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-   -   706 deploying minibot (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=92381)

Bruceb 19-02-2011 20:20

706 deploying minibot
 
Here's a video of our 2011 minibot deploy and climb.
Not the fastest bot yet.
KISS on the deploy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hvrbb9g9EHM

orisenak 20-02-2011 04:51

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
nice job!
check out our deploy/climb of ours!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aVMd8sCR7gA

-stuart kaneshiro
team 1056

Chris Fultz 20-02-2011 08:00

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Please check the rules and the Q+A.

The minibot cannot be above the plane of the 18" line after it breaks the plane of the base of the tower. Hard to tell from your video about this.

Bruceb 20-02-2011 20:12

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Can you site a reference? I don't interpret it that way.
Bruce

nighterfighter 20-02-2011 20:39

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruceb (Post 1027792)
Can you site a reference? I don't interpret it that way.
Bruce

Sure.

<G21>
HOSTBOTS may DEPLOY MINIBOTS only onto their ALLIANCE‟S TOWERS and entirely below the DEPLOYMENT LINE. Violation: RED CARD. TOWER is disabled if MINIBOT is DEPLOYED above the DEPLOYMENT LINE.

thefro526 20-02-2011 20:53

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruceb (Post 1027792)
Can you site a reference? I don't interpret it that way.
Bruce

Quote:

<G21> HOSTBOTS may DEPLOY MINIBOTS only onto their ALLIANCE‟S TOWERS and entirely
below the DEPLOYMENT LINE.
Violation: RED CARD. TOWER is disabled if MINIBOT is DEPLOYED above the
DEPLOYMENT LINE
Quote:

DEPLOYMENT – the act of positioning a MINIBOT on a TOWER. DEPLOYMENT starts when the
MINIBOT breaks the vertical projection of the TOWER BASE circumference. DEPLOYMENT ends
when the HOSTBOT is no longer in contact with the MINIBOT. (Related form, DEPLOY, verb)
G21 Alone does not make your deployment illegal, however since deployment starts at the instance the Minibot breaks the tower perimeter, your deployment would be illegal, if at any point in your arc the minibot is above 18"

Bruceb 20-02-2011 21:03

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Boy, read and reread that and still don't interpret it that way. No one at todays miny regional had any issue with it.
Bruce

MrForbes 20-02-2011 21:10

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Draw a side view of the HOSTBOT and TOWER. Draw a horizontal line between them at 18" above the TOWER BASE. Draw a vertical line at the edge of the TOWER BASE. See if your any part of your MINIBOT is above the horizontal line, when it's on the TOWER side of the vertical line. If so, you're gonna get a RED CARD if an observant ref is watching.

Vikesrock 20-02-2011 21:11

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruceb (Post 1027859)
Boy, read and reread that and still don't interpret it that way. No one at todays miny regional had any issue with it.
Bruce

Sorry.....

http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread...ighlight=plane
http://forums.usfirst.org/showthread...ighlight=plane

boomergeek 20-02-2011 21:22

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
I don't necessarily read <G21> as prohibiting a host bot nor a minibot from breaking an imaginary plane at the height of deployment line as long as the hostbot nor the minibot is in contact with the pole.

Clearly, a host bot in contact with the pole above the deployment line, or a minibot in contact with the pole above the deployment line before the minibot has separated from the hostbot, are violations of one or more of:
<G20> ROBOTS/HOSTBOTS may not contact their own TOWERS above the DEPLOYMENT LINE. Violation: PENALTY for contact.
<G21> HOSTBOTS may DEPLOY MINIBOTS only onto their ALLIANCE‟S TOWERS and entirely below the DEPLOYMENT LINE. Violation: RED CARD. TOWER is disabled if MINIBOT is DEPLOYED above the DEPLOYMENT LINE.
<G22> HOSTBOTS may not contact their ALLIANCE‟S MINIBOT while any part of it is above the DEPLOYMENT LINE. Violation: TOWER is disabled


Chris Fultz interpretation "The minibot cannot be above the plane of the 18" line after it breaks the plane of the base of the tower." is just one potential interpretation of the rules. I would suggest Bruceb pose question to the GDC. BUT...


Correction (thanks Vikesrock): the GDC already ruled...and the vertically swinging minibot deployment in which the minbot breaks the deployment line imaginary cylinder is a violation.
http://forums.usfirst.org/member.php?u=33258


I think the deployment shown in the video meets the intended spirit of the rule and the field judges will have enough of a problem with monitoring for violation of <G21> when a pole contact is being made. I doubt most field judges would want to trust themselves to measure an imaginary cylinder at exactly 18". Will we see a special measuring tool?

MrForbes 20-02-2011 21:30

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Perhaps the refs or inspectors can ask you to demonstrate that the MINIBOT is entirely below the horizontal plane after DEPLOYMENT...that should be possible before/after a match?

I'd like to see the alternative interpretation, how does it work?

dodar 20-02-2011 21:33

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
SO do the rules mean that at no part of the minibot deployment(when your hostbot moves the minibot into position to climb) can your minibot be above 18in.?

Vikesrock 20-02-2011 21:35

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1027900)
SO do the rules mean that at no part of the minibot deployment(when your hostbot moves the minibot into position to climb) can your minibot be above 18in.?

Post #8 in this thread by Squirrel does a great job of describing the rule as interpreted by the GDC in the Q&A

Bruceb 20-02-2011 21:46

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Well, G21 says
<G21> HOSTBOTS may DEPLOY MINIBOTS only onto their ALLIANCE‟S TOWERS and entirely below the DEPLOYMENT LINE. Violation: RED CARD. TOWER is disabled if MINIBOT is DEPLOYED above the DEPLOYMENT LINE.
G22 says
<G22> HOSTBOTS may not contact their ALLIANCE‟S MINIBOT while any part of it is above the DEPLOYMENT LINE.

Deployment line is defined as
DEPLOYMENT LINE – located on the POST, approximately 18 inches above the top surface of the BASE.

LOCATED ON THE POST there is no reference to a plane here or anywhere. It is a line on the post so my interpretation is that your hostbot cannot touch the minibot while it is on the tower post above the DEPLOYMENT LINE.

THe deployment line does not exist anywhere but on the tower post.

Bruce

Vikesrock 20-02-2011 21:49

Re: 706 deploying minibot
 
Bruce, that unfortunately disagrees with what the GDC has ruled in the 2 Q&A posts I linked to. I would recommend posting your reasoning to the Q&A for additional clarification if you are hoping to stick with your current design.


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