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Doc Wu 13-03-2010 15:31

Clowns or Announcers?
 
Watching a few regionals online today and I've got to wonder what some of the announcers/MCs are thinking in putting their costumes together.

I have nothing against the occasional Hawaiian shirt, sports jersey, or colored hair. It's all part of the spirit of the event, but I'm seeing one guy in a Silver Lab Coat, a big floppy hat, silly sunglasses, pants rolled up to show his colorful knee-socks and purple canvas sneakers. He'd feel right at home with Barnum & Bailey.

And that's just one example.

This strikes me as a little condescending to our kids. Do they really think this is what they want to see at a competition? Our teams are made up of High School aged kids, young adults, not children. They are world-wise and sophisticated in 2010 and I doubt that they are impressed by such theatrics.

The best announcers are those with a real personality, not one they pull out of their closet. They know the FIRST program and the teams and share that knowledge with the audience as they do their job.

Am I the only one that feels slightly put off by the clown suits or is that really what everyone wants? Or is it just a case of some adults once again completely out of touch with young people?

George A. 13-03-2010 15:44

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Being an annoucer for FIRST since 2006, I can say that at each competition I wear a different Hawaiian shirt, as well as spray paint my hair different colors.


Also, some differentiation has to be made from MC's and announcers. An announcer should be heard and not seen, so my dressing up is purely for my benefit and to make some of the volunteers smile.

The MC's on the other hand, are a completely different story. They are the face of the regional, and are meant to stand out to the crowd. Often times this involves wearing jewelery, a Hawaiian shirt or painting their hair.

Some of the things that you are describing could be coming from the teams themselves. Some teams don't have flags or banners to wear around, so they might give the MC a cape, a hat or the like. If that is the case the MC is simply doing to to give the teams some spirit. If they are wearing the things that you described out of their own ambition, then that is their flair they are trying to add to the competition.

However, I can't speak for all announcers or MC's in the organization. But it isn't an easy thing to keep an audience entertained for 2 days worth of competition.

Doc Wu 13-03-2010 16:24

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by George A. (Post 936342)
Being an annoucer for FIRST since 2006, I can say that at each competition I wear a different Hawaiian shirt, as well as spray paint my hair different colors.


Also, some differentiation has to be made from MC's and announcers. An announcer should be heard and not seen, so my dressing up is purely for my benefit and to make some of the volunteers smile.

I wasn't sure of the correct term. If the announcer is the guy behind the scenes, then I am talking about the MC.
Quote:


The MC's on the other hand, are a completely different story. They are the face of the regional, and are meant to stand out to the crowd. Often times this involves wearing jewelery, a Hawaiian shirt or painting their hair.

Some of the things that you are describing could be coming from the teams themselves. Some teams don't have flags or banners to wear around, so they might give the MC a cape, a hat or the like. If that is the case the MC is simply doing to to give the teams some spirit. If they are wearing the things that you described out of their own ambition, then that is their flair they are trying to add to the competition.

However, I can't speak for all announcers or MC's in the organization. But it isn't an easy thing to keep an audience entertained for 2 days worth of competition.
No, I'm not talking about the hats and flags that teams bring out. And, again, I have nothing against the shirt/hair color, just going too over the top with it all. There's a point where it stops being a display of spirit and becomes a costume used to attract attention. It's demeaning to our students to imply that we need a clownish figure to keep their attention.

We have some great announcers and MCs who entertain and educate while doing their jobs, regardless of what they wear. I know a few whose knowledge of the teams and the game can only be described as encyclopedic. That's what I enjoy.

Wetzel 13-03-2010 17:00

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
The MC at Chesapeake put himself through college as a professional clown.

Wetzel

BrendanB 13-03-2010 17:02

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wetzel (Post 936376)
The MC at Chesapeake put himself through college as a professional clown.

Wetzel

Are you serious?

TubaMorg 13-03-2010 17:06

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

We have some great announcers and MCs who entertain and educate while doing their jobs, regardless of what they wear.
This is perhaps the most pertinent point you made in your argument. Relax and let them have some fun.

jgannon 13-03-2010 17:48

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
This strikes me as a little condescending to our kids. Do they really think this is what they want to see at a competition? Our teams are made up of High School aged kids, young adults, not children. They are world-wise and sophisticated in 2010 and I doubt that they are impressed by such theatrics.

I am far beyond high school, and I am indeed impressed by such theatrics. I know that my students enjoy it too. I've seen more than a few very reserved kids come out of their shells in response to the zany antics in front of them on the field.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
Or is it just a case of some adults once again completely out of touch with young people?

So far I'm only seeing one such adult.

BrendanB 13-03-2010 17:51

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Personally, there is a certain aspect of being fun and having a good time and remaining professional. I don't see emcees at FLL events get all decked out like some FRC emcees do.

Andrew Y. 13-03-2010 18:16

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
its what a volunteer wants to do. its not illegal or dangerous in any way. Whats the problem?

George A. 13-03-2010 18:30

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrendanB (Post 936410)
Personally, there is a certain aspect of being fun and having a good time and remaining professional. I don't see emcees at FLL events get all decked out like some FRC emcees do.

Often times at FTC and FLL events the MC keeps it low key because there is so much going on that there is little down time. With 6-10 tables at a typical competition, there is usually action continuously.

However, at FRC regionals/championships, there is a LOT of downtime between the matches, and as such the MC has to ramp it up a few levels otherwise it would just be the audience sitting back watching a person in another volunteer shirt.

Steve W 13-03-2010 18:45

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I guess that it is all one perception. I am one who wears colorful shirts and hair to match. I also do the exact same thing at FLL, FTC and VEX events. I don't do it because I want to be noticed (but I do get noticed) but rather to give the kids a little fun. Mine started with team 48 wanting to do my hair at Championships and just "flourished" from there. At most FIRST events when I don't do my hair then I can go virtually unrecognized for a long time.

