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Unread 23-05-2009, 17:44
Unsung FIRST Hero
Al Skierkiewicz Al Skierkiewicz is offline
Broadcast Eng/Chief Robot Inspector
AKA: Big Al WFFA 2005
FRC #0111 (WildStang)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Rookie Year: 1996
Location: Wheeling, IL
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Re: Failed attempt to explain JAG linearity

Sorry to get back to this so late. Layoffs, salary reductions and elimination of 403b contributions take precedent.

Now I am the one that is confused. We started out looking at linearity and then progressed to start configuration and simulations. Now I am not sure where we are at. So let me answer a few things. Wildstang did not choose to use Labview, we did not load it or attempt to learn it. Our software team uses C everyday and that is the only thing they wish to use. If we are going to discuss operational differences at speed between the two controllers, then the discussion and simulation is useless without a valid calculation of CEMF (Counter EMF) and the introduction of switching for the commutator at that speed.
To remind our readers, CEMF is a variable based on the rotational speed of the motor, the number of magnetic poles, the number of windings on the armature and the subsequent switching by the brush assembly, and the load on the motor. Therefore, without establishing that the motor is turning at the same speed for each controller with the same data input, no comparison/calculation can be made as the CEMF and speed would be different. Additionally, the CEMF is not a pure DC voltage, but varies as the windings pass through the magnetic field. From memory, this could be as high as 2 volts peak to peak. The result is a pulsed DC that looks more like a full wave rectifier output. At least some of the time, the brush assembly is contacting two windings and the rest of the time it is contacting only one. The simulation must also account for that phenomena for inductance, resistance, CEMF and supply current.
As to differences between the "OFF" times on the two controllers and coast/brake. My understanding is the PWM output of both controllers varies between battery voltage and zero volts irrespective of the brake jumper as long as the controller has a valid speed signal present. This is accomplished by turning off one set of FETs, opening the circuit to the motor.
It is not possible for me to get into the shop in the near future, but I would like to parallel a PWM drive signal to a Jaguar and a Victor, one feeding each side of our test bed drive base. That can at least tell us if the resultant speeds are identical for various throttle positions under minimum load with a transmission attached. It will also allow me to measure the commutator frequency for different motor speeds, and to look at the CEMF of each motor with the two controllers.
As to the spreadsheet I first published, the data was calculated with the understanding we were still talking about start configuration. During start, CEMF would be non-existent as the motor is not yet turning. The data calculated would appear to be accurate for the two controllers, other than the slight error introduced by the multiplication of the Jaguar values by ten to coorelate with the same time period for the Victor's first "ON" pulse and using the resistance and inductance of two windings in parallel as the worst case model. The eventual Victor current that approximately equals the specified stall current validated that calculation namely 133 amps.
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Good Luck All. Learn something new, everyday!
Al
WB9UVJ
www.wildstang.org
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Storming the Tower since 1996.