[ChuckDickerson]

Originally Posted by Billfred

(I searched "rivet" and didn't find anything, so here goes.)

See this post in this thread. Contrary to chakorules opinion we had excelent success riveting the KitBot chassis last year.

Originally Posted by Billfred

So I know that there are those of the riveting school of thought, at least when it comes to your frame. I'm looking at the option of riveting up the kit frame next year (assuming it's the same and blah blah blah), as it seems to be an easy way to both drop some weight (albeit less than welding, but with the advantage of easier repair) and cut out the issue of locknuts backing out.?

We riveted the KitBot chassis last year and had ZERO problems, ZERO lost rivets, and ZERO failures. We went all the way to the finals at our one and only regional (Colorado) and only lost by a few points in the last match. We found a riveted KitBot to be very strong and effective. We will probably do it again this year unless something drastically changes.

Originally Posted by Billfred

This leads to a few questions in my mind:

1) Are rivets a viable option for an average FIRST robot frame??

Absolutely! They are cheap and effective. They can easily be drilled out if needed and do not weaken the frame like welding. They save a significant amount of weight over nuts and bolts and there is no chance of the nuts loosening and falling out. They are simple to install after you do one or two and get the hang of it and are actually much faster than nuts and bolts because you don't have to hold a wrench in a hard to reach location.

Originally Posted by Billfred

2) What kind of rivets are best for this? Aluminum is the cheapest option, but stainless steel rivets have higher strength by orders of magnitude.?

We used .25 diameter aluminum rivets with an aluminum mandrel. Specifically MSC item #04045431 - $7.06 per hundred. You will need a couple of boxes. You will also need a rivet tool that can handle 1/4" revits. The small ones you get at the local home store won't cut it. We used MSC item #74327552 - $93.91. The tool is a little expensive but works and was the least cost tool I could find that would handle 1/4" rivets. Buy it once and it will last for many seasons.

Originally Posted by Billfred

3) If you've riveted the kit frame, is it best to just put rivets everywhere the bolts should go, or can you do well with less??

We basically replaced the 1/4" nuts and bolts in the KitBot with 1/4" rivets. We put them in the same holes plus or minus a few where we attached our roller pillow blocks and upper ball holder frame. We also riveted diamond plate to the KitBot frame. You could probably do with less rivets but they really don't weigh much each so it isn't a big loss to put a few extra in. If you properly rivet the KitBot frame together replacing each of the 1/4" bolts with a rivet you will have a very tight, strong, and durable frame and save more weight than you think. When you get your kit this year open up the KitBot box and put those two little bags of nuts and bolts on a scale and see how much they weigh. IIRC it was almost 2 lbs. If you put a nut and bolt in each hole as instructed you won't have many left over.

Originally Posted by Billfred

4) Is there anything in particular to look for in the way of damage after the robot has taken a few hits?

We never had a problem with damaged rivets. We were a big target and got into a lot of pushing and smashing matches. Our 0.020" diamond plate got smashed a bit in places but our rivets and the KitBot frame are still just as good as the day we put it together during the first week after kickoff last January.

Any other questions just let me know. I have to give two thumbs up to a properly riveted KitBot!