Hmmm...
Well now, regardless of the discussion at hand, I see a lot of comments and phrases aimed solely at the aggravation of the other party involved. I'd like to point out that comments like these:
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Rather than worrying about bringing other teams down to your level,
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Give us a concrete example.
drag them down to your level
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Do nothing but raise the general feeling of "rabbalry" in the room, either by giving the intended reader a sense or worthlessness, or making him/her feel segregated from the community. This causes more drippingly sarcastic and or blatently rude remarks, which inevitably lead to a shut down thread, and a lot of hard feelings. Even if they weren't entirely
consciously meant as such, the intent is definitely there, and fairly apparent.
Comments such as the following, on the other hand actively promote a healthy, learning discussion... and encourage the intended reader to go look at the subject form a different angle. There is nothing rude or sarcastic about either of these.
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It can be done in a variety of ways. But we don't look down on teams that do it differently than we do. You must find what works for your team.
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This is the exact flaw in your argument. Neither you nor I nor anyone else have any say in what is "right" for a team.
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Now, on with the subject at hand.
I know exactly how frustrating it can be when you pour every waking hour, every last drop of design prowess, and a little more effort that you ever thought possible into YOUR robot... only to have it fail in the face of the most robust, complex, and cosmetically attractive thing you've ever seen on an omni-drive... That is just part of realizing just how much you have to learn. Without that what would you have to aspire to?
I believe that being on a team with limited engineering mentors, and a predominantly student run "government" helped me learn more about the entire real life processes of designing, fabrication, brainstorming, idea development, and social interaction then I would have if I'd been on a predominantly mentor run team. Notice I didn't mention "The exact and precise representation of a job in the field of Engineering". Which, while it can be introduced by a mentor run FIRST team, can only truly be taught by several long years of college and a few thousand dollars in borrowed money.
Having said that, I also wish we as a graduating class of team 306 had either :
A) Had one more year to finish honing our abilities in design and production, and produce a truly beautiful machine,
OR
B) Had more mentor help from the beginning so we would've delved deeper into the CAD and engineering processes.
In essence, We (the graduating class of any given year) Were just getting to the good stuff when we were shoved into the real world. As was said before in this thread (and the seemingly infinite threads before), The answer doesn't lie with an all student run team, or an Engineer-fest team... But somewhere in the middle. Moderation is key.
-Cody