[Jaine Perotti]

Ok, I have held off on joining this discussion long enough. Generally, I steer away from the political/controversial threads. However, since this thread seems to be keeping relatively calm (considering the topic that is being discussed), I think I will share my opinions with the CD community. Keep in mind that my experience with religion is mostly of a Christian background - I do not claim to make accurate judgments of other world religions. In this case, I will be using Christian examples for the most part.

I am an agnostic, meaning that I believe that one can never know for sure whether there is or is not a God or gods, and that I do not deny or endorse the existence of a higher power(s). I used to be a Christian - I was raised as Christian, and both of my parents are Christian, although they belong to different denominations. In my eighth grade year, however, I started to question my beliefs in God shortly after the 9/11 terrorist attacks. Number one, I simply could not believe that God could have allowed the attacks to take place, and kill so many people. I had never questioned this aspect about God before, because all of the violence in the world that I would hear about on the news seemed so distant.

When 9/11 struck, however, I felt that my world had been turned upside down, and all of a sudden, violent death and destruction was only 2 hours away from my house. I did not understand why a being with so much power could allow innocent people to die - ruin the lives of thousands of husbands, wives, children, and loved ones. At age 13, I was beginning to mature more and more intellectually, and it led me to think about the rest of the world - all of the wars, people starving to death, children dying - and I wondered to myself... "If I were God, I would never EVER let people have to suffer, or die unjustly, or allow the preconditions to exist in the FIRST PLACE to let those things happen!" This was the beginning of the loss of my faith.

The other thing that led me to lose my faith was the sermons that were being preached shortly after 9/11 in my mother's church. The pastor in my church viewed the events of 9/11 and the war in Israel as signs of the second coming (the end of the world according to Christians). Now, let me tell you, [1] having your world turned upside down by the 9/11 attacks and struggling to comprehend them, PLUS [2] being told that the world was about to end, was a very stressful thing for a child. Everything I knew as being true - the stability of knowing that the world was going to stay here, and knowing that people are basically good, and believing that life in general is basically good - was being challenged by these events in my life. I did not want the world to end, and I was terrified of it every day. I wondered how God would create a world he was only going to destroy - my world, the only thing that I have - and give people free will only so that they can choose to kill each other, and allow terrible things to happen and ruin people's lives.

One of my main problem with the Christian religion (I am not very knowledgeable of other world religions) is this idea of God's "gift" of free will to human beings. Why did God choose to give Adam and Eve free will, knowing that they would choose to eat from the Tree of Knowledge? Yes, he HAD to know, because according to the Bible, God is omnipotent. Why on earth did he choose to put an evil thing in the garden of Eden, with the full knowledge that it would spell destruction of the world and would cause millions upon millions of people pain and suffering? How can Christians claim that God is all-loving, when he spelled out our own fate to suffer upon the earth that he created? It is almost like putting a chocolate bar in front of a two-year old, telling them not to eat it because it is bad for them, and then walking away - later coming back to find that the two year old had eaten the chocolate bar, and deciding not only to banish them from your home, but banish all of their future descendants as well. Yes, the analogy is extreme, but is it really all that different from what God chose to do to Adam and Eve? Does not sound very nice or loving or forgiving AT ALL to me.

The other problem that I have is the idea of the coexistence of good and evil according to Christianity. According to the Bible, God made everything in the Universe - the angels, the earth, humans, flora and fauna. According to the Bible, God is also perfect. So wouldn't all of the things he created also be perfect? However, the things that God created were not perfect - in fact, so flawed that one of his own angels, Lucifer, decided to rebel against him and ultimately was banished to hell and become known as Satan. If you follow this logic, then technically God created evil. He also created evil when he chose to place the Tree of Knowledge and the serpent in the Garden of Eden. How can an all-loving, perfect God create evil? Create the very thing that causes pain and suffering in this world? How is God therefore perfect? How can we trust him? Why did he create evil in the first place, if he knew that it would cause so many iniquities and terrors in the future? Why does he banish people to hell for acting in the way that he created them to act? None of this is fair!

I have problems not only with the Christian religion, but organized religion as a whole. Lets look at it this way:

The most difficult people you will encounter in life are those who believe that they are inarguably, unquestionably, right. In the work place, the most difficult coworkers you will find are going to be the ones who wont listen to you, or have an open mind about any other ideas besides their own. If you are an engineer, and you are working on a design project, you will not want people on your team who will be so steadfast about what they think, that they are absolutely unwilling to let their ideas be modified or not even used at all.

In the same way, organized religion creates factions of people who believe that they are unarguably, unquestionably, right. This simple fact is what leads to the religious wars that have occurred throughout history and are continuing still today. It is what has lead to the unnecessary, unjust killings of thousands and thousands of people in the past, and unfortunately, will kill many in the future.

Not only is organized religion responsible for many of the wars throughout history, but it also pronounces unfair judgment against those who it believes are immoral or just plain wrong. It allows for very little ability to accept other religious beliefs or ethics - this is almost unarguable, because those who do not believe in God's law are not to attain salvation and are instead doomed to go to hell. When I was a Christian - and I am very ashamed of this - I used to prejudge people who did not believe in God or were not Christian. I know I do not speak for all Christians when I say this - I am merely reporting my own experiences. For example, I remember that I would never go out with a guy who was not Christian, and I would have somewhat of a distrust for non-Christians. I am very embarrassed about this fact, but this is the effect that organized religion can have on people, particularly young children, as I was. I did not realize that there are good, ethical people in this world who are not Christian. Now, I strongly dislike the fact that Christianity says that all non-believers will go to hell, because I know that there are many good people in this world who are non-Christian, and certainly do not deserve to go to hell. How can God send good people to hell? Again, this does not seem remotely fair to me, especially because God is claimed to be just and forgiving.

As much as I dislike organized religion and Christianity, I do see why people choose to practice religion. Not everything about religion is bad. I think the main reason that people turn to religion is because of their desire to feel comfortable with the world around them, and have an explanation for the things that they don't understand. Religion also functions as a guideline for how you conduct your life. Most religions have certain rules about how one is supposed to behave. All of these rules have to do with improving your life, and other people's lives, and consequently the world. Most religions concern themselves of ridding the world of evil. Therefore, religions exist as a means for human beings to acquire happiness - something all human beings are constantly striving for.

I also want to maintain my happiness and improve the world. However, the difference between me and a religious person lies in where I derive the "rules" of my life from, and what sources I use to gain a greater understanding of the world. I derive my ethics from what I feel and observe about people, and what I see as being right and wrong. A religious person instead follows what the religious leaders or texts say should be considered moral behavior. I rely on empirical observations and scientific knowledge to explain the world and the universe, while religious people see the universe in a more religious context - finding ways to link what they see with what they believe.

Well, now that I have written practically a book for everyone to read, I will leave it at that. Please respond in any way you wish. I hope that I have not offended anyone by the statements I have chosen to make. In fact, I SINCERELY, DEEPLY hope that I have not offended anyone. One of the hard things about making controversial posts is the possibility of losing respect of those within the FIRST community. Sometimes, when I read these threads, I am like... no... no don't say that! I respect you, I don't want to know your religious or political affiliation because it may cause me to judge you or respect you differently! In that way, I almost wish that these types of threads were not allowed, but I do enjoy a good intellectual discussion. Along with many people on these forums, I am not sure whether or not this type of discussion should be allowed. I guess that is a decision we all need to think about now.

-- Jaine