Re: invitationals/nationals
 

Posted by Frank Toussaint.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Engineer on team #111, Wildstang, from Wheeling and Rolling Meadows and Motorola .

Posted on 6/7/99 8:06 AM MST


In Reply to: invitationals/nationals posted by michael bastoni on 6/6/99 6:39 PM MST:



One problem with invitationals is that a smaller percentage of rookie
teams would be likely to be invited. There would be less incentive for
new teams to form without that hot dog at the end of the road.

perhaps, but
 

Posted by michael bastoni.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Coach on team #23, PNTA, from Plymouth North High School and Boston Edison Co.

Posted on 6/8/99 4:31 AM MST


In Reply to: Re: invitationals/nationals posted by Frank Toussaint on 6/7/99 8:06 AM MST:



Frank,

You may indeed have the correct insight regarding the rookie
issue and the nationals...However, I' like to offer this observation.

High school and college athletes usually do not expect to make the starting
varsity squad their freshman year. The band and chorus kids don't
play and sing lead their freshman year, as a rule. They all go through
the 'Learning Curve'

When I first entered the production world (I actually had a life in the
private sector) I did not manage important projects my first day on the job....

Rookies who field good robots, rookies who distinguish themselves should
be invited to the nationals....and....I am sure that for the most part, folks
who sponsor, coach and participate in the FIRST program would agree that
the competetive nature of the games IS NOT the most important aspect of
the game.

But.....

We are talking about the nationals....where we might have the opportunity
to come together and celebrate what is good, even what is best about the program
we all participate in....Perhaps that should be like the 'Varsity' game,
the game where they 'sell tickets' not like the freshman games or the
practice recitals....but the culminating activity...like the Thanksgiving
day football game.

As you know Frank, because your team was there in 92',there are
still some teams in this program who remember when
a crowded gymnasium in Manchester New Hampshire was the end of the road.
In fact...it was the only stop in the whole route....and you grew this
program from those humble beginings...and you were rookies too...who
came to play because it was the right thing to do, not because they were
going to Disney.

Remember too that there have been dozens of 1 year wonder teams, teams
who only did 1 year for whatever reasons even though they had full
participation rights...and they are not playing now despite the fact they
were encouraged to attend the nationals.

So....

Let's give those rookie teams of the future the respect they deserve,
let's believe they are coming to play for the right reasons, not because
of a promise to ......well, to kneel in the hot sun, but because they
believe it's the right thing to do...wether or not they make the nationals.

Let's not compromise the celebration of excellence because we fear that
first year teams are only joining up to attend the nationals...let's
celebrate achievement and give those teams something to shoot for.

mr.b

Re: perhaps, but
 

Posted by Frank Toussaint.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Engineer on team #111, Wildstang, from Wheeling and Rolling Meadows and Motorola .

Posted on 6/8/99 1:41 PM MST


In Reply to: perhaps, but posted by michael bastoni on 6/8/99 4:31 AM MST:



A wise man once said
quote:
We need to play the game alot......it's the preparation to playing time
ratio and costs that I wish to address at this moment.

A minimum of 10 weeks prep time (building the machine, the animation,
the CA, the FFL, the fund raising, the 'Community Events' (I so hate that
term)...all for what....FOR 1 or 2 brief moments of thrilling excitement
and INSPIRATION.?

Think about this good people....tens of thousands of dollars, weeks of
planning preparation, and fabrication....for 1 or 2 events....for
18 minutes of machine running time?

It borders on insane.. why do you think it's so hard to recruit teams?
Please ponder the ramifications here....please think about this simple
fact for a day, a week, and then present the remedy you would offer?

Here's mine.

PLAY WITH THE DARN MACHINE MORE.
unquote

The nationals are the ultimate occasion on which the machines are played.
Building the machines without playing them at the nationals is like
a day without sunshine and a day without sunshine is like... night.

ouch
 

Posted by michael bastoni.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Coach on team #23, PNTA, from Plymouth North High School and Boston Edison Co.

Posted on 6/8/99 6:07 PM MST


In Reply to: Re: perhaps, but posted by Frank Toussaint on 6/8/99 1:41 PM MST:



Frank,

Really...what can one say...I'm glad you went into
a technical career...though you'd have made a great lawyer.
And your a good man....... I did qualify my POV... the Nationals would
only work as invitationals IF there were other venues...
read...'other chances to play'

I certainly appreciate your point...it is well made, well taken,
and I sheepishly admit....well stated...:)

Mr.b

Mr.B. Master Pot Stirrer...
 

Posted by Joe Johnson.   [PICTURE: SAME | NEW | HELP]


Engineer on team #47, Chief Delphi, from Pontiac Central High School and Delphi Automotive Systems.

Posted on 6/8/99 7:35 PM MST


In Reply to: invitationals/nationals posted by michael bastoni on 6/6/99 6:39 PM MST:



Hey Mike,

Always stirring the pot, aren't you?

I do agree that the way forward is to have an invitation only Nationals that is sufficiently prestigeous to inspire kid regardless of the location.

By the way, I was flipping channels over the weekend and I came accross two competitions that were on ESPN2 that give me hope of some serious TV time for FIRST, The Sport.

The World's Strongest Man competition and Xtreme Bicycling. Both had games that were stranger, harder to follow, harder to judge, etc. AND Both had order of magnitude smaller crowds that we have in FIRST.

With the right production help, we could easily beat these sports in the TV game.

An invitation only Nationals is a necessary step to getting on TV in my opinion and TV is a necessary step to the cultural change that is central to mission of FIRST.

So...

Let's make 2000 the year FIRST takes this important step.

Joe J.