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Re: We are on the same bus.....
Posted by Fran .
Other on team #166, Team Merrimack, from Merrimack High School and Unitrode/R.S. Machines.
Posted on 6/2/99 8:31 AM MST
In Reply to: We are on the same bus..... posted by michael bastoni on 6/1/99 8:24 PM MST:
: The idea of continueing and expanding on the current robot for longer period of time can still be done after the fact. There are no rules after nationals and if it teachs your students more about how to improve on a design then go for it. Imagine what the robots showing up at Rumble might be able to do. You could work all year long on changes and have micro-meets like we did in the school cafeteria during lunch hour...all you need is one other robot from a nearby school. We met the following week at the other schools caf to return the favor...it was simple without too much planning and it work,,,everyone from 2 schools knew what we were doing and we had fun playing with our robot more.
FIRST really wants the schools to create a curriculum so all these aspects are taught year round not just in 6 weeks and that is why they have added the new award for curriculum development. This will allow for learning how to use and develop the things neccessary for the 6 week crunch without taking time away from the companies....it should ease burnout.We are certainly hoping to bring the FIRST course to our school but it might take a while yet. We need to grab the interest before High school so they look for it when they arrive. We are putting on a demonstration at our middle school in conjunction with the Lego League for our 8th graders, including animation..hopefully the interest will go home and as more kids want it, the parents will seek more from the school boards,
I guess I'm rambling and off the subject by now but KEEP IT SIMPLE and use your robots.
: I would love to do nothing more than share a cold drink on my porch with
: the people who contribute to this page...agree or disagree it does not
: matter...what matters is that we are 'outing' what is essential to this
: program....because we are this program...the kids, the technical folks,
: the teachers and the parents.....and what we believe is essential, is what
: is essential. And there are some striking comonalities surfacing in this
: dialogue as well as some strongly held opinions...good show..strong opinions
: demonstrate passion and passion is the antidote to apathy.
: For instance...Dan holds strongly to student involvement...to the belief
: that high school students can do the 'engineering'...and properly supported
: they can...I have seen too many examples of what young men and women have
: achieved to think otherwise....
: But let me please go on record as being highly respective of anyone with
: a technical degree, and exponentially respective of those who hold
: advanced degrees....and so it goes.
: And the FIRST games as they exist presently
: are at just about the right level for high school students to participate
: fully...but to participate fully they need instruction and lots and lots of
: time to gain experience and insight... Teachers cannot take 30 students and bring them
: all up to speed on the intricacies of electro-mechanical design,Materials Science,
: Machine tool processes, Microcontroller programming, Desktop Publishing
: AutoCad visualization and 3DMax animation techniques....enough to be competitive...in six weeks...
: but we can over a period of 5 years...Because given the time, resources and 'reason'
: to do it...the students develop these skills themselves. Trust me on this,
: They really do. But remember the important part of the phrase...'Given the time and resources
: and reason...' The reason they take the time to do it is because they want
: the achievement, the recognition of the achievement and the knowledge
: gained through their effort...And while I am very
: biased towards my kids...I will concede that they are more the normative
: example as opposed to the extreme. And I freely admit to being more the 'keeper'
: of our lab facility, rather than the director.
: NOTE: The Pappalardo Mechanical Engineering Lab at a small university in
: Cambridge Massachusetts (MIT) exists soley for the reason that engineering
: students should get their hands dirty building machines...even if they will
: never put their hands to the work again,,,,cause it provides deeper understanding
: if the kids do it THEMSELVES (and many other engineering schools
: hold to the same belief).....hey..if it's good enough for MIT...it works for me.
:
: What I am asking for is the time...the time to work out the design
: on the playing field with the kids and the support group, not under the pressure
: cooker of the 6 week limitation...The time to really 'Work Out' the design, to see
: it to it's logical conclusion...to continue the design process for a period of
: 2 or 3 seasons before we change it again....to have the time to develop the
: solution and bring it to maturity and beyond...before we have to throw it
: aside and start the process all over again...I am trying desperately to
: relieve burn out...not increase it.
: I do not look at playing with the machines as a trivial exercise, but rather
: as a test bed for incremental improvements and 'Proof of Concept' trials.
: This is how we learn....Learning is something I think I have some insight into.
: I also look at playing with the machines as a time where students, teachers
: and engineers and parents can come together to share the gift of themselves.
: Just as Mike Aubry so clearly pointed out.( Great perspective Mike, right on)
: JJ you KNOW that you have deeply impacted at least a few of the students on
: our team...and it did not happen during the building of your robot or ours..
: It happened at a time when we came together to play with the robots...which
: in reality was not playing with them per se...but a legitimate extension of
: the design process...
: Eureka! That's it...I have come incrementally closer to formulating my
: position...I did not intend the phrase, play with the robots, in the sense that it appeared.
: I meant that if we continue to play with the robots we are in fact simply
: extending the design phase...a design phase that is far more sustainable
: over the years and far more beneficial to the students in the long run...
: And hey...I'm not going to war over this either, because I value all your
: opinions far too much...and I clearly appreciate that the POV of
: an engineering volunteer will be understandably different from that of an educator
: and for very good reasons....and so the discussion continues as it should.
: I for one am coming closer to an understanding of what we are doing
: for these children, and for all the imperfections, and personal biasis, it is
: 'A good thing'.
: One last thing....
: I am particularly attracted to the other elephant...the one JJ talks about
: where the professional engineers with major (read NASCAR) corporate backing
: compete with robots that look like something out of ALIEN...you know, where
: Sirgony Weaver gets into the hydraulic actuated persoanl maximizer and gets
: the job done...(This is admittedly straight from JJ in a sane moment)
: I find this possibility VERY attractive....now that's inspiration. Leave
: the little 130 pounders to the kids...I sooo think that is what Dean's vision
: will evolve to....and then the kids and teachers and parents will have their significant
: involvement...and we can watch Chrysler knock end effectors with Coke and Toyota
: at the Meadowlands, or in the Superdome and then go home and tune up
: our robots to be like THEM....Stone Cold Steve Austin ain't
: even ready for this....
: mr.b
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