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Unread 07-04-2016, 08:52
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Hmm.
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Re: Triple Cyclers or Defense?

Let's look at this from an eliminations point of view, as it is at this point that you would be debating whether to formulate a triple cycler alliance, or a double cycler and a defense robot alliance. FIRST has a picking order as follows.
Code:
Captain  1st    2nd
1          09     24
2          10     23
3          11     22
4          12     21
5          13     20
6          14     19
7          15     18
8          16     17
If we look at the 3rd collumn (2nd picks), it's evident that, under the assumption that alliances make the correct picks (which is a variable we can't quite account for), that the 8th alliance should have a better 2nd pick robot than the 1st alliance. One could take this and draw the conclusion that, because of this, the 2nd pick robot on the 8th alliance should be more capable of completing tasks that satisfy point-scoring options of FRC Stronghold, as opposed to the 2nd pick robot on the 1st alliance, which may only have a drive train.

For the next sector, we will assume that the alliance captain and 1st pick are both on default cycling for any alliance, and the debate only exists in regards to what the 2nd pick should do.

Since we've seen that the 8th alliance's 2nd pick robot should be strongest, we will decide whether or not they should have this 2nd pick robot playing defense when playing the 1st alliance (a typical QF match). There are several factors that could make having a 2nd pick cycling as well an intelligent move, or a complete mistake.

Clutter
FRC Stronghold as just a field is already cluttered. The goals are all very close together, as they are all on a fairly small tower, opposed to a game like Aerial Assist where there was a very wide goal, or Ultimate Ascent, where the goals were less compressed. On top of this, the surface area of the places to score from is very limited. The game has enforced a rule to only be allowed to shoot from the Courtyard, meaning that you have to get reasonably close as opposed to a game like...

Aerial Assist: Half court shots to score, or full court to get the ball to the other side of the field to then be scored.

Ultimate Ascent: Shoot from anywhere on the field, even full court.

The most recent game that comes to mind in which the area which it was only really easy to score from a close range was Breakaway. However, in this game, the goals were also spread out on opposite ends, unlike the compressed nature of FRC Stronghold.

Now, assuming that we go against this logic of clutter, and do a triple cycler anyways, it's quite plausible that someone who has some decent sense of strategy would play a defender robot on top of all three robots. Now you have four robots in one courtyard. That's going to be fun. And not only that, you now only have, at maximum, two robots in the other courtyard, allowing them to have plenty of room and free space to carry out fast and efficient cycles without delay.

In such a compressed and compact game with limitations on where you can do what, clutter is a problem that will appear with triple cyclers, especially if the other alliance plays a defense robot.

Stopping The Other Alliance From High Goaling
Keep in mind that we are still considering the value of a triple cycle alliance from the view of an 8th alliance, as it is the most plausible situation where this strategy could be valuable.

High goaling has become extremely frequent this season, clearly showing itself as a major factor that determines whether or not an alliance emerges a match as a victor. However, the high goaling, on average, isn't great yet. Or even good, for that matter. Very few robots have shown the ability to shoot from the outerworks (a safe shot) without being blocked. 2056 is capable of shooting from there, but their shot is at a low enough angle that it can be blocked with a tall robot. 118 demonstrated their shot in their reveal that cleared a defender. However, in all honesty, in match, 118 hasn't really been able to carry out this shot very well, and have been favouring the batter shot.

From this, we can continue on the analysis based off of the notion that all robots can be defended against, and that no robots have a safe shot that can't be blocked.

Many robots have displayed very long shot line-up/shooter speed-up rates. I feel like it is safe to say that examples of these teams aren't necessary, as these long line-up times have become an average in FRC Stronghold. Because of this, a robot on defense can effectively push a robot out of their line-up position before they release the ball. Some more recent robots that cannot be pushed as easily, but can still be blocked from getting to what could be considered their "lock down spot" are 1241 (beside the batter), 118 (batter), and 610 (on the wall beside the batter). However, it's fair to say that defense can still be effective on them, in regards to either stopping them from getting to their "safe spot", or slowing them down.

The real kicker in regards to why it's important is simply that, if they aren't defended, they're almost unstoppable monsters, and it's just a free walk in the park for them for shooting. Coming from the view of an 8th alliance once again, you'll be up against some of these elites, and you need to stop them. Slowing down these high goals is essential to success as a lower alliance.

Secret Passage
The secret passage is a gold mine in regards to scoring objects, should it be left undefended. If no one is there, you can go in and out quickly, scoring, and reducing your cycle time phenomenally. If you are able to get more than 6 balls into the goal, you can keep on going, and they'll be forced to feed the balls onto the field for you, so long as you can keep up.

On a side note, I'm shocked that I haven't really seen people putting the boulders through the battrice (I think that's what it's called, it's so forgotten about), when high level teams start to play this strategy and there is no defender. It would certainly mess up their cycle, considering that they're expecting the balls to come out of the lower human player slots.

To be brief, you simply need a defender to stop the opposing alliance from getting these boulders. The importance isn't as much because it's always extremely valuable to have a robot defending to stop them from getting these balls, the importance is that it will hurt a lot if you don't have a robot defending to stop them from getting these balls.

Overall
It seems that it is safe to conclude that, in an 8th alliance, a 2nd pick is needed to defend to stop the 1st alliance from having a scoring palooza, while a 1st alliance (on the other end of the spectrum) is typically the weakest robot selected for an alliance, and thus has a very low chance of being valuable as a cycler, and may just get in the way more than it can help.
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FRC 2013-2015 (K-Botics #2809)
VEX 2015 - 2016 (W.A.F.F.L.E.S. #4476)
FLL 2015 - ??? (MechMasters #16931)
FRC 2016 - ??? (W.A.F.F.L.E.S. #4476)
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My thoughts and ideas do not necessarily reflect those of my team.
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