, and strategy.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

It has been the game design, the GDC more than likely does not want a strategy to be unbeatable. It would take all the fun out of competing. For example, in 2008 if it had been legal to hold on to all 4 balls I have no doubt Beatty would have (and figured out how to hurdle 2 at once). The Beatty strategy in 2002 was unbeatable, it removed all chance of the opponent winning. That year it wasn't about being the best it was getting #1 seed to pick Beatty. Since then there has not been a game that a single robot can shut down the scoring of another alliance. Impede? Yes. Completely eliminate all hope? No. As great as 25 was in 2006 and 1114 was in 2008 and 111 was last year (really, 17-0 at Championship?) there will probably never be another robot that will be described as pure dominance. This isn't because no team is good enough but because it isn't in the best interests of FIRST to let it happen.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

When people refer to Beatty proofing a game this is what they are talking about. In 2001 and 2002 Beatty figured out how to beat the game, period. they weren't playing the other teams so much as the GDC.

They last few years (2005-present IMO) the GDC has tried to pick a way they want the game to be played preventing these stratagies, and they've done a pretty good job. Switching to 3 team alliances also contributed to the fall off of the unbeatable robot. In some respects these changes make the game more exciting, but a part of me will always miss the "$@#$@#$@#$@# the torpedos", method of creating crazy stratagies from the first half of the decade where one robot could do it all.

Anyway as some one who has faced off against Beatty in the late rounds of chanpionship a few times I will say there are no other teams that can make you feel like you've lost before the match is played.

If a team were a team of the decade it's Beatty with 4 championship finals this decade, and more influence over the way games are played than any other team. After that the list of teams in the hunt is really just ThunderChickens, HOT, Wildstang, Simbots and Cheesy Poofs depending what criteria you use.

My $0.02
Pete

Re: Team of the Decade
 

It seems like 2004 might've been the final straw.

GDC right before kickoff: "Okay, so we've got two different scoring objects, two types of goal and an end of the match goal that is completely different from the other ones. Seems pretty Beatty proof."

GDC on Einstein (after 71 has collected 5 point balls, capped a doubler, moved the mobile goal and hung for the win): "Darn."

I'm a little disappointed, I think Beatty wrapping the rack by themselves in 2007 would've been a pretty sweet sight. :D

Recently they've limited us (whether it's the number of game pieces, or making us fit inside a box after the match starts) instead of giving us several game options. I loved having multiple choices.

Re: Team of the Decade
 

I must say, after the close to the 2010 season and the recent events down in Atlanta...
67 is now undoubtedly my pick.
71, a close second.

Any other opinions change?