[Rich Kressly]

With all due respect, it's not "blacklisting" at all. And it's not an "unwritten rule" anymore. In the 2004 manual and documents sent to all hall of fame teams it's all spelled out very clearly. The Hall of Fame is a special place and a chance for the kids to meet special people and be held up as role models for the entire program. The same submission is required to receive Hall of Fame status each year and these entries provide examples for others to follow. My experience with 103 showed that all of our team mentors worked harder AFTER winning the Chairman's Award even knowing we couldn't win it again, because we all knew the importance of upholding the honor and obligation that comes with the award. I'm not sure what teams this means death to at all - 22. 47, 103, 151, 175, 191, 254 and the others haven't gone anywhere - and that lifetime invite to the Championship is a pretty sweet deal considering the qualification process. This was discussed at length last year in the latter parts of this thread:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...ad.php?t=26927

Originally Posted by AustinPowers

I am a 3 year mentor, with an engineering masters degree, from a veteran team just as Chief Delphi, Baxter Bomb Squad and many others. I see that everyone needs to show results from the completion since the schools and companies see only results. I agree that results need to be the focus, so that teams can convince administrators and companies that First is worth continuing and First is as good as sports programs. As a veteran team member I wish to campaign for a next level. I say this because after winning there is an unwritten rule that your team can not win again in things other than the robot completion. The kids are new every other year and that fact is over looked in most First rules. The mentors are not and this needs to be a focus of future chairman’s awards and such. Black listing teams will be the “Death of FIRST.” This is the problem for the future of FIRST. I warn that this needs to be address by all veteran teams. Not a destroy approach and force teams in giving up their name and number and starting again. What I see first saying like telling an NCAA team that you can only win one national award in your life time and no more. I am sure that every college will agree that having a team is not worth just that one win. The chairman’s award is a way of making sure the teams are replicating and growing first. So, by “word of mouth” First may fail if it is know that the teams have no more to win. I can not stand by and let this happen! Can you? I know that not all students will be engineers in the traditional disciplines, but doctors, lawyers and many other disciplines of engineering. Promote this!

I suggest and welcome comments to what I am about to suggest. Lets create another level for the veteran teams. It may be an added level of complying for the games and chairman’s awards and the like awards. Not the death by winning. The idea is this veteran teams will have status of input to many First decisions and voting rights, not to complicate the bureaucracy of meetings for first. This is for added input from that’s with experience from the inside. The game will have an added requirement, such as a particular task that only these teams will be allowed to do. This may require an additional tournament level, but based on the same game as the others. Example, the teams that qualify can get approved to perfect the autonomous mode. This will require a mile stone to be passed/approved by first. Then if this is reached, you will have an extra amount of time say two weeks to perfect the additional autonomous task. This will set us apart from the rookie teams.

In the chairman’s side of things, FIRST could require direct replication of the veterans teams knowledge by adopting a 2 or more year team and growing them to win an award and showing community growth of FIRST. First can become as popular as sports this way. The team may gain points some way to compete against one another in the accomplishments of growth. There is money donations for the cause for spreading the word about FIRST if it becomes as popular as sports. We all know it can.

Lets create the next level of FIRST together veteran teams. Please pass on my words if you agree to the people that want to make a difference. Dean Kamen always comes by to check on our team each time he is where we are in location. Mr. Kamen worked for Baxter at one time, a still gets lots of money from our company in royalties. So, I hope that he will listen to this call of the next level. And request input from the veteran teams. He is a master and we have met his requirements, thus it is only fair to make us masters as well, maybe?