CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

I just wanted to know if the CIM motor could be hooked to the wall outlet natively or if something could be rigged to run the CIM motor from a regular 120V AC 20A household electrical outlet?

I'm planning to invest in some CIMs for a home made project.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

No!

And a power supply to provide 12v DC at enough current to do something useful with the motors, will be kind of expensive.

When you ask a question like this, it helps to provide a lot more info about what exactly you want to do, so others here can help you figure out some other possible ways to do it.....

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

A CIM motor is rated for 12V DC (direct current). Electrical mains voltage is 60Hz 120V AC (alternating current).

To run a 12V DC motor off of 120V AC mains, you'd need an electrical transformer/power supply to both convert alternating current to direct current and to step down the voltage from 120V to 12V.

The stall current of a single CIM motor is 133 amps at 12v, which means it's using 1596 Watts of electrical power (but at this point is outputting zero watts of useful mechanical power, at the expense of becoming an excellent space heater). This means the power supply you choose to run the CIM motor must be capable of sinking at least 1596 Watts of output power. Buying a 120VAC->12VDC power supply capable of outputting at least 1596W will put a several hundred dollar dent into your wallet.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Can't you put an circuit breaker in between the DC converter and the CIM?

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

No, but you could use a battery from a car, motorcycle, lawn tractor, golf cart, or boat. Or you could visit several HVAC shops in your area and ask if they would allow you to salvage blower motors from some junk furnaces. They run on house current.




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Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

I don't follow what the point of that would be.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

If the circuit breaks at 40 amps, you wouldn't need a AC-DC converter that could output 1600 watts.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

I have run a CIM from a high quality 500W computer power supply. You need to look at the specs though, as most computer power supplies provide more current on the 5V side than on the 12V side.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Well what I planned to do was use 4 similar motors to drive a winch of sorts, that would lift my LCD TV up and down a stationary pole that I have in my room.

I asked around and found that the CIM's would lift the appropriate 25 pounds that my TV and 4 CIM's weigh. The only problem is, I don't want to have a car battery sitting at the foot of my bed.

Is there another electric motor that I can cluster together to lift the 20 pounds of my TV and 3 others of itself just running from 120V AC current?

EDIT: I also plan to control them with DPDT switches and would like to know if this (http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062516&numProdsPerPage=60&y=1 0&x=13&retainProdsInSession=1) is the right switch for the job.

EDIT2: I also plan to wrap the whole controller in a project box so I'll need some tips on soldering the wire to a power cord.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

how are you attaching this TV to the pole and what kind of pole is it?

Also, is this worth the cost of 4 of any decent motors? why not use pulleys and a cleat from a flagpole?

EDIT:to solder a wire to a power cord it might be best to put some type of breaker/ fuse block in between

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Steel pole and I was thinking of designing something like the pole locking mechanisms from this years game, only instead of being one pneumatics, it's just permanent.

Cause it'd be cooler to use motors to move it up and down the pole.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

CIM peak power = 321 W
321W * 4 = 1284 W
Assuming gearbox efficiency of something extremely conservative like .5
1284W*.5 = 642W

25 lbs * 10 ft (tallest most bedroom ceilings would be) = 339 joules
Power = Work /Time
Time = Work / Power
339 Joules / 642 W = .53 seconds

This means that at half of peak power 4 CIMS will lift a TV of 0 height from your floor to your ceiling in .53 seconds. I guess my point is, how did you decide you needed 4 CIMs for this job?

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Oh sorry. It's not 4 CIMs doing all the lifting. I'm going to arrange them diagonally like:

\ /
/ \

around a rubber ball so that I can move it up and down, but also swing it around the pole to differ in direction. So something like this:

Bold Red means it's powered:

\ /
/ \
Moves up

\ /
/ \
Moves down

\ /
/ \
Moves right

\ /
/ \
Moves left

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

250 ft-lb = 339 joules


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Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Oops :ahh:

I used 8 ft, then thought it would be better to use 10 and apparently didn't go back and fix the math.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Would this work? http://www.harborfreight.com/1500-lb...nch-96127.html

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

You'd still need a hefty one, and depending on the performance he wants, it could potentially be very annoying.

A 40 Amp breaker doesn't mean it trips at 40, it can hold currents above that for appreciable amounts of time.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

It works, but it's not really what I'm looking to do.

It does vertical motion, but it doesn't do the lateral motion around the pole that I'm looking for.

Any motor suggestions, that are just motors, that run off a 120V AC outlet?

Thinking of salvaging some household appliance motors like vacuums, or like someone said an HVAC motor if that would work.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Why don't you separate vertical motion and lateral motion into two separate systems? You could have your TV mounted on a pivot bracket and adjust the angle with a fairly slow but powerful motor, then move the whole assembly up and down with a cable-elevator and winch?

