Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel_LaFleur
I know what I am going to say will be unpopular here, but here goes:
Fredi,
While I believe your heart is in the right place, I can not agree with what is being proposed here. My reasons are as follows:
1> You state that there are 65000 undocumented students that are graduating every year. To me that means that there are 65000 legal immigrants that are being denied access to our school systems (and immigrant status) becuase illegal (yes, illegal) immigrants are taking up that space and those funds.
2> You say they are not guilty of commiting any crime, yet by their existance within the borders without papers they are, indeed, knowingly and willingly breaking the law. The law does not take into account how long they've been here, what type of person they are, or anything else other than their right to be here (which they do not have).
3> You are correct that we are spending $70000 per student on education (K-12). Don't you believe that we should be educating those who follow our laws rather than knowingly and willfully break them?
4> You state that 'deporting them all' is unrealistic, and I agree with you on that point. But the answer is not to reward them for breaking the laws (for doing so only encourages more). The answer is with supply and demand. To stem the supply we need to give them nothing (No schooling, No welfare, No unemployment, No protections) and to stem the demand we need to increase the punishments for assisting them (fines and jail for giving them work, transporting them, and harboring them).
By gaining control of the illegal (yes, I used that word again) immigrant issue we will be able to increase legal immigration and secure our borders better.
DREAM is well intentioned, but will only exacerbate an already bad situation. Legal immigration is the way to go, not giving those who break the law even more freedoms.
The above is my personal opinion. I apologise if it offends others, but I felt that the other side of the argument needed to be aired.
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No offense taken, but there are some pieces to puzzle that you might not be clear on.
I will answer you on a point by point basis
# 1 There are 65 thousand students graduating annually and growing not decreasing. The reason why they are not challenged before this I can only guess. I can say that schools get federal and state dollars for each student they have regardless of status. As long as money comes into the system no one complains. Many of the kids that you label as illegal don't even know they are undocumented, the term I prefer, until they are ready to graduate and try to fill out scholarships. To them this is the only country they have ever known. Imagine you finding out that you are illegal after you spent your whole recollected life here in the U.S.. Would you turn yourself in and then go to Mexico to live in a "Foreign" country? I highly doubt it. The education system has already "rewarded" them up through high school and then you suggest we throw them out. I fail to see this as a viable option when you can finish the job and let them become contributing members of society after having reaped the rewards. We need troops for all the wars we choose to engage in and our troops want to come home, many of the undocumented students would willingly go and do a tour of duty for the country they love.
# 2 Yes it may be the law, but I find it difficult to understand how a 1 year old is knowingly and willingly breaking the law. They are victims in this case. They are paying for a crime they did not commit. Do you want to pay for crimes that your parents commit? Yet despite the persecution and living in the shadows, many of the prosper and aspire to be productive Americans in the country they have grown up in and love as much as anybody. Team 842 is a prime example of that. We can choose to send all these productive people out of the country or we can maybe find out how we might capitalize of the problem and use the situation to our advantage. We need all the human capitol we can get in the race to lead in STEM in the world. Thomas Friedman makes this point in his latest book Flat Hot and Crowded. Barack Obama also sees this as an opportunity to make right morally what has been done to the children. Are we a country that is that vindictive that we will destroy a child and his or her life as to be comfortable that we followed the law or are we a compassionate country who will fix the problem and make sure it does not happen again in the future.
# 3 The schools have been using the "law" to get the funding they need to run the schools, including getting them to pass state standardized tests so they can help the schools reach their AYP, annual yearly progress, as mandated by leave no child behind. It would make sense to make sure we spend the money on documented students but its not happening and the states and the schools are taking total advantage of it as well. A child is a child and is not culpable for his or her legal standing, it seems immoral to me not to educate them.
# 4 The punishment as you say that should be dispensed for anyone helping them is not happening. There are some trivial examples, but by far and away its a joke. There are over 12 million undocumented in the US, you tell me if its working. This means of all countries, not just Mexico, although not many people get pulled over for looking Chinese.
To me it seems that the DREAM act is a solution to a problem where it is a win, win. The student will realize the full potential as a citizen and the U.S. will gain a highly motivated and purpose driven individual who has worked at becoming a citizen unlike the rest of us who were just lucky enough to be born here. What downside do you see with this for America if the borders were sealed so that little or no one could cross. I am against illegal immigration but I believe that punishing children is cruel and immoral. Until the government can seal the borders I will continue to stand up for children as long as it takes for the right thing to be done.