Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

So to straighen this out.

The people who want a full field viewing camera want it to simply watch the match, and be able to watch whatever part of the field they want at any time instead of having a close-up on things they deem unimportant (aka. the ball return, dead robots, single robot struggling with a ball, ect). This side is also generally not at the match or wants to watch past video.

On the other side are people who feel that video needs to be close up and personal in order to be exciting. They feel that if the camera is zoomed out to far people will become bored and will not take interest in FIRST. They also think it won't give good material to work with for highlight reels.

In my opinion the full-field crowd has it right. Although the other side has a good point about the video not being very exciting. Perhaps if at each compitition the matches were all viewed from full field. However, the quarterfinals and Finals were taped by additional cameramen at different/closer angles for highlight reels and showing to future audiences to excite them about FIRST. This way the people who are viewing the webcast are happy, and there are still close-ups for video promotions and exciting people about FIRST.

My two cents

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

I'm not sure that is a fair representation. I think these people (myself included) understand the technology limitations of the current webcasts and archieved video. If the video was 'tv quality' I think the full screen would be ideal, but it's not really close to that good. Maybe in a few years it will get good enough, but until then, I'm afraid the webcasts will look a lot like this video:

http://www.thebluealliance.net/tbatv/match/2010nj_f1m3

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

^ This. If we were broadcasting at 720p h.264, then I'd be all for more full-field shots (though a few close-ups should be intermingled).

Though, can you honestly say that you'd be more excited (as a non-participant spectator) watching this huge field, compared to a more athletics-like close-up mix? It's hard enough trying to get people excited for FIRST, showing them this field for 2 minutes is hardly the way to get them into it.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

cosign
Santosh Reddy
Mentor of team 2415

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

Why not make that point? Maybe FIRST games should have a single, or at least fewer, object(s) for the camera to focus on <cough>2008<cough>. Then, FIRST should tell the camera crew that that is what they should focus on.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

In many cases, the tba video is not the highest quality available. At MSC, our team took 1080p video, but tba asked for about 25 mb per match, so we compressed and gave them what they wanted. Just saying, what's on tba is not really representative, a lot of the time, of what's able to be provided.

I'd sign the original petition, though I'd rather not bring my team into this (because I by no means represent my team)

Basel Alghanem
FRC Student

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

I totally agree with you that it is possible to get 1080p recordings of the matches, but TBA has bandwidth and capacity restrictions on it that don't make 1080p video an reasonable option. But hopefully we can get rid of flash video in the near future and use some HTML5 magic to stream the higher quality videos.

Also I don't know of any cheap video capture devices that can take a HD signal into a PC and then have enough bandwidth to stream that to a free service that would webcast HD video to 200-400+ people. Yea I would love for that all to be a realistic scenario, but it currently isn't (maybe in 5-10 years?). I think we have to focus on making the most of what is available to us.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

Well yes, but the point I was trying to make was, it's not like we can't get the video, and finding a way for TBA to be able to put it up is just another step. In the same way, we can work towards being able to stream higher-quality video, rather than complain about the current low-quality video. Almost everyone here has said that high-quality non-zoomed video is good, so let's try to work towards that.

True, but maybe teams could pitch in towards webcasting HD video, one way or another? It's obviously not cheap, but considering how much people seem to want it, I don't think that's a particularly bad idea.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

I like this. And maybe like you said at the start other match highlights in between. But yeah, this i like.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

IMO this video looks pretty good. Also the downloadable version is close to "TV quality". SDTV (also the quality of the signal coming out of the FRC video drops) is 720x480 because it uses non-square pixels while the video is 640x480 which is the same 4:3 aspect ratio with square pixels like a PC display. You can't really record anything better than that from the video drop.

The one difficulty is figuring out which team is which. Something like this with a zoom shot of each team's robot as they are introduced before the match would actually be quite good.

To get a good full field shot of an FRC field with distinguishable team numbers you probably need to use a wide screen aspect ratio. The dimensions of the field make it difficult to zoom in close enough with a standard def 4:3 image.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

Yeah, that is my only complaint with the video. But, for scouting individual teams, it's a pretty big problem.

In response to the idea of having people chip in to purchase HD quality webcasts, I'm not sure the demand/willingness is quite there. I think we should focus on getting all events webcasted, recorded and put online before purchasing expensive equipment. Maybe higher-quality webcasts and videos will encourge more people to stream and record regionals, though.

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

I don't think this is the best way of doing this.

I would recommend doing something close to the following

Send a letter to both Bill Miller and Paul Lazarus requesting that if they really do want people in the stands, and if they truly do want people excited about FIRST. The video personnel should be trained as to how to film and record each match. weather that means Mr. Lazarus doing a training session for the directors of each regional (after all, he is a Hollywood director on the GDC), or the directors and camera crew be required to sit through matches on Thursday so that they get a feel for the game.

FIRST does not webcast the events. They are webcasted by sponsors, organizations, teams or individuals. Taking this into consideration, I would recommend that in the letter idea listed above, you ask that the A/V console at the events also provide a feed of the full field. THIS is what these webcasters could use to broadcast the events if they so wish to. THIS is what would be ideal to watch archived footage when you are scouting.

As a scouter, I would be very happy to see archived footage of the entire field. and i would love to see the material broadcasted on the big screen at the arena (which is exactly what the webcasts we get are) be of a higher quality, as in the camera field crew do a better job of understanding what exactly is going on and what they need to show.

Another thing i might recommend, would be to remove the term "Chief Delphi" and ad something like "our personal experiences and interactions with other participants of FIRST". This would broaden the representation of the letter form "active and die hard FIRST fans" to "a larger portion of the FIRST community".

Personally, i love the webcasts, their fine IMO. I appreciate all the hard work they do in putting everything together.

just my $0.02

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

I totally agree. It would be fantastic to review strategy after a regional, to see what we can improve upon.

Nick Lawrence
Team 1503


-Nick

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

Nawaid,

I think you're on the right track.

There are different audiences to be accommodated by the webcasts and archives of FRC matches. I like the idea of separating archive footage from real-time webcast feeds.

FRC coaches and statisticians want to have a "full-field" view of matches and are willing to sacrifice (to some extent) the quality of the video. This group would like archive video that allows game analysis: how many goals were scored by which robot, how strategies played out, etc.

First-time (and more casual) viewers want to experience the spirit and action of FRC events. They want to see close-up shots of robots and drivers in action. A real-time score banner and game announcer audio provides enough information regarding match progress to accompany the "action video" to get a clue about the game.

FIRST may have considered whether it's worthwhile to invest in a real production for coverage of FRC matches. Multiple cameras, game commentary and use of replays all coordinated by an experienced director would certainly "step-up" the quality of webcasts and archived broadcasts of the matches. Perhaps this represents an investment of resources that FIRST isn't able to justify right now. Maybe this type of production will be provided by networks excited by the prospect of capturing and entertaining a large audience; an audience that will develop if FIRST continues to grow.

Thanks for your input, everyone! Keep the ideas coming!

Re: Requesting "Full-field" Match Video for Webcasts from FIRST
 

Building on Nawaid and Dave's ideas...

Find a college or university near each regional that has a TV Production program and encourage them to include the production of the regional as part of their program. Let the students record and produce video recordings of the regional for each of the audiences that have been previously mentioned.

A win/win solution. The college gets a real life project for the students and FIRST/TBA/Audiences/Scouts get the video they need.