The benefits of coloring hair brings a lot of questions especially when I am not at the arena. It gives me the chance to promote the event. At the event people seem to know that they can ask me questions and I will find the answers. When touring the pits I can be found by anyone looking for me.

I guess there is a limit but I have worn pink ears and pig tail at the same time as some fairy wings so I am not sure were that limit is. As an EMCEE my goal is to make teams feel good about themselves and promote them as much as I can. Would I come to an event like a clown? No but a parrot on steroids, maybe.

DarkFlame145 13-03-2010 18:47

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Its all fun, I mean if there is a problem with the field, someones gotta entertain the crowd since they can last 5, 10, sometimes 15 mins. Plus after MCing for 3 days they gotta keep it interesting for them-selfs.

Richard Wallace 13-03-2010 19:05

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
^ (Well said.)

One measure of the inspiration that FIRST generates is the curious fact that, during the delays brought on by technical difficulties, team members of all ages frequently dance and shout with expressions of joy on their faces. Emcees and game announcers pump that inspiration.

Volunteers who have their heads down working hard to clear a technical problem REALLY appreciate other volunteers who, with their eye-catching attire and engaging vocals, are working just as hard to maintain the energy level.

synth3tk 13-03-2010 19:29

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
You mention the teams are made up of high school students, young adults. You are correct.

But FIRST is meant to be more than just for the teams. You realize that there are people in the public? Non-teammates? Young siblings, older parents, etc. I don't think it's condescending at all. A little fun never hurt anyone.

Edoc'sil 13-03-2010 20:37

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Plain and simple, they're an eyesore that has annoyed me form day one.

Mark Rozitis 13-03-2010 20:40

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve W (Post 936443)
I guess that it is all one perception. I am one who wears colorful shirts and hair to match. I also do the exact same thing at FLL, FTC and VEX events. I don't do it because I want to be noticed (but I do get noticed) but rather to give the kids a little fun. Mine started with team 48 wanting to do my hair at Championships and just "flourished" from there. At most FIRST events when I don't do my hair then I can go virtually unrecognized for a long time.

The benefits of coloring hair brings a lot of questions especially when I am not at the arena. It gives me the chance to promote the event. At the event people seem to know that they can ask me questions and I will find the answers. When touring the pits I can be found by anyone looking for me.

I guess there is a limit but I have worn pink ears and pig tail at the same time as some fairy wings so I am not sure were that limit is. As an EMCEE my goal is to make teams feel good about themselves and promote them as much as I can. Would I come to an event like a clown? No but a parrot on steroids, maybe.

You are correct that without the tri-colored hair you are totally unrecognizable, "some" costume and color is fun, maybe some go a bit too far and it ends up looking a bit silly although I have never seen that in Ontario.

I do hope they bring back the mascot dance this year at waterloo and GTR, they had that back in Aim high and it was great video for TV and now that we are back on carpet why not?

Hopefully the DJ plays all the right music to keep the crowd energized and on it's feet as well this year as well.

George A. 13-03-2010 20:44

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edoc'sil (Post 936476)
Plain and simple, they're an eyesore that has annoyed me form day one.

What specifically has annoyed you?

JaneYoung 13-03-2010 20:51

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
There are teams in FRC who spend a lot of time helping to create a team image of fun and excitement during the competitions. They spike their hair and color it. Some have wonderful 'costumes' to enhance their image. The emcees understand and help celebrate the spirit of fun at the competitions.They also work very hard to help keep the matches on time and the event running smoothly, and part of what they bring to the event is their showmanship. If they wear a vest or coat covered with buttons that the teams have enthusiastically given them and if they share in the fun and excitement of the event by dressing up and/or coloring their hair, more power to them. For many, an FRC competition is an opportunity to share the joy and the fun of being involved in a robotics event and to celebrate what it took to get there. What it took to get there involved problem solving, learning to be a part of a team working towards a common goal, and meeting a challenge. The emcees are well aware of what it takes to arrive at the field, ready to play. Jubilation and celebration have nothing to do with condescension but they have everything to do with fun. Some of the hardest fun at the competition.

Maybe some day it will change but I hope that day doesn't come anytime soon.

Jane

Edoc'sil 13-03-2010 21:14

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by George A. (Post 936480)
What specifically has annoyed you?

Mostly the fact that you need a welding mask to look directly at them most of the time.

The other reason is that I find their act to be extremely unprofessional.

I have been told that I hate fun a time of two before, so quite likely my view is overly pessimistic, I just wish the competitions had a bit more of a serious air.

Kimmeh 13-03-2010 21:23

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edoc'sil (Post 936498)
Mostly the fact that you need a welding mask to look directly at them most of the time.

The other reason is that I find their act to be extremely unprofessional.

I have been told that I hate fun a time of two before, so quite likely my view is overly pessimistic, I just wish the competitions had a bit more of a serious air.

I've found that the competitions are quite serious. A quick check in the pits or on a driver's face during a match will show that. However, the field and the stands should be a fun place to be. It's a place where everyone is there for the fun and excitement of the event. A lot would be lost from competitions if there wasn't any dancing or "field entertainment." That's what will make your memories.

Or, remember that this is a program targeted towards high schoolers and we like to have fun. :D

pathew100 13-03-2010 21:25

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Rozitis (Post 936478)
I do hope they bring back the mascot dance this year at waterloo and GTR, they had that back in Aim high and it was great video for TV and now that we are back on carpet why not?

Shouldn't be a problem as long as you have a decent field crash or two. :D

Edoc'sil 13-03-2010 21:33

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kimmeh (Post 936502)
I've found that the competitions are quite serious. A quick check in the pits or on a driver's face during a match will show that. However, the field and the stands should be a fun place to be. It's a place where everyone is there for the fun and excitement of the event. A lot would be lost from competitions if there wasn't any dancing or "field entertainment." That's what will make your memories.