No suggestions on AC motors. You could, however, get a battery enough to power the motors for a decent period of time (e.g. a FIRST battery, but smaller) and hook it up to a charging circuit, so the battery provides the current needed to run the motors and the charger recharges the battery at a slower rate then it is discharged.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Take a look around at www.surpluscenter.com

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Or a bench grinder or skill saw or washing machine or sump pump or attic fan.


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Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

I did think of that, using the two different systems, and it'd be so much easier to do, but I'd also like to do this method just to see if it's possible. I was also thinking of separating the systems in the same holding mechanism, so that it pivoted about a foot out from the pole, rather than around the pole itself, but I still think around the pole would be cooler to watch.

I'll keep that in mind, because doing 2 separate systems would be so much easier to actually accomplish.

I was thinking of something like that but I wasn't sure if it'd work. It's basically hooking a battery charger to a battery and then taking power from the battery as it charges, right?

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

You said you would be using a ball right? What happens when this ball slips? Feel like replacing the tv? Or will you have a safety system just in case?

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

I was inspired by this video:
http://dvice.com/archives/2010/04/ball-balancing.php

So maybe something ball shaped but flexible so it can grip to the pole.

What do you recommend as a safety system?

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

i want one of these
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_i3zfL1VUGo

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

I'm not exactly sure... Some sort of friction system that activates after the tv stops moving? I'm not exactly sure... I would be using a completely different system... haha

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Spring loaded rubber grips that lock on the pole? I could probably use a less powerful motor to hold those open and then when the motors stop moving, those could close.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

use He to make the TV neutrally buoyant, then you could use almost any motor to use it. Or, use liquid He and levitate the TV on superconducting magnets.:D

https://www.surpluscenter.com/item.asp?Item=5-1677

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Ryutso,
If you get this system installed in your bedroom, I have GOT to see some pictures :ahh:

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Toby,
What you are asking leaves me wondering about safety. This is a point where we have to really point you to a mentor that can discuss this with you and watch over what you do. Household current is not something to fool around with as it can kill and set fires if mishandled.
As you can see from the above answers, four CIMs are an overkill for this project as you don't need to raise the TV that quickly. We typically are raising devices on a TV set at much less than one foot per sec and typically the height of the TV (30-40 inches) in about 15 seconds. Any faster and the support hardware and structure take too much of a beating when you stop. The garage door opener motor in the link that Sanddrag has given above looks like a pretty good start. Remember that the motor is designed to lift a balanced garage door so it is likely producing the required lift for you project. It might even have all the needed end limit switches that you should use in your project.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

Al has some great advice here.

I've spent a lot of time crawling surplus sites (usually for 540 sized motors), there are a lot of cheap, slow, torquey motors out there. What's nice about that is you really don't have to do much, or possibly no, gear reduction, and depending on what you buy, they could have a nice low efficiency worm gear to hold it in place.

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

We all know that a fuse reacts faster than a circuit breaker, right? (If not, consider yourself informed). Now look here (1.8 MB PDF file). According to the graph on Page 4, how long can a 40A fuse hold a 100 A current?
Give me any motor and I can get it to lift 25 pounds. What changes is speed.

OK, so I think everyone understands that a CIM is probably a poor choice for this application. 120 VAC will smoke it immediately, a 12V power supply big enough to manage it will be expensive, and 120 VAC geared motors are plentiful and cheap.

Al spoke about electrical safety: heed his words if you enjoy living. Even an accidental brush against 120 VAC can be fatal. That would ruin your day right quick. Setting the house on fire is just a side benefit.

Also consider mechanical safety: The whole system needs to support at least 3 or 4 times the heaviest weight it;ll ever see, and if it were mine I'd go for a factor of not less than 10. If it were to break, the damaged TV would be the least of the problem, since the pole embedded in my cousin's chest will really cheese off Aunt Sally...

Re: CIM motor + Electrical outlet = ?
 

If I was looking to do this project on the cheap, I would look for things that already do the motion that you require.

For example a drill press table travels up a pole (using a rack and pinion), and also can swing around the pole.

So you could buy something like this http://www.harborfreight.com/16-spee...ess-43378.html

Stick a low rpm high torque motor on the lifting crank, and then drive a firction wheel on the horizontal surface of the column to rotate.


If you wanted to separate the 2 mechanisms i would move away from a pole and use drawer slides on a vertical frame, and then pivot the frame at the bottom like a turret using a lazy Susan bearing.

Without knowing the specs of your tv/system it is hard to recommend a motor. On the cheap side of things I will echo finding something at http://www.surpluscenter.com/electric.asp on the expensive side you can find something exactly speced for your project at http://www.grainger.com