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Unread 24-08-2004, 17:01
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Re: segway license, turn signals, and no sidewalks?

OK ... this is it - I wanted to wait with this reply to an earlier post as I have been working on it for several days on and off (I do have a life outside of CD, albeit not too exciting) and it is not quite "ready" for publication ... but here it is ...

But first ... Mike, Judging by your recent post:
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeDubreuil
Judging by the consequences of this thread being posted...
Segway users will pout, present an argument based on unscientific evidence and then become elitist and claim everyone else just doesn't get it.
it is REALLY starting to look to me like you are just trying to be a jerk.

... I've had enough ... I'm finished with this debate ...

************************************************** ********
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeDubreuil
I have been asked to post the facts...

...

To put out a bad analogy- regular citizens aren't allowed to own automatic weapons. It might be easier to take down a buffalo with an automatic, that's a benefit. However, for the safety of the majority of Americans, politicians have chosen to make them illegal.
First of all Mike, you are right about the bad analogy - how about all of the LEGAL firearms and other weapons that have killed and injured so many - of course that makes perfect sense when you realize that legislators' real priority is NOT the "safety of the majority" (not that I pretend to know what their priorities are ... but there sure are a ton of ridiculous laws on the books).
... And now I will start back at the top of your post ...

Quote:
The facts are that someone needs to prove to me why the Segway is not unsafe for pedestrians. Why it should not be classified differently from a Honda motor scooter and why it should be given EPAMD status (Electric Personal Assistive Mobility Device).
Proof? ... well what type of proof do you need? What would be adequate? Nearly a year ago there had been 6000 Segways sold (info from the September 26 "U.S. Consumer Product Safety Commission and Segway LLC Voluntary Recall to Upgrade Software on Segway™ Human Transporters"), and although Segway LLC does not release sales numbers, I would say that now, nearly a year later, 10,000 would be a conservative estimate of the number of Segways currently in service. I have not heard of a single documented case of a pedestrian being injured by a Segway. If you have, I would appreciate you enlightening us. The FACT is that no one needs to prove anything TO YOU. I doubt any logical arguement would change your mind anyway, but as I said before, I think if you spent a week (or even just a day) using a Segway your perspective would be much different.

Quote:
You might think why bother? "Mike doesn't get it and he's an ignorant fool."
It's true ... YOU DON'T GET IT ... however I have never heard/seen anyone call you either ignorant, OR a fool. You just don't understand what the Segway is, or what it is all about. I guess I shouldn't hold that against you - some people "get it" and some dont. But I have never known of anyone who has spent any significant time on a Segway who didn't recognize the inherent safety of this incredible piece of machinery, and realize many useful applications for it. And again I will say, spend some time on one and you will understand.

Quote:
It looks like there's a lot of politicians in Massachusetts who don't get it either. Or maybe, they are legislating the minority for the safety of the majority. Either way, you need to convince someone why you should be able to ride your Segway in Massachusetts and many other states in the United States.
Regarding the politicians, Massachusets is currently also considering legislation similar to what 41 OTHER STATES HAVE ENACTED (see http://www.segway.com/general/regulatory.html), which defines the classification of EPAMD, specifically for the Segway, with special status different from other motorized vehicles. There are a lot more places where you can legally use a Segway on the sidewalk, than places you can't.

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As the Segway is a new and unique application of technology, is very difficult for most of us to adequately explain the differences between it and some other motorized transportation devices. I will paraphrase from a post by a fellow Segway owner on SegwayChat.com who does a great job with this explanation...

Quote:
paraphrased ...
The Segway HT is welcome pretty much everywhere in this country, however there are a few places where policies or people do not understand the physics of an equilibrium machine and (often innocently) ignorantly lump it in with conventional motorized machines.

Bicycles and conventional motorized scooters operate by propulsion and braking. When a person accelerates the device it is propelled forward, pulling the operator with it. When the same person applies the brakes, friction or electronic mechanisms slow the vehicle down. The person is slowed down by/with the device, while their momentum would otherwise keep them moving. When the gears are disengaged, the vehicle will "free wheel," moving in whatever direction it is moving until gravity and friction bring it to a stop.

In other words, the vehicle is "carrying" the person. Rapid braking will result in the occupant(s) of the vehicle being thrust forward. The vehicle will continue driving right through something, at the hazard of its occupants and the target.

On the other hand, people move around in their native state by balancing. Balance is a beautiful thing. If a person leans forward, their legs will move underneath them to keep them from falling. Gravity is pulling them forward(/down), and their legs are keeping them safe. AS A RESULT OF MAINTAINING BALANCE the person moves forward.

The Segway HT works like a person. When a person on a Segway HT wants to stand in place, the Segway HT's motors, responding to signals generated by the balance/tilt sensors (1000 times per second) move very slightly back and forth, keeping the person balanced in place. When the rider thinks, leans, or otherwise wills themselves forward, their center of gravity moves forward, and they are in essence falling forward by the force of gravity--just like walking on their feet. So, just like a pair of legs, the Segway HT will move forward to "catch" the rider, keeping them safe. The result of this "dynamic balancing" is motion in the direction of the lean.
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Stuart Bloom
Mechanical Engineer
Rolls-Royce Corporation
FIRST Team 1018 - Pike HS RoboDevils
My activity for 2012:
  • Boilermaker planning committee
  • Israel Head Ref - DONE (and it was FANTASTIC!)
  • Boilermaker Regional (with 1018) - DONE
  • Midwest Head Ref - DONE
  • WORLD Championships (with 1018) - DONE
  • IRI Head Ref - DONE
  • CAGE Match Head Ref
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