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Originally Posted by Andy Baker
Are both teams learning? yes.
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Originally Posted by Ryan Forystek
NO.
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How do you know? The answer is you don't.
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Originally Posted by Ryan Forystek
I realize there are no absolutes here, but what I have seen has appalled me. I've witnessed an engineer on a team with an obviously professionally designed robot yelling at one of his pit crew about how he was “stupid" for the way he was trying to fix something, then push him out of the way and do it himself. Witnessing things like this make me VERY thankful I am on a team with high student involvement.
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Why is it that if a robot looks good it's automatically made by only engineers? This is a common misconception, and if I were a student who had a hand in a professional design, I'd be insulted.
When you see the pits of these teams at regionals, It seems like the kids are standing around when the engineers do all the work. People learn from doing something, not watching someone else do it.
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Originally Posted by Ryan ForystekHere’s the big problem. How are high schoolers supposed to compete against professionally designed and built robots? This is where the true conflict is. The teams who believe that FIRST is better when the students actually build and manage the robot get destroyed in competition. FIRST is not supposed to be a professional engineering competition. If the engineering mentors want that, there are other avenues. FIRST is meant to Inspire the STUDENTS. The more we allow for these professionally designed and built robots to dominate the FIRST competitions, the more it encourages student run teams to start letting the engineers design and build the robots. [U
FIRST will start to discourage many teams from participating when they realize that the robot they spent six weeks on has no chance of success at the competition. [/u]
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FIRST isn't about the competition. Dean has said it isn't, and won't be fair. The competition is a means to an end. How can you
possibly characterize what inspires a student by what inspires you? the answer, as I said before, is you can't.
Also, until you've worked with a team, or spent an extensive amount of time around them, do not make ignorant claims about how their team is ran. You have no idea what they have or haven't done, and you have no right to demean their work. It's not up to others to police mentor involvement on a team. It's up to the students. If they feel like they don't have enough involvement,
THEY need to fix that, likewise if they feel that they have too much involvement, they need to get mentors into the game.
$0.02