Or, remember that this is a program targeted towards high schoolers and we like to have fun. :D

Don't get me wrong I, enjoy the rest of the festivities, just not the MCs usually. Their act is funny for the first 6 hours, but its the next 12 where it gets old.

DarkFlame145 13-03-2010 21:43

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Edoc'sil (Post 936498)
Mostly the fact that you need a welding mask to look directly at them most of the time.

The other reason is that I find their act to be extremely unprofessional.

I have been told that I hate fun a time of two before, so quite likely my view is overly pessimistic, I just wish the competitions had a bit more of a serious air.

But your missing the best part of FRC and the rest of FIRST, to have fun and learn. If your not having fun, smiling, and or laughing, what is the point? I tell everyone that asks me if it sucks to lose "Yes it does, until I realize how much fun I had." Being serious is ok, but dont be too serious and suck all the fun out of it. Win or lose, if I have fun and enjoyed myself, I had a great time. Winning is awesome, but not everything. The MCs need to be able to cut loose a little. When I first saw Steve at FLR I thought it was so cool how he had his hair painted and would make jokes just for the sake of entertainment. I have never seen a MC go over the line and be unprofessional. Remember you dont have to be 100% straight cut and in a suit to be professional. I mean look at Dean with his Jeans, Jean shirt and he makes jokes when talking while still being professional. Sorry for beating the dead horse so many times =P

BrendanB 13-03-2010 21:48

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark Rozitis (Post 936478)
Hopefully the DJ plays all the right music to keep the crowd energized and on it's feet as well this year as well.

YES! That is exactly what keeps the crowd going! Not playing Sweet Caroline for the 6th time or the electric slide. What keeps the crowd going is the music, not the number of colors someone is wearing or how oddly dressed. I don't care if they have dyed hair or a Hawaiian t-shirt, but when they have some really weird ghettup, I am totally tuned out/not enthused by them.

Good DJ and music=good/enthused competition, sorry guys!:(

Kate00 13-03-2010 22:05

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
In my opinion, it doesn't matter what the emcee wears, so long as there is substance to what he/she is saying.

Take the most entertaining emcee/announcer team that I've seen (in all the events I've seen via webcast/live): Karthik and Paul Copioli. Neither of them have bright hair; Karthik wears his Delgado jersey, Paul some other jersey that I can't remember. Yet they are still extremely entertaining, keep the crowd pumped up, and are (from what I've seen) one of the most enjoyed/talked about teams.

While sometimes colour and accessories can be fun, I think that it can become a bit of a crutch for some emcees. While they are entertaining in a juvenile way, I find that stories, innovative introductions and other interesting facts much more so than someone dancing around in a silly costume. It holds my interest and gets me pumped up so much more. In watching some webcasts this weekend, I was disappointed by the presentation of the elimination rounds. I guess that comes from being used to hearing about all the connections between teams, about the history and things that make the individual teams special.

I guess I'm agreeing with the original poster. If you read what he actually says, he seems to be saying that some costumes seem to be a bit over the the top and distracting from what the actual message of the emcees should be. He's not saying "don't dress up;" what I read was that he's saying "don't sacrifice substance for style," and "I don't enjoy when the emcee looks extremely ridiculous all the time, I feel it brings down the tone of the event." He's not saying "emcees should wear event shirts and be serious and never wear stuff from teams and never dance," which is what most of the posts in here are arguing against. I find his view to be very reasonable.

Steve W 14-03-2010 01:00

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Kate, I wish that I had Karthik's memory. By the time I hit the field I have forgotten some of the things I wanted to say. He can remember things from 10 years ago. He is definitely a brighter mind than I.

Steven Sigley 14-03-2010 01:06

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Our Team loves Blair.

Just saying.
:D

MC's that have energy and really talk and interact with the teams are the best, whether they act goofy or not.

Though I'll say it is more fun if they're running all up and down the field jumping on stuff.

One of my earliest memories in FIRST is of Blair hanging on the swinging rack in 2007 gesturing towards each alliance during the finals asking the crowd who they wanted to win.

Racer26 14-03-2010 01:43

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate Mosley (Post 936531)
In my opinion, it doesn't matter what the emcee wears, so long as there is substance to what he/she is saying.

Take the most entertaining emcee/announcer team that I've seen (in all the events I've seen via webcast/live): Karthik and Paul Copioli. Neither of them have bright hair; Karthik wears his Delgado jersey, Paul some other jersey that I can't remember. Yet they are still extremely entertaining, keep the crowd pumped up, and are (from what I've seen) one of the most enjoyed/talked about teams.

While sometimes colour and accessories can be fun, I think that it can become a bit of a crutch for some emcees. While they are entertaining in a juvenile way, I find that stories, innovative introductions and other interesting facts much more so than someone dancing around in a silly costume. It holds my interest and gets me pumped up so much more. In watching some webcasts this weekend, I was disappointed by the presentation of the elimination rounds. I guess that comes from being used to hearing about all the connections between teams, about the history and things that make the individual teams special.

I guess I'm agreeing with the original poster. If you read what he actually says, he seems to be saying that some costumes seem to be a bit over the the top and distracting from what the actual message of the emcees should be. He's not saying "don't dress up;" what I read was that he's saying "don't sacrifice substance for style," and "I don't enjoy when the emcee looks extremely ridiculous all the time, I feel it brings down the tone of the event." He's not saying "emcees should wear event shirts and be serious and never wear stuff from teams and never dance," which is what most of the posts in here are arguing against. I find his view to be very reasonable.

+1 to the Karthik/Copioli camp.

Its a shame we'll be missing the new VEX Robotics CEO at Waterloo this year.

1075 has always loved the intros Karthik does. He has an incredible memory for the achievements of various teams.

