[fredliu168]

Originally Posted by Rick TYler

Yabbut... The average FIRST FTC team buys two starter kits, not one. With the $275 registration fee and $50 battery kit (something you leave out of your Vex comparison), most teams are spending at least $925 (with the FTC discount, thats more like $750) already. If you add in two more transmitters and batteries for another driver, you are over $1,000. If FIRST can provide a kit with enough parts to build a real competition robot (something the basic Vex kit does not) and registration for under $1,000, they are in the ball park. The Washington regional is free, so I don't include a regional fee. I also can't see anyone building a competitive tournament robot for much under $900-1,000 in Vex parts. Vex is great, but it ain't cheap.

How do you know the average team buys two starter kits? Did you do a survey of teams?
I know several teams that purchased a starter kit in their first year along with battery and built up this year by purchasing additional parts. This means they spent around $350 per year in parts. If they were to do IFI, they may need to spend around $300 on additional parts for next year to continue the program. For FTC they would need to spend $1000 not to mention registeration on the mysterious starter kit.
I'm not sure exactly what is contained in the starter kit for FTC so I cannot say if this is a good deal or not. However, many teams who invested a great deal of money on creating several teams (I'm thinking of woburn who competed with 8 teams in Ontario ) to teach students with a fun competition now cannot make nearly as many FTC teams.

I don't what you mean by "reliability." You seem to be speaking to "will the technical platform ever change?," not reliability. I'm not sure what "bad habit" you are referring to. The real FVC/FTC program is just finishing its second year, and the 12x12 field hasn't changed. A little birdie tells me that FTC plans to stick with a 12x12 field (even though I would prefer an expansion to 12x16 or so, and moving the drivers to the ends like FRC).

When I said reliability, I meant reliablility of the platform for the organization. Perhaps I could have worded it better, but my point is valid.
Also, technically either FTC is in its first year or third/fourth year. In the first/second pilot years the field is different from its 2006 pilot year and its current field.

Are there really more IFI Robotics teams than international FRC and FLL teams?



So, you don't trust anything FIRST says, but you believe everything in the IFI press release. You give full weight to all potentially positive aspects of IFI, but discount everything FIRST has been good at all these years. I think your decision must be right for you, but I doubt you've changed any minds.

Obviously there are not more IFI robotics teams than FLL teams. I do believe IFI international teams have already exceeded FIRST in FRC and FTC in just its first year. FLL has had many years to grow (not sure the exact number).

Also, why would you say I don't trust anything FIRST says ? I may have missed this somewhere, but did FIRST say this kit was permanant or going to be for at least X years? My other points are based on what was said by FIRST (approximate $1000 kit cost). I really like the FIRST organization and what it stands for. I just really don't like how they handled the situation so far.

I think my points are probably agreed upon by many teams doing FTC now. I am not a spokesperson for IFI nor do I pretend to be. I believe I also stated I have not chosen which platform to go with. My points supported IFI mainly because FIRST has left us in the dark in many places. My opinions can definitely change once I see the kit and the costs associated with it. That is why I said this is "my initial thoughts".

It's good to be objective, and I merely wanted to point out my thoughts.