Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

Please tell us what you thought about the Championship event this year, the First year in St Louis.

I was regrettably unable to attend the event for the first time in 8 years due to it not being in my area anymore however, I did enjoy the competition on the NASA feeds. On Einstein, I liked the instant replays after the matches. In autonomous mode, I liked the overhead double camera view however, we only saw that view for about 5-7 seconds and missed some scoring. The video montage of past champions at the end of the day on Saturday had audio but no video.

I would assume that not having the Newton field in the dome for 2 days was a disappointment for many.

Dave

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

I dont know how other people felt about it, but I enjoyed the fields in the pits. I was in Curie division and so I was in the pits for two days. It was a much shorter commute to get to and from the field and I was able to get to my scouts quicker for information on the teams we would be playing. I think that it was better than many people thought it would be.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

My only peeve with the pit field was the bleachers were too small. it was cramped... At boilermaker regional, the bleachers were packed... and they had bigger bleachers and less teams... this was by far worse.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

From the webcast, it appeared there were many open seats and I was hopeful. Too bad this was the case.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

I personally can't say how I felt as a team member in the stands as I'm an alum, and my team wasn't there. But I don't think the pit fields were terrible. It seemed like you could easily talk in the pits without having to talk over ridiculously loud speakers. And it definitely helps for commute and scouting. I actually always disliked having the fields all the way in the Dome at Georgia.

First time I went in 07, we were in Archimedes which was on the farthest side from the entrance. So it was either you stay in the pits or you stay in the stands...which was terrible. I jumped back from Curie and Newton all the time. Even ran over to the dome towards the end.

Other than that, the only thing I missed was the middle outside little park in Atlanta. Good memories! And the carnival, which they tried to attempt here but didn't work out so well. The concert totally made up for that though.

Also, all the companies that were on display this time, was very very cool. I was super impressed. At how much stuff was going on and it seemed so efficient and well organized. Not to mention a bus and car that I saw, that were moving FIRST Championship ads and all the restaurants welcoming the FIRST Championships. It was pretty awesome and I'm excited to go back next year.

Edit: They should definitely add more stands, I think that addition would make it pretty great.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

So first, the good things about St Louis. The trip from the pits to the dome was great for people and robots. Parking was super convenient. Pits were good and I liked the layout. Traffic wasn't too bad in and out of downtown.

I wouldn't have minded fields in the pits, if there was anything approaching adequate seating. I didn't even try to watch the Curie Elims because there wasn't any hope of getting a seat anywhere. And there were certainly a number of teams that didn't help matters by trying to save seats. Clearly some teams didn't bring their gracious professionalism.

Matters weren't helped by the strange lack of a video feed in the pits. It was pretty annoying keeping track of the current match when we were in the dome on Friday. The lack of video feed, current match display, or updated rankings list forced me to use the FRC Spyder app to keep track of things. So I found it a bit laughable when the pit announced that we shouldn't trust any iphone or android apps for match schedules. I presume we should have just rented the magic 148 ball to stay on time.

Also, I feel like I should apologize to 359 for missing their Chairman's presentation. I skipped the concert because my wife would have had a panic attack in the concert and, you know, no one ever said anything about anything important happening at that optional concert thing. It sure would've been embarrassing if my team won it and I wasn't there with them. I'm also told that the complete lack of crowd control left our team mom/regional director in fear of her life when half the student population at championships tried to shove through a small set of doors to get to the concert. So I'm still glad I skipped the concert.

And don't get me started on Load-In. One guy with handing out the wristbands and jotting down team numbers on a cardboard box? I could have dragged two kids further up the line and gotten some wristbands for team 47 in addition to team 57. Cramming everybody through four doors in the morning wasn't that great either.