Also, I will never forget the way he introduced us in eliminations at Waterloo 2009, I think it was, when he said we were trying to make a name for ourselves as one of the Canadian Elite.

Molten 14-03-2010 03:51

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I can sincerely relate to the thoughts of the OP. I admit I can get annoyed easily. Particularly by mascots, loud music(and loud cheering), the exaggerated costumes and the standing in the crowds. Yes, I've heard plenty about "hating fun"...but I just don't get any fun at all out of these things. I just don't. This really bothered me when I started FIRST(particularly while I was a student) but its just a part of the deal. They supply a great experience with the thrill of design and competition. The catch is sometimes you have to put up with some annoyances. Sometimes I don't like it, but I hold nothing against others that choose to have fun in different ways. In fact, if it helps them enjoy it and doesn't annoy me too much...I would encourage it.

Edoc'sil 14-03-2010 03:57

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kate Mosley (Post 936531)
In my opinion, it doesn't matter what the emcee wears, so long as there is substance to what he/she is saying.

Take the most entertaining emcee/announcer team that I've seen (in all the events I've seen via webcast/live): Karthik and Paul Copioli. Neither of them have bright hair; Karthik wears his Delgado jersey, Paul some other jersey that I can't remember. Yet they are still extremely entertaining, keep the crowd pumped up, and are (from what I've seen) one of the most enjoyed/talked about teams.

While sometimes colour and accessories can be fun, I think that it can become a bit of a crutch for some emcees. While they are entertaining in a juvenile way, I find that stories, innovative introductions and other interesting facts much more so than someone dancing around in a silly costume. It holds my interest and gets me pumped up so much more. In watching some webcasts this weekend, I was disappointed by the presentation of the elimination rounds. I guess that comes from being used to hearing about all the connections between teams, about the history and things that make the individual teams special.

I guess I'm agreeing with the original poster. If you read what he actually says, he seems to be saying that some costumes seem to be a bit over the the top and distracting from what the actual message of the emcees should be. He's not saying "don't dress up;" what I read was that he's saying "don't sacrifice substance for style," and "I don't enjoy when the emcee looks extremely ridiculous all the time, I feel it brings down the tone of the event." He's not saying "emcees should wear event shirts and be serious and never wear stuff from teams and never dance," which is what most of the posts in here are arguing against. I find his view to be very reasonable.

Dito on this he said what i was unable to articulate.

Matt Howard 14-03-2010 04:18

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
Our teams are made up of High School aged kids, young adults, not children. They are world-wise and sophisticated in 2010 and I doubt that they are impressed by such theatrics.

I sure was.

I started as a student in FIRST in 2005. I graduated in 2007, and have since gone on to mentor since 2008. I've also volunteered at more than one FIRST event. I've never once thought the MC's dressed up in costumes, wearing beads and sporting colored hair were out of place.

Like others have said they are the face of the regional. To make a Regional event successful the event has to appeal not just to the teams, but to families and spectators as well.

MarcD79 14-03-2010 11:45

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
OK, I get it, some people just don't have an extended sense of humor. I'm 49 and love all the commotion. When I'm not volunteering, I am painted up, just like the students. The MC has to entertain in between rounds. That is his job. During rounds you just hear him.
To Edoc'sil; lighten up it sounds like you are getting too tense. Enjoy what life gives you. These drivers need some entertainment to help keep them calm. Besides, the Competition is for the students, not the adults.

JaneYoung 14-03-2010 13:14

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
This discussion may touch on some of the reasons an FRC event is unique and does not easily fit into any mold already created by athletic or sports events. It also doesn't fit into a competition such as a chess competition. It definitely doesn't fit into the beauty pageant mold, although some of the robots are beautiful sleek machines.

Pairing the energy, enthusiasm, and curiosity of students with the energy, enthusiasm, curiosity, knowledge, and experience of mentors - creates a mold that continues to change shape through seasons and competitions. Many of the emcees have been and are valued mentors on teams and in their communities. They, themselves, are steeped in wisdom, experience, and knowledge - about many teams and many regions. They are also still very curious and want to learn more and know more and share more with each year of growth and development in FRC.

Students on FRC teams are exposed to the excitement of the competitions and the opportunities to participate and enjoy the fun - embracing who they are and what they have achieved - perhaps something they've never done before or thought they could ever do. Being smart isn't always easy. Being shy can be difficult. Not everyone likes the loud competitions/the noise factor. By Saturday, many feel the effects of the journey they've taken to get to Saturday afternoon, starting with Kick Off.

I've known students who love being on the team and participating in build but don't enjoy travel or the competitions. They have chosen to stay home instead of going. That's just fine. It doesn't mean that anything is wrong or that anyone should judge them because they don't like noise or watching the competitions. It means that being on a FRC team means many things to many people. Not everyone is going to like everything about it, including the color of an emcee's hair. But - enough people are and they will fill the stands and have a great time.

Can events be improved? Sure - that's part of the process, too. Looking over the season and seeing what works and what doesn't work and where improvements can be made. If people have sincere issues regarding their perception of clowns on the field, contact FIRST directly and voice the concerns to them. While writing, it would be good to commend the emcees and all the other volunteers - for their time and their commitment to the program. I doubt that FIRST's inbox is overflowing with thank yous but I could be wrong.

Jane

RoboMom 14-03-2010 13:36

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I would encourage everyone who has an interest in the topic to give feedback to their local planning committee to benefit all the teams, mentors and volunteers, and to the local FIRST staff.
It takes a village of volunteers to put on an event.

Karthik 14-03-2010 15:36

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I read the original post on my way home from Pittsburgh last night and planned a response in my head, but most of it is now superfluous thanks to Kate's typically articulate post.

