Wasn't sure wether to make this a new topic or add it to this thread which discussed the issue a bit.
Potential Problem:
This was our teams first time being a division finalist. After losing in the division finals our team was asked to stick around as a potential backup for Einstein. I was a bit shocked when I realized how the rules for backup team selection on Einstein were so different from the division rules.
9.6.2 Championship Backup Teams
If an ALLIANCE has not previously brought in a BACKUP TEAM, and a ROBOT becomes disabled during the Championship Playoffs and can not continue, the ALLIANCE may request a BACKUP TEAM. The ALLIANCE CAPTAIN will be presented the option of having one of the three lead Division Finalist TEAMS, chosen randomly, from their division join the ALLIANCE as a BACKUP TEAM.
Does anyone else find this backup system a bit weird? In the division if a robot breaks you get a robot that everyone passed on. One that you could have picked but chose not to. On Einstein if a robot breaks you have a 2 out of 3 chance of having one of the best robots from your division, and assuming that you are the #1 alliance even the #23 robot could be better than the #24 robot selected with their 3rd pick.
Robot robustness is something that every championship alliance should strive for. It is a lot of matches in a very short amount of time. Having a robot fail is normally a bad thing. Why is their a potential benefit for having your worst robot on your alliance fail? Surely no one would intentionally damage a robot for a backup upgrade, but that potential exploit exists in this system.
I did find some discussion of this issue on a closed thread from 2007.
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...stein+b ackup
Here is a specific post that highlights the issue.
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...9&postcount=32
and “If an alliance decided it was in their best interest, they could make a robot very inoperable very quickly.”
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...6&postcount=51
Possible Solution:
This is one of several reasons why I would like to champion the idea suggested by Dustin “TheFro” Benedict.
“Also, I'd like to see FIRST institute 4 team alliances for the Championship. I don't think adding an extra round of selections would be so detrimental to the schedule that it'd be impossible, and I believe it would bring an entirely new dimension to Eliminations if an Alliance can switch a team out at random. This also allows alliance members to fix their robots and miss a match, without being penalized with not being able to play for the rest of the tournament.”
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...9&postcount=58
Apparently a system like this has existed with FIRST in the past. Our team is too young to have any personal experience with it though.
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...5&postcount=60
I’ve got some ideas on how to validate the 4th member of the alliance earning their share of the Championship.
“I would add that the division winners cannot take their 4th robot to Einstein unless they played them in at least one game during the division elimination rounds... No other subs will be offered for failed robots.
Any team taking a 4th robot to Einstein must play them in at least 1 game to win the world championship. This would mean that in the Einstein finals the winner of the first match would have to sub in their 4th robot if they have not played them previously on Einstein. If that happens to make them lose then their opponents would be forced into a similar situation if they have not played their 4th robot earlier. This would include a robot that broke in division play.”
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...4&postcount=87
So, anybody else up for a modification to how we do the championship? It already has different rules than a regular regional. I’m hoping this idea would make it even better.