Sooooooo on the whole, I think St Louis has a lot of potential, but needs some serious work on signage and crowd control to get back up to the level of Atlanta.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

the fields in the pits were better than i anticipated for the drive teams. i really liked my pit because we could watch matches for our division when bored on thursday and saturday, but i also got to see Galileo compete on friday, something the dome never really permitted for those in the pits or on drive team with 100% dome fields. the one bad part was that the noise in the pits increased rapidly, and the safety inspectors got complained to teams when people came by our pit for various reasons when the majority of the path was taken up by standing field spectators... the concert had one problem that i thought i never would have seen as happening... crowd surfing started and PEOPLE WERE INJURED. from what I saw, a member of 1305 was crushed by one of these surfers. this was sickening to me because an innocent person was injured due to a concert that they went to that was designed to be a reward to their efforts. i don't know what else to say about this, maybe a no crowd surfing rule? people need to be considerate of those around them? i don't know how to fix it, but i have never heard any good stories about what happens when someone finishes their crowd "surf"...

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

i think the problem with wednesday was the rain... i think everyone would have been a lot more forgiving to each other without it, the traffic would have been able to clear before the doors opened because teams wouldn't be afraid of getting their stuff wet... maybe a rain load in strategy for the pits? it would be nice if there was some area like the georgia dome, where the buses could load and unload. the load in/out there was really easy, the doors were big and the pits were not accessible by this area, so loading into a building was possible...

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

Before I give you all my thoughts, I would like to congratulate the championship winners, and especially 359- every time I was able to visit your pit during the championship I left in awe. You guys truly deserve it.

I was disappointed in a lot of things... But It was also extremely fun because I love being part of the FIRST community. Instead of going on about all the things I liked and disliked, I just want to talk about one thing.

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Friday afternoon, my team was approached by a ref and told us that there were rumors going around that said that this year's 2011 chairmans award was going to be presented during the concert (AKA in a few hours). Rumors are rumors. I didn’t know what to think of it, so I didn’t worry much about it. I also had some MAJOR issues with that rumor for a lot of reasons.. Including...

-Some teams will not be attending the concert for various reasons. I know of a few teams personally who had scouting meetings or just didn’t want to go. Thankfully I am positive that all of 359 was there to accept the award, otherwise I would have been even more disappointed if they decided to reveal the winner at the concert and the team they choose being nowhere in sight.

-The judging of the award was altered to be ready for the concert. All presentations were held on Thursday, and the final decision was made before Friday night. So for the teams that were curious, that’s why it seemed as if question asking was light this year. ALTHOUGH, I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT THEY WOULD HAVE COME TO THE SAME CONCLUSION EVEN WITH THE REGULAR JUDGING STYLE. I'm just noting that they even adjusted the way the judges had to prepare for this award (and awards in general) all for the concert.

-I think the number is 52? 52 teams compete for the chairmans award at the world championship? (or 50, 51, correct me please). I don't know how many of those teams knew about this rumor, if any. My team knew just solely because a ref of a team friend, and warned us to go. I heard a few other teams heard about it, and I also heard a lot of people did not hear about it. FIRST threw a concert so students could enjoy their time at the championship, but announcing to 51 other teams that they lost an award in the middle of a concert seemed kind of harsh to me.

-Besides all the discomfort this may have brought to a few teams, I was also unsure of the benefits this brought to the winning chairmans team. If I recall, no video was ever played, and as I anxiously waited to see excited students raise up that large clock in pure happiness, I never did. The clock was never officially handed to 359. Not to mention, I still am in love with the past's tradition of announcing the award during the finals, with ALL eyes on you. It has always seemed so magical, and everyone could just feel all the hardwork a team as done. Watching 341 stand up and start hugging each other while the crowd went wild was.. amazing to me. I REALLY hope 359 enjoyed themselves and had an amazing time at the concert, but I would not recommend FIRST does that again.

Overall.. Feel free to disagree with my opinions. I feel like they could have handled this better. The concert was REALLY fun and awesome to watch. Better than expected in my opinion. I just feel like they could have just waited the extra day, and announced some of those awards the day later. (Although the dean's list winners on stage was something I would recommend again)

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

From my perspectives:

YAY:
-Playing in the pits was not bad at all.
-The robot commute to the dome was painless.
-The concert and the food after Einstein were awesome, and much appreciated.
-The LED curtains on Einstein were a nice touch, even if they rendered some logos with finer-width lettering (read: just about every college) illegible.