When I emcee, I treat the role similarly to the role of a sportscaster during a pre-game show. They're there to introduce the action, create excitement and anticipation for the upcoming event and fill in the audience on the backstory that the audience may not be familiar with. I try emulate people like Bob Costas, Joe Buck and Jim Nantz who are both incredibly knowledgeable but also have the ability to weave some humour into their descriptions, without drawing attention away from the actual event. Last time I checked, none of these people dress up like clowns.

Quote:

Am I the only one that feels slightly put off by the clown suits or is that really what everyone wants? Or is it just a case of some adults once again completely out of touch with young people?
Nope, the over the top clown suits put me off as well. I know many others (both mentors and students) who feel the same way. The students have told me they feel like they're being treated like a child.

Tom Bottiglieri 14-03-2010 15:56

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
There are a few students that are already interested in science and technology. These kids will most likely go on to be engineers, and can probably just deal with being treated like small children, as they like the robots.

There are some who are on the fence about going into engineering because they think its "nerdy" or "dorky". I am not sure how dressing up in a clown suit is helping to sway these students' perspective.

Pausert 14-03-2010 16:06

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
For those of you who think these announcers are a detriment to the FRC program, where are the kids that turn away from the game? The ones who aren't captivated by the announcer and their show? I would assume that if the announcers weren't any good there would be an obvious lack of spirit. Right now, we all sit on CD and discuss/complain about the decibel level of events. I assure you thats because people are screaming in excitement, not in pain.

I personally enjoyed the announcer at Chesapeake, his coat and all.

BobC 14-03-2010 16:29

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 936483)

Maybe some day it will change but I hope that day doesn't come anytime soon.

Jane

Jane I am with you I hope that day never comes.

Andy Grady 14-03-2010 17:39

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Ya know, years ago we only had 1 or 2 emcees because there was only one or two regionals a weekend. Now we are getting to the point where there is about a dozen regionals in one week. Planning committees have to reach for people that have experience of any sort to take that role. Despite what it may seem, emceeing an event is not an easy task. An emcee needs to convey a message clearly, be the face of FIRST, and occasionally provide entertainment during downtime. You cannot just take the average person, give them a microphone, and say GO...BE AN EMCEE! Most people would lock up in that situation. As a result, committees reach for people who have some sort of outgoing personality and no fear of a microphone. The number of people who meet that criteria and are willing to take a try are rising. They are getting opportunities because of the large demand for talent with the growing number of regionals. We are now in an age where emcees or announcers are gaining "FIRST Fame" and as a result everyone has their shtick in order to try to get a piece of it. Fact of the matter is that everyone likes a different thing. Personally, I enjoy the humor and entertainment that Blair brings, or the storytelling capability of Karthik or Dave Vebrugge. However, I can guarantee you that there is someone out there who can't stand them either. Fact of the matter is that students and mentors have different tastes.

I recommend that if you have an emcee or an announcer that you really are annoyed by, just talk to a member of your regional committee. If enough people complain, I'm sure they will do something about it. As hard as it can be for those committees to find talent, they certainly do not want to drive you away either. Just be patient...its not easy finding people to fill those roles.

gvarndell 14-03-2010 20:36

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
Am I the only one that feels slightly put off by the clown suits or is that really what everyone wants? Or is it just a case of some adults once again completely out of touch with young people?

It's not something that bothers me.
Looking at many of the kids though I wouldn't say these guys are necessarily out of touch with them.
One thing that always strikes me at FRC competitions is seeing the little nerds reveling in the same kind of self-celebrating bravado the high school jocks have always indulged in.
I'm not sure the clowns aren't just an extension of that weirdness.

robself705 14-03-2010 20:57

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I have to say, the MC's "clowniness" bothers me. Just get a cool, fun-loving announcer up there, you don't need to dress them in circus clothes to get high-schoolers' attention.

BrendanB 14-03-2010 22:09

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Andy Grady (Post 936928)
Ya know, years ago we only had 1 or 2 emcees because there was only one or two regionals a weekend. Now we are getting to the point where there is about a dozen regionals in one week. Planning committees have to reach for people that have experience of any sort to take that role. Despite what it may seem, emceeing an event is not an easy task. An emcee needs to convey a message clearly, be the face of FIRST, and occasionally provide entertainment during downtime. You cannot just take the average person, give them a microphone, and say GO...BE AN EMCEE! Most people would lock up in that situation. As a result, committees reach for people who have some sort of outgoing personality and no fear of a microphone. The number of people who meet that criteria and are willing to take a try are rising. They are getting opportunities because of the large demand for talent with the growing number of regionals. We are now in an age where emcees or announcers are gaining "FIRST Fame" and as a result everyone has their shtick in order to try to get a piece of it. Fact of the matter is that everyone likes a different thing. Personally, I enjoy the humor and entertainment that Blair brings, or the storytelling capability of Karthik or Dave Vebrugge. However, I can guarantee you that there is someone out there who can't stand them either. Fact of the matter is that students and mentors have different tastes.

I recommend that if you have an emcee or an announcer that you really are annoyed by, just talk to a member of your regional committee. If enough people complain, I'm sure they will do something about it. As hard as it can be for those committees to find talent, they certainly do not want to drive you away either. Just be patient...its not easy finding people to fill those roles.

Speaking of being behind the microphone *cough, where were you at BAE? I heard you in at least one of our matches and really liked it! My family and grandfather noticed it too about how you were much better than some other people and we (GSR in the stands) really miss you out there with the microphone! No one does play by play better in New England IMHO!

Don't know if that is a bit off topic from the costumes, but Andy Grady has a balance of professionality, humor, and team history much like Karthik and Paul Copioli.

Tuba4 14-03-2010 23:48

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve W (Post 936640)
Kate, I wish that I had Karthik's memory. By the time I hit the field I have forgotten some of the things I wanted to say. He can remember things from 10 years ago. He is definitely a brighter mind than I.

