Kicking Clarification???
 

So I have been informed by another team that we are only allowed to kick the ball every 20 seconds and i havent found anything in the manual. If anyone knows anything about this rule, please let me know.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

The rule is 2 seconds, not 20. You must wait at least 2 seconds between kicks. Probably a typo on your friend's part. This rule is in the manual, though I don't know the exact number off the top of my head.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

Would be funny (or not) if you only kick ten balls per match... :D

But, if your kick mechanism extends outside BUMPER ZONE, you'll have to wait 2 seconds between each kick!

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

Rule <G30-a>. And notice that it only applies if your kicker goes outside your FRAME PERIMETER. If it stays inside, there is no limit on kicking frequency.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

I'm sorry by have told BUMPER ZONE. It's FRAME PERIMETER the correct!

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

Yes, very true. Thanks for pointing that out.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

thanks, saved me a horrible game

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

I think the goal of that prank was to get you to read the rules....did it work? :)

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

Just so everyone is sure...

<G30> ROBOT Volume – During a MATCH, no part of the ROBOT shall extend outside the vertical projection of the FRAME PERIMETER, except as follows:
a. BALL Interaction Volume – Solely for the purposes of interacting with a BALL, MECHANISMS that are below the BUMPER may extend up to the BUMPER PERIMETER, for a period not exceeding two seconds. After returning inside the FRAMER PERIMETER, such MECHANISMS are not permitted to re-extend beyond the FRAME PERIMETER for at least two seconds.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

This brings up something that has been on my mind for the past couple days.

The rules quoted above me have 2 different 2-second timers. So simply saying "2 seconds between kicks" is not entirely accurate (that is, if I'm interpreting them correctly)

The first timer starts when you break the plane of the frame perimeter, and the second timer starts when you retract back within the frame perimeter.

Unless your kicks take zero seconds, there's really no way to kick twice with only 2.0 seconds between them.

Which brings me to my reason for being in here ... our kicker is spring loaded. We have some "tethers" that will eliminate any chance of breaking out of the bumper zone, but immediately after the kick we will probably oscillate back and forth across the frame perimeter a few times before the grabber grabs it and brings it back for the 2nd shot.

At first, I was worried that we'd violate the first rule since our kicker will probably cross the frame perimeter a few times before we grab it again. After some head scratching, my team and I have surmised that as long as we reach out, grab, and retract the kicker within that first 2-second timer, then hold it inside for at least 2 seconds, then we're A-OK.

Thoughts?

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

that should work but ars long as you find a way to keep it inside the frame perimeter for those 2 seconds.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

Sort of. Our robot's kicker doesn't even extend outside the robot's frame. We could even kick a ball every .2 seconds with out being penalized, if that were possible.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

This sounds illegal to me. The rule says

After the mechanism returns inside the FRAME PERIMETER the first time, it cannot go outside the FRAME PERIMETER again for two seconds. So....if it goes out, then comes back in, it needs to wait two seconds before going out again. I think you'll need to control the oscillations. Or try limiting the travel so it cannot go past the frame perimeter--we found that we would not gain significant kicking distance with the extra 3" travel, so ours does not leave the frame.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

(emphasis mine)

That's what I was worried about. My original concerns are exactly as you describe. I was later talked out of it by kinda' "lawyering" the phrase

I was hoping that during that 2 seconds, a few back-and-forths across the line would be OK, then I'd hold it inside for another 2-second count to ensure compliance with the 2nd part of that rule.

Hmmm.

Re: Kicking Clarification???
 

If y'all gotta lawyer the rule to be legal, then y'all should be reading the text at the beginning of Section 8.3: 2 seconds means 2 seconds. It doesn't mean "out for 1/8 second, in for 1/16 second, repeat until out of time, wait 2 seconds, do it all again".