BOO:
-Sitting in the pit field stands was rough. I don't think anything further needs to be said there.
-The commute to the stands for spectators was a hike.
-Having seen it now, I totally get that an enlarged FTC area meant at least one field wouldn't fit in the dome regardless of the entertainment. (Bill Miller was highlighting that this change was already in the works for the move beforehand.) Given how much it got CD and teams (via the FRC Live questions box) riled up, I wish they'd mentioned this in advance to head it off the grumblers at the pass.
-The lack of music on Einstein took a little bit away from the spectacle...though if the i.am.FIRST crew (which was filming from that small platform near Einstein) is the reason, I'll give them a bit of a pass this time.
-I noticed that the noises on the pit fields could get a little loud for those in nearby pits (like us), while pit announcements could overpower the pit field PA. Perhaps some curtains would help block the sounds.
-It felt like the Hall of Fame was put way out in the boonies. I hope they'll be featured a bit more next year.
-Unlike the Georgia Dome, you don't really get a good perspective on where you are from the concourse unless you look through the portals. Some extra signage to highlight what field you're near (and how to get back to the pits--I know I made a couple of block-long dashes at first) would greatly aid navigation.
-At the risk of being nit-picky...drop the picnic chicken from the pre-order lunch list. It was pretty bad (though the other options I had, and the service, was fine).

That looks like the cons are longer than the pros, but most of them are pretty easily fixed. I give the overall experience a B+--no small feat for the first time trying to hold the event in a new facility.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

I attended championships purely as a spectator. I spent most of my time in/near Newton. I had to leave Friday evening, so I can't comment on Saturday. For a first time in the city and venue, I think things went fairly well, but there is definitely some room for improvement.

The pit fields were very cramped. In addition, it was quite difficult to hear the person standing next to you in the pits immediately adjacent to those fields, and I needed earplugs (which were kindly provided by team 1764). I can't imagine how crowded it would have been during eliminations. Things were considerably better in the dome, plus I was able to see some FTC matches during FRC's inter-match gaps. I was delighted by the quality of many of the matches, and I had a great time talking to teams that don't normally attend the same events I do.

FIRST Conference was as usual, a delightful learning opportunity. I had a bit of trouble finding them Wednesday evening, but I had allowed extra time, so that wasn't a problem.

Food options were plentiful and good, although there was a bit of a shortage of trash cans in key areas. There was plenty of seating available for lunch. Parking was easy and reasonably priced, even when I arrived a bit late Friday morning. Traffic in and out was not a problem.

It was hard to find the ballroom for the Dean's List presentations, and since my feet were already tired the standing got a bit old. I'm short, so I ended up using my camera as a periscope to see over the sea of bodies to the stage and the screens around it. The energy level was good.

The Collegiate Aerial Robotics Demo was neat, and I'm glad I got a chance to see it.

The venue maps posted around the building were helpful, although difficult to read at my height (5'2"), and in quite a small font. In addition, the second floor was not mapped - if it had been, I wouldn't have had any trouble finding things.

All things considered, I had a wonderful time, and I'm looking forward to attending next year.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

I was surprised when I heard that FIRST was willing to sanction a standing crowd during the concert. There was an incident a few years ago that caused FIRST to restrict that sort of activity. (I'm not sure where I stand on allowing/disallowing/not caring about that sort of behaviour at an FRC event.)

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

Although the event was proposed to be a complete disaster by some people, I was pleasantly surprised. This was only my second time to the championship event, but it was not far off from Atlanta in terms of overall quality of the event.

Goods:
The pit fields were very convenient and allowed students on the drive team to take a quick walk over and watch a few matches in between their own matches. They were also extremely exciting and filled with enthusiasm.
Edit:The college level competition was really interesting! Aftering hearing about it when it was first announced publicly, I was excited. Looks like this could be the next FIRST competition.
At least for us, our hotel, The Renaissance Grand, was right across the street from the Americas Center, and a 8 minute walk total to the pits. Could not have worked out better.
Loading and unloading was not bad (besides the rain). It seemed there was plenty of space for the teams to bring their stuff in and out.
I thought it was nice they fed us (Despite how basic it was) on Saturday after the closing. The St. Louis cookies were a nice touch! :p

Bads:
The stands for the pit fields NEED to be bigger. Significantly bigger! Two times what they had might be enough.
At least in the place in the pits where we were, the lane seemed very crowded. There was definitely not as much space as Atlanta, but with a few changes, I think they could make it work better.
The performance was pretty awesome, but it would've been nice to let some more people into the, "Mosh Pit," area (on a lottery basis or something) as it was kind of dead in there in most parts. I understand that there were smaller kids in there, but it was really calm where we were.
Edit: The only other complaint I had was the placement of the HOF booths. It seems they were figured out last minute where they would go, so they were put in a corner. Maybe this is bias because I was over there more than most people, but I think they should be celebrated a bit more.