Amen to that. When I spoke to Karthik at Pittsburgh, he called me by name before I could re-introduce myself, even though we last spoke a year or 2 ago. He remembered regionals where we had spoken and people we had spoken about.

R1ffSurf3r 15-03-2010 16:19

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Bottiglieri (Post 936859)
There are some who are on the fence about going into engineering because they think its "nerdy" or "dorky". I am not sure how dressing up in a clown suit is helping to sway these students' perspective.

Most of the people I know don't view engineering as nerdy, but as something that is way over their heads, and out of their reach. Many think that they just aren't smart or complex enough for it. So in a way, MCs make it seem more fun and something not as far away as they may have previously thought.

my 2 cents

KathieK 15-03-2010 21:33

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I am married to one such "clown." Funny thing is, I was the former professional clown, not Jack!

"Jack in the Hat" wears a tie-dyed custom-made tuxedo with the FIRST logo embroidered on the back. And a top hat adorned with FIRST pins. He may look "clownish" to some. But he takes his job as emcee very seriously. He recognizes the importance and responsibility of the role. He volunteers as emcee at FLL, FTC and FRC events. His costume is his team uniform, so to speak.

Sometimes the colorful garb is what captures the attention of the media. Last year the clip of Jack made the local, regional and national news. We may prefer that they focus on other parts of the events, but if the media chooses to show a colorful FIRSTer, I'm all for it.

The music, team spirit, dancing, hair painting, etc. is what makes this different from just a science fair. I say, let's keep the clowns. But then again, I like clowns! :)

Molten 15-03-2010 21:43

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KathieK (Post 937641)
I say, let's keep the clowns. But then again, I like clowns! :)

Can we make a compromise of no mimes? Everyone hates a mime.:rolleyes:

BrendanB 15-03-2010 22:13

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Molten (Post 937650)
Can we make a compromise of no mimes? Everyone hates a mime.:rolleyes:

No, hate is too harsh, more like petrified! *shudders

Kims Robot 15-03-2010 23:04

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Its an interesting day in FIRST when we have TIME to complain about the Announcers/MC's...

I'll agree there is more than one catch phrase that I cringe at when the volume is turned up way too loud at champs... but then again I can't stand Emeril's BAM!! either.

I didnt get a chance to watch a lot of webcasts this year, so I guess I missed the bizzare outfits, but I happen to know several announcers & MC's and my husband fills both roles at the Clarkson FLL/FTC tournament.

For all of you suggesting "go complain to the regional committee" I would say go a step further. Get to know one of these crazy announcers or MC's. Find them at a competition and introduce yourself... JOIN THEM FOR DINNER... I am constantly shocked at with all the fanfare they get, they often head off to dinner alone, eat at the hotels/whatever. Go get to know them. I've known Steve as long as I have been in Rochester, and he helped us get the Ruckus off the ground! We still joke that our friend's bathroom is still covered in hairpaint from the hours he spent doing his hair in the morning. And I wish half the guys I knew had his sense of style - he matches his HAIR to his shirt!! Most guys I know cant match their pants to their shirt! JonDarr has done FLR for the last several years, and is a phenomenal announcer, did anyone know he also works for NASA and has put together some amazing educational programs??

I'm amazed that we have such dedicated, excited role models all over FIRST that help Announce & MC our events. Sometimes they get a bit theatrical... Dave riding in on a motocycle, Blair rollerblading across the field... Woodie repelled from the ceiling... That these crazy engineers and scientists can grab a microphone and help us understand the game as well as be inspirational role models to our students is awesome. They dont have to go hire some washed up ex-football player to announce our games, we have REAL engineers running our show!!

Again, I haven't watched every event or webcast, so maybe I'm fortunate enough to have missed all the condescension, because in my 15 years I have never seen it.

More of a novel than I intended to write, and I will agree that we don't need to make this a show for 3 year olds all the time, but we do need to make it fun and exciting for all ages, not just those of us who are already entrenched and hooked. If loud music annoys you, bring earplugs, if bright hairspray annoys you, bring sunglasses, if enthusiasm for engineering annoys you, ask yourself why you are here.

Madification 16-03-2010 00:23

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I think the students feed off of the energy of the MC and at the regionals that I've been to, the MC (while decked out,) is still not as crazy as some of the students. This included me at one time: hair died red, black, and yellow (team colors), wearing football pads with stuffed squirrels ziptied on them (team mascott,) red cape with giant squirrel and "Go Nuts" on the back (team motto) and a tall "Cat in the Hat" hat. FIRST is about having fun and being yourself without worrying about what other people think of you I believe. And as several others have said having fun has never hurt anyone and if you don't enjoy a FIRST event then obviously you need to chil-lax!

gvarndell 16-03-2010 05:40

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Woodie repelled from the ceiling...
So that's what keeps me on the floor.
Which makes me wonder -- does the ceiling repel more massive objects more forcefully than it repels less massive objects?
Jeesh, I hope Woodie had a safety net.
:D

CGuenther 16-03-2010 11:12

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I agree with everyone who has said that the point is simply to entertain and maybe inspire some of the less outgoing kids to come out of their shell. Those students that are actually "world-wise and sophisticated" should be able to see the crazy getup as exactly what it is; entertainment. And those kids who are not quite world-wise and sophisticated yet (the same kids that this program is supposed to inspire and motivate to achieve greater things) may see that trying crazy things isn't really so bad.

JaneYoung 16-03-2010 11:18

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by gvarndell (Post 937866)
Jeesh, I hope Woodie had a safety net.
:D

None of the photos that I've seen show a safety net but he's a pretty smart guy - he probably created his own.

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/31143

Edit: I absolutely LOVE mimes. Can you imagine a mime assisting or mimicking some of our emcees and speakers? That would be so much fun.

synth3tk 16-03-2010 12:40

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kims Robot (Post 937752)
JonDarr has done FLR for the last several years, and is a phenomenal announcer, did anyone know he also works for NASA and has put together some amazing educational programs??

