Which region is the best?
 

Alright Chief Delphi, it's time to debate: What region is the number one FRC region? By this I mean competition, outreach, awards, everything. Where's the "powerhouse" zone? Inspired by this thread (thanks jane!) http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...threadid=93295
Here are the regions, split by the official uscensus regions (http://www.census.gov/geo/www/us_regdiv.pdf)
West (california, oregon, etc.)
South (Texas, Georgia, etc.)
Northeast (Pennsylvania, New York, etc.) + Pacific (alaska & hawaii) since the NE has the smallest region
Midwest (Indiana, Michigan, etc.)
Personally my vote goes to the Midwest (no bias there......), but the Midwest does have a surplus of world championships :cool:
Let the debating begin! Be careful not to bash on other teams, this a peaceful discussion :eek:

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Midwest has Michigan, Team Hammond, and Andy Baker. Game over.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

that was fast :yikes:

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Northeast has Rochester, Xerox, 191, 229, 340, 1511, 1126, 174, 175, 176, 177 and 178, the Finger Lakes Regional and RIT.

A good enough close second.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Michigan is a region of it's own these days and no one else is allowed to come play. I don't think we should count them as part of a greater "midwest" anymore. If we count them as their own region, they win hands-down.

In my opinion, without "talent-density" of Michigan the rest of the midwest is about the same as anywhere else with a handful of powerhouses.

-John

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Duke,

First of all, you are welcome. Secondly, this could be another interesting thread if contributors to the thread use wisdom and integrity when posting. It won't do any justice to the topic to have posts filled with all sorts of empty bragging and generalizations.

Also, the thread you linked to that inspired this thread has come about because there are such dramatic differences in regions and the amount of experience, support, and understanding within and about those regions. That thread is to bring attention to those differences and shed light on some of the reasons. It is also going to be used to put together some information that I want to use for different purposes in identifying the weaknesses and what we can do to strengthen them in order to build sustainable programs in our regions. This would allow for the competitive experience to become a consistent standard of excellence. The key word in this whole initiative is: excellence. Spend 5 minutes listening to Andy Baker and you will hear that word 3 times. The trick is, you have to listen and then comprehend and then act, if you care about the standard of excellence. I'm acting.

Good luck with figuring out the best region, Duke. I look forward to reading the replies.

Jane

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Northeast: It's where it all started, it's where you have the big Hall-of Famers, the most stacked regionals, and the best offseason events and outreach. NE all the way.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Midwest.

Again Andy and other great people.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

As a Michigander I think that MI has a great top tier of teams but it tapers off very quickly. I believe that the density is to blame for that, 172 teams in a smallish state with a terrible economy means that resources are thin all around.

As for "best" region I have to ask for clarification of best. NE has the best defense around. The midwest has the scoring power houses. The West has some of the best machined robots out there. I'm not familiar enough with teams down south to say what they have. (Aside from Florida)

Also, who gets Canada?

Re: Which region is the best?
 

I consider the Ontario teams part of the Midwest but obviously they are their own entity.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

I'm the biggest New England/Northeast thumper in the world, and even I find it hard to argue with this statement. Fact of the matter is, Michigan has produced more Einstein contenders than anyone else could really even dream of. I sometimes wonder if that will ever change until there is a similar district model in other regions. Even then, it would be awfully hard to surpass the state of never ending powerhouses.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

I think the next best place for a district model is New England.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

More places to volunteer! Yay!

On topic, what about California? There are a lot of great teams out there too. I agree that Michigan has produced a lot of awesome teams, and of course I want to support my own region (the Northeast), but just some food for thought.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Michigan has the most powerful teams.
Of all the regions I go to the Florida teams are the nicest.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Rather than speculate, it would be an interesting exercise in statistics to see per capita which region is the 'best'.

An area with 150 teams that has 15 'great' teams is not as powerful as an area with 50 teams and 7 'great' teams. It may be possible that North Dakota is a greater powerhouse than MI (assuming ND has at least one team :rolleyes: )

We'd need a definition of "best" though. Teams on Einstein I suppose. or?

Anyone up for that analysis?