Overall, a great experience. I am glad the negative feelings were proved wrong. Great job volunteers, planning committees, and FIRST! :D

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

The good.
I liked the shorter distances to the fields both in the dome and the pit fields.
Inspection and inspectors helpful and efficient.
Numerical pits made it easier to find people who needed parts and help.
Even though it seemed crowded the shorter distances to many of the displays and the other levels of FIRST was nice.
Robo Prom was great!! and enjoyed by all my team.
Concert Saturday was great as far as team members concerned. Adult feedback was too much emphasis on making a video of it which was distracting. I put it in the good since we a here for the kids!

The bad.
Load-in was very bad. No covered unload area and nothing done to accommodate teams who arrived a little before 5:00 PM. Should have let teams offload and come inside to wait to go to pits. I went through one door that had no one checking in and the next door had one very slow person (linear single tasker) checking in only those coming in that door (about 5 minutes per team). Again teams lined up outside in rain! Event coordinator Jerry saved the day for us but don't know how others fared.

Bleachers way too small.

Newton field in the dome located 15' too close to the stands. Couldn't see 1/2 of the competition floor without standing up.

Adult coaches on the floor way to pushy and looking out only for their own team - don't need adult coaches on the floor in the first place but that is another issue. Seeding is when teams get to show what they can do and in many cases checkout fixes and teams should be allowed to demonstrate their robot to their fullest. Again winning is not everything - just the robot being able to function as designed is a victory for many teams.

Several teams (primarily rookie) around us expressed disappointment in the treatment by other teams - yelled at their drivers when their robot had problems during seeding rounds, etc. My team saw some of this since we had communication problems during most of seeding but since we have been around a while and don't have the win at all costs attitude of some of the teams we just ignored them. We were there to have fun, help others, and learn from the designs of other teams. FIRST is not just about winning the robotics portion of the competition. I felt really bad about one team who had travel a long way that expressed doubt they would ever return to the championship.

Shepard shipping was poor. Took an 1-1/2 hours to get our crate and finally had to go get it ourselves when we located the crate and found one of the crate handlers leaning on their pallet truck. Observed as many a six pallet handlers sitting around doing nothing while Shepard continued to tell us it was being delivered. If Shepard want a separate document it needs to be included with the shipping paperwork at check-in - you shouldn't have to go through line twice to get checked out. Shepard lines need roping to help control the inconsiderate people. (Like Atlanta in 2009 when FedEx handled it). Overall it took me over 2-1/2 hours dealing with Shepard.

Saturday night - just forget it. Atlanta in 2009 was OK - food was good and spread out enough to have some fun, even if it was just Frisbee. St. Louis food poor, not enough activities and couldn't find anything without a lot of walking around. Just don't do it if you can't make it memorable.

Don Davenport
Team 2655.

Re: Championship 2011 - St Louis - Your Thoughts Please?
 

i was surprised too, they told our team that the wristbands were for "special seating" we didn't figure that was "floor" until we distributed the tickets where some said "floor" and others had sections.

i do however find it funny that so many of the students were watching the teleprompter that they had a staff member hold a sign in front of it. also there seemed to be a lack of energy in the finals crowd (late night...). i remember the massive waves on all the decks last year, the crowd beach balls, all of which were fun. especially when we got into doing more than one wave per level and people used their physics knowlege to go really high up when they met and both sides of this continued the respective waves. oh well :rolleyes: i guess this is where i miss the georgia dome.

the airplane throwing competition was fun to watch though. especially the crowd reaction to them making it far (to the torn down devision field area) or to the awards stage