Just a side-story, off-topic:

There was/is this program at a local community college in Cleveland. SEMAA, if I recall. Science, Engineering, Mathematics and Aerospace Academy. He was a teacher (I guess that's what they're called) for the 7th/8th grade, I think. He introduced me to Civil Air Patrol, and is also part of the reason why I'm in FIRST today. While he never directly told me about FIRST, I remember him mentioning the program during one of the "classes". My dad took me to the regional, and I was hooked ever since.

JonDarr is a fascinating person, who has a love for what he does. As far as I can remember, he has announced at Buckeye for the last few years.

Doc Wu 16-03-2010 12:56

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Karthik (Post 936851)
I read the original post on my way home from Pittsburgh last night and planned a response in my head, but most of it is now superfluous thanks to Kate's typically articulate post.

When I emcee, I treat the role similarly to the role of a sportscaster during a pre-game show. They're there to introduce the action, create excitement and anticipation for the upcoming event and fill in the audience on the backstory that the audience may not be familiar with. I try emulate people like Bob Costas, Joe Buck and Jim Nantz who are both incredibly knowledgeable but also have the ability to weave some humour into their descriptions, without drawing attention away from the actual event. Last time I checked, none of these people dress up like clowns.

Nope, the over the top clown suits put me off as well. I know many others (both mentors and students) who feel the same way. The students have told me they feel like they're being treated like a child.

Karthik, you're who I was thinking of when I used the term "Encyclopedic!" You know how to keep people engaged in the competition with your knowledge and humor.

Steve W. has just about the right balance with his colored hair and bright shirts, without going overboard. He and JonDarr are a great team as well.

The female MC at the NYC and Philly regionals who wears the flowers in her hair is good too. Her enthusiasm alone would be enough to notice her, but she's developed a "trademark" look so you recognize her instantly.

Someone mentioned Dave Verbrugge. I haven't been at the right regionals and have missed seeing him for a few years, but he's outstanding as well.

It seems like a lot of you are trying to rebut my statement by citing the MCs who I feel are doing it right. I think we're all saying the same thing, but from different angles.

If you're up in the stands and look at the field, full of referees, team members and field reset volunteers running around, and a voice comes out of the PA system, it's nice to have something to spot so you can home in on the MC when he/she speaks, so I get that. I just think there's a limit where too much of it becomes a bit tasteless. That point may vary widely for different people.

Alan Anderson 16-03-2010 13:13

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 937974)
Edit: I absolutely LOVE mimes. Can you imagine a mime assisting or mimicking some of our emcees and speakers? That would be so much fun.

I've seen professional sports mascots doing that. It can be fun, yes.

But...mimes? Jane, it's a good thing I don't give red dots for matters of taste. :P

JaneYoung 16-03-2010 13:21

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson (Post 938027)

But...mimes? Jane, it's a good thing I don't give red dots for matters of taste. :P

I did sound effects for a mime troupe in college. :)
I love mimes.

P.S. I hear ya, Doc

Lil' Lavery 16-03-2010 15:43

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
In terms of MCs who do it right, how has Jeff Seaton not been mentioned? He's one of the elite, and arguably the best, MCs in all of FIRST. He keeps the events lively in a professional and enthusiastic manner. HIs wardrobe is not over the top in itself, but he'll wear just about anything that a team offers him to wear for their match (including 203's soup can) and has a great sense of humor. There's a reason he's one of the division MCs at Championship each year, he's excellent.
And he's arguably an even better game announcer than he is an MC, as he's shown during the last two Washington DC regionals where he's deferred the MCing job to Blair.

Jeff manages to stay both professional and entertaining. He's not uptight about what he'll wear or do with the teams on the field, and it helps engage both the drive teams, the team's "fans," and the crowd as a whole. But that's his style, and it would not work for every MC.

Some MCs work off of their wardrobe and "gags." They would be out of their element and even worse if they didn't. That's how they engage the audience, and I would prefer them to engage the audience rather than to be boring.

Racer26 16-03-2010 16:14

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Kims Robot (Post 937752)
I'll agree there is more than one catch phrase that I cringe at when the volume is turned up way too loud at champs... but then again I can't stand Emeril's BAM!! either.

Heh. Not sure I'll ever forget some of the catch phrases Paul Copioli came up with in concert with Karthik at 2008 Waterloo Regional.

Tetraman 16-03-2010 17:05

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
When I get to be an MC someday, I'm going to wear these pants and wear a pied red and blue hawaiian shirt I plan on sewing together. It's not an attempt to be an attention grabber beyond the teams, but to show off that I've got as much excitement for FIRST as the teams in attendance.

And my choice of attire is probably why I have yet to be an MC...haha.

Racer26 16-03-2010 17:23

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Theres always clothing made out of former FRC game pieces. I recall seeing some skirts or something made from 2007's Keepers.

Molten 16-03-2010 19:43

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BrendanB (Post 937688)
No, hate is too harsh, more like petrified! *shudders

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 937974)

Edit: I absolutely LOVE mimes. Can you imagine a mime assisting or mimicking some of our emcees and speakers? That would be so much fun.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alan Anderson (Post 938027)
I've seen professional sports mascots doing that. It can be fun, yes.

But...mimes? Jane, it's a good thing I don't give red dots for matters of taste. :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaneYoung (Post 938031)
I did sound effects for a mime troupe in college. :)
I love mimes.

Wow, it sure is easy to cause a detour.

GaryVoshol 16-03-2010 19:57

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
OK, since we're talking about mimes ...