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Michigan is the most challenging and competitive region, hands down. There is a District/State Championship system for a reason. :D

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Should the parameters be limited to Einstein and Chairman's Winners? Should the regions be classified differently? Some states or pairs of states have more teams than entire regions.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Good Point. All International teams are now considered the international region.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Why?

Re: Which region is the best?
 

I've competed on 5 different teams, in 3 different regions (Michigan/Midwest, New England, Texas), and I have to say, Michigan is the best, hands-down. Nowhere else has such a high concentration of elite-level powerhouse teams, and nowhere else is the level of competition as high across the board.

I will give New England some credit for having a lot of solid veteran teams, and a high overall level of play. There are also a lot of great powerhouse teams in the "greater Midwest" outside of Michigan. Texas has a couple of great veteran teams, too. But if I had to pick one area as "the best", it's definitely Michigan.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

For further discussion, here's a list of states by # of teams (FRC only).
I have not compiled any data for teams outside the United States.
As I was doing this, it occurred to me that Mark McLeod has probably already done this, with charts and graphs.

1. CA - 175
2. MI - 171
3. TX - 144
4. MN - 131
5. NY - 127
6. WA - 82
7. VA - 68
8. NJ - 64
9. FL - 56
10. MA - 53
11. MO - 52
12. OH, OK, PA - 48
13. IL - 43
14. CT - 42
15. AZ - 40
16. GA, NC - 36
17. CO, IN, OR - 35
18. MD - 34
19. HI, NH - 32
20. WI - 31
21. SC - 25
22. LA - 24
23. KS - 19
24. UT - 18
25. TN - 16
26. DC, KY - 14
27. ID - 13
28. NV - 11
29. AL, MS - 10
30. ME - 8
31. WY - 7
32. MT - 6
33. RI, WV - 5
34. AR, IA, ND, VT - 3
35. AK, DE, NM, PR - 2

NE, SD - 0 teams


Key:
0 Black
1-10 Brown
11-20 Red
21-30 Orange
31-40 Yellow
41-50 Green
51-60 Blue
61-70 Violet
71-80 White
81-90 Gray
91-100 Pink
100+ Gold

Edit: It is my hope that this gives us a more holistic picture of the spread of FRC teams. Before we start assigning "good" "better" and "best" it'd be a good idea to determine what exactly we mean as "region" and whether it is classified by pure geography or by team saturation.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Why not? Proposals are greatly appreciated :D

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Well, I think we can keep the regions how they are, but instead, look at it percentage-wise.
So for instance, lets say 10 solid teams are in region x, and 1 team that is the best in the history of FIRST is in region y. Percentage wise, you could argue that that region Y is better, or vice versa. So i guess, look at it that way :cool:
Remember, its 90% opinion, 10% educated observation.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Actually it kind of makes as much sense to group teams from Canada, Israel, Australia, Brazil, Mexico, Turkey, the UK, etc. together as it does to include Hawaii and Alaska in the Northeast.

Its an arbitrary grouping with arbitrary criteria, so go for it! I'm adding any future teams from the Moon, Mars, or the Asteroid belt to the International grouping, though. Team #94543 "Luna Incorporated and Tranquility Base Secondary" is going to ROCK. (Except for the fact they will fail tech inspection because they didn't have enough room to paint their team number on their bumper.)

I will suggest, however, that teams in the "overseas" group have some additional logistical challenges that teams in the United States and Canada don't have (I'm not sure to what degree Mexican teams are affected, but NAFTA provisions should make things a bit easier than for non-NAFTA countries.)

So when considering a team's overall awesomeness, I'd give a lot of the overseas teams at least a 10% head start just for getting their robot through customs (at least three times... KoP in, robot out, robot back home), dealing with shipping delays and expenses, and then getting the whole team to a competition.

Oh, yeah... they have to put up with all those silly imperial part sizes and specifications, too.

Jason

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Although Michigan may have the best teams, the Niagara region of Canada has several powerhouses as well. Regionals with 1114 and 2056 together are all I have experienced (except for Waterloo in '09), but needless to say they consistently make a near unstoppable alliance.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

With 175 teams it looks like its time for a California State Championship tournament.

Re: Which region is the best?
 

Having competed both in the Michigan State Championship and on Einstein, the MSC is a much harder overall level of competition.