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Originally Posted by Stud Man Dan
FIRST has specifically defined that it is in your best interest for your opponent to score as many points as possible. If its in your best interest to allow them to do the best they can why not talk with them before a match?
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It should not have to come down to a team talking with another and making a pre-match agreement. It should be done during build season so they build a good robot. I'm not saying collaborate during the build season with other teams to formulate a master plan, this really wouldn't work because chances of two teams being in the same match are relatively low. But I am saying that teams should be seeking help. It is in the veteran’s best interests to help them during this more important time so they have a better chance! Not everything has to pertain to competitions and please do tell me everyone here remembers what FIRST is about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stud Man Dan
Now, as far as ethically speaking, in general competition this kind of cooperation is typically frowned upon, yes, But if it is the rule are stated as such then what is the argument about? Until the rule is changed or modified, then this approach is not only ethical its just out right good strategy.
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I do agree that there is no rule set in place and that there is currently nothing stopping this action. People are in argument with this action because it does not follow within the spirit of FIRST. I will not agree though that it is ethical. Comparing this to a business environment (which is what teams are basing their structures off of) then it would be against the law and very unethical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stud Man Dan
When people scored balls in the opponents goals last year this could have easily been perceived as collusion, however there was nearly no negative response, and no response from FIRST. This strategy was solid and allowed dominant teams to remain in the position they deserved. Since you are not allowed to score opponents tubes the only option left for people to boost their qualifying points is to come to a predetermined agreement. Whether its because of a " Gentleman’s Agreement " or a outright "Collusion" its the same thing.
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There is a slight difference between these two actions. A team who physically scores points for the opponent is doing so on their own will. They do not need the approval of the other alliance to do so. Making a deal with another team requires that that team agree. This is
NOT the only option. Like I said above, help the rookies during build to help them make a better robot. Show them what they can do and help bring out their potential.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stud Man Dan
The point that is missed here, is generally no team agrees to lose a match, just to compete in a realm that maximizes points for both teams. Regardless of whether its frowned upon or not, if the rules remain as posted, it will happen, and it won't break the rules. If you find it unethical, the same way most of FIRST participants found collaboration between teams during build unethical, then don't participate. However it is within the realm of this years rules, and in fact as per the rules is " In your best interest. "
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Please don't compare this with teams who are collaborating to build robots. They do this because they don't have the resources to do so. Also lets end that topic right now, we don't need more wildfire to spread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stud Man Dan
I personally want the rule to be modified as to specifically by honor, state no such prematch agreements should ever take place, whether it be "Cooperation" or a "Gentleman’s Agreement" but until the rules are changed then such agreements will take place.
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This is the only statement that I almost 100% agree with. I do not think however that this sort of thing will happen because it requires 6 teams to agree. And from most responses it is a mixed bunch.