Before one match the MC was missing when it was time for team introductions. I told the announcer we'd have to do it in mime. I went out onto the field and made some motions and pointed my ref flag at the team, expecting to hear, "It's team 9999 from Some School!" Didn't work; the announcer hadn't understood what I meant. By the time I went over to explain myself, the MC was back.

Carlee10 16-03-2010 22:25

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I really never thought the outfits or what-have-you were an issue.... I would just like for them to be well-spoken, and comfortable in front of us. It doesn't help when you MC and your personality or speaking skills don't translate and we feel uncomfortable. The way a MC acts affects the whole feel of the regional. I really don't mind much how they dress.

I find the people who don't enjoy the general atmosphere are persons who don't like crowds, loud noise, or big places. And thats totally cool, but it's prolly to much for 3 action packed days at a regional. That could be waaaaaaaay too much.

2cents.

Dancin103 16-03-2010 22:28

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by 1075guy (Post 938225)
Theres always clothing made out of former FRC game pieces. I recall seeing some skirts or something made from 2007's Keepers.

Yes, and don't forget Barry and Bethany's Prom outfits made out of track balls.

Cass

Dan Richardson 16-03-2010 22:33

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 938018)
I just think there's a limit where too much of it becomes a bit tasteless.

Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man...

Stephen Kowski 16-03-2010 23:07

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
Am I the only one that feels slightly put off by the clown suits or is that really what everyone wants? Or is it just a case of some adults once again completely out of touch with young people?

who knows if you are, hopefully i guess

less? I say we need more costumes....maybe if we had 5 or 6 announcers jump out of a tiny clown car, that'd be a start

Barry Bonzack 16-03-2010 23:24

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
This is the way I heard it best from Woodie Flowers, but i'm not putting it in quotes because I don't recall precise wording.

All FIRST volunteers should act how we want the students to act. If the volunteers are a bunch of professional stiffs then who is encouraging teams to dress up and cheer like they would for a sporting event?

This applies to all volunteers, I believe he was referring to the judges and their funny hats they wore at a competition.

JaneYoung 17-03-2010 08:59

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
One of the great things about this thread is that images start coming to mind when thinking of announcers and emcees. There are many photos here in CD that highlight the antics and moments that have made the events so memorable. There are also the competitions, themselves, and how we were a part of the experience, soaking it up and enjoying ourselves, sometimes amazed at those special highlights and knowing how hard those people were working to give them to us.

Jane

Adam Y. 17-03-2010 09:11

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
This strikes me as a little condescending to our kids. Do they really think this is what they want to see at a competition? Our teams are made up of High School aged kids, young adults, not children. They are world-wise and sophisticated in 2010 and I doubt that they are impressed by such theatrics.

Have you seen Mythbusters? Have you been to MIT? Mythbusters has a man dressing up in random costumes all the time. MIT usually has people performing circus arts like unicycling and juggling.

Doc Wu 18-03-2010 18:31

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam Y. (Post 938537)
Have you seen Mythbusters? Have you been to MIT? Mythbusters has a man dressing up in random costumes all the time. MIT usually has people performing circus arts like unicycling and juggling.

I have seen Mythbusters. I consider myself a fan of that show. The only costumes I remember were either PPE or historical attire, unless you mean Buster?

As for MIT, I assume you mean Massachusetts Institute of Technology and, no, I haven't been there, so I don't know what goes on, but I hope it's a lot of studying...

I think this thread has served it's purpose. Stud Man Dan, yes, it's my opinion. That's what these forums are for...

EricH 18-03-2010 18:38

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Adam Savage is always dressing up as someone/something. Indiana Jones, an astronaut, a crook making a getaway... That's not necessarily historical attire, and often it isn't PPE, either.

Quite often, the others will do something similar--see the superhero special and the various ninja specials. Again, not necessarily historical or PPE.

I think they do it just because it's fun, makes a point, and/or removes the "science is not cool" stereotype.

Ringo5tarr 12-05-2016 14:04

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I was wearing tutus (multiple tutus, all over, not just on my waist), little green John Lennon glasses, a vikings hat, and christmas tree lights at a regional, the only time I worry about condescending adults is when a mentor starts acting high and mighty.

Mr. Tatorscout 12-05-2016 16:35

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 


Don't Be, Just Don't Be!

synth3tk 12-05-2016 19:51

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 

RoboChair 12-05-2016 20:25

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doc Wu (Post 936337)
The best announcers are those with a real personality, not one they pull out of their closet.

A closet would be too small for most(hopefully all) MC's personalities, probably need something more like a warehouse. But at that rate it would still be rather noticeable, it is a warehouse after all.

I know I enjoy a good outfit, with the help of some team members we hand made a chainmaille vest with green highlights and lime logo and I wore it 90% of the time I was at Champs. At 9 pounds it took some effort to wear that thing, so worth it.

And in regards to the necro nature of this thread's revival, however brief it may be.


fhobart 12-05-2016 21:23

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
Get off my lawn!!

Big Ideas 12-05-2016 21:28

Re: Clowns or Announcers?
 
I am amazed by ALL of the MCs. These are people that, in the context of FIRST, said to themselves--This needs to be done, I can do it, I'll try my best. To be engaging to a big group, finding and maintaining a persona, is very important and a lot of work. As far as I know Blair is still the only "Professional" MC in FRC. My silly hat is off to each and every one, Bob Costa-ish to channeling Soupy Sales.

I has a student once that was MC for an FLL qualifier. He started out like an "FRC" student. Very flat/quiet/unengaged. I reminded him that we needed "DJ" Kyle out there (he was a very good party DJ). When he went back out as "DJ Kyle" the energy in the room went up 20X and the event was a huge success. Costume/persona/shtick are very important. If a chance to be bigger then life is your reason to volunteer for MC work, then go for it.

Last thing, for mentors that don't get enjoyment out of the loudness and playacting, LOOK AROUND at your students and everyone else and get YOUR joy out of their unbridled joie de vie.


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