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  #61   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 19-10-2003, 20:49
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Quote:
Originally posted by JVN
Okay.
Why?

They are 6 teams... SIX, this is a drop in the bucket, and doesn't significantly affect "the numbers" either way.

Without these teams, there would be NO FIRST, there would be NO Nationals, there would be NO 384, and you would just be another bored HSer who has a vague idea about what enginerding is, and thinks he might, maybe, possibly want to get into it.

19, 45, 126, 190, 191, 250

They are NOT all the best teams in FIRST. Many of them would NOT qualify every year based on performance.

But... they were here FIRST. They laid the groundwork so that we can be here today.

This is FIRST's way of saying thank you, their way of saying "we remember".

So... jeez Joe, what about this possibly "doesn't sit well" with you?


This quote struck me... everyone should read this, and THINK before they comment on this particular issue.

"I have to add, not only is it an accomplishment to have sustained a team for 13 years

the fact that these teams signed up in '92 for something that was just an idea also deserves special recognition.

Without those original teams, there would be no FIRST. I think I can speak for every team in the Rochester, NY area, that we all owe our existance to the spirit and drive of the Xerox/Wilson Xcats - they really spread the idea of FIRST in this area - and next year we will have a regional here.

The original teams were pioneers in every sense of the word!" - Ken Wittlief

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...653#post191653

This whole thing is just a nice gesture from FIRST.
It does not affect things one way or the other.
Why would you possibly be against it?


John
Don't hurt me! *shrives up in corner*

What I mean is this: If they allow all '92 teams, what about the '93 teams, or the '94. They were as pionering, if not more, than the '92, so why leave them out? I just think that just because they've stuck around DOSN'T mean that they should just automatically make it to Nats. Where does the line end? Sure, we should congradulate them on it, but not with giving them something that others don't have.
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Unread 19-10-2003, 20:55
KenWittlief KenWittlief is offline
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so, if there were some international science and technology convention, and you were the doorman

and Neil and Buzz came walking up

would you stop them?

"But we were the first men to walk on the moon!"

"well yeah, thats cool

but what have you done lately?"

:c)
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:01
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Quote:
Originally posted by KenWittlief
so, if there were some international science and technology convention, and you were the doorman

and Neil and Buzz came walking up

would you stop them?

"But we were the first men to walk on the moon!"

"well yeah, thats cool

but what have you done lately?"

:c)
DON'T PUT WORDS IN MY MOUTH!!!

I mean, I never said that, did I? NOOOOOOOO. I said where do you draw the line? Will you let the rest of the Apallo guys on, what about Gemini? Or how about