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Originally Posted by Cody C
Because they are here Illegaly, We don't let a theif take a car and keep it. The theif cheated his way into the car, hoping to avoid a system that is expensive and time-consuming, a system that makes it so that if he is late on a payment he loses his car. But we still take the car away Because it was wrong of him to take it in the first place!
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What do we do about squatters?
'Illegal' and 'wrong' are non necessarily the same things. And they, for better or worse, are necessarily interpreted on a situational basis, especially when the interests of a nation are involved. The thief analogy captures some of the problem, but it's inadequate to convey the complexities of the immigration question.
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Originally Posted by Cody C
Because that accomplishes the exact same thing that sending jobs over seas does, it takes a job away from a legal american citizen, and gives it to somebody else, who does not live in america rightfully.
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Who cares? Someone has a job, someone's doing better than they were previously. And frankly, if I had the choice between elevating a first-world citizen from unemployment to gainful productivity, and doing the same for a ex-third-world immigrant, I'd tend to pick the immigrant, because they have further to rise. True, America also has its destitute, and for them, I'd welcome a job placement where they can earn a living wage. But when a middle-class or higher citizen complains about a migrant taking his job, I've got very little sympathy. If the immigrant can do it cheaper, faster, better, etc., then why are we fostering an unproductive practice? Because it's patriotic? (Are you a capitalist or a jingoist, at heart?)
The problem is, the immigration system (in America) is principally constructed to keep people out. Every step of the way, there are hurdles and barriers to slow you down, to discourage you. And what's the point? Nearly none of that is devoted to getting people who can fill American needs; mostly, it's there just to get the
number of immigrants down. And all this, when America clearly needs people to fill jobs in the service and manufacturing sectors. Apart from the fleeing criminals and sly terrorists (of which there are very, very few), illegal immigrants aren't sneaking in to steal your car or blow up your city. They see jobs unfilled in America, jobs that pay more than they're accustomed to, and wonder why the immigration system won't let them fill them. They skip around it, because they know that they don't stand a very good chance at all of getting in any other way.
So are they unwanted? Well, it sure seems that way, when you talk to a politician. But businesses will privately confide that they do value the services of the migrant workers, because that's the only way that they can compete with the offshore companies. They can't afford to pay American wages, because Americans aren't willing to pay commensurate prices for their goods. The immigrants aren't stealing jobs, they're filling jobs that would otherwise have disappeared, because of unsustainable wages.
The irony here, is that immigrants, be they illegal or otherwise, are prolonging the survival of many sectors of American industry. Without illegals, for example, the cost of California produce would rise dramatically. You'd end up importing much more from South America, because you wouldn't be able to afford domestic prices. The domestic industry would wither. So what do we do about it? Cut American wages? (Can't do that, American citizens object to low wages.) Bomb South America? (Let's not try that....) Among other possibilities, the most convenient compromise is really the one that exists now—look the other way at the illegals, because they, in large part, are the ones keeping prices down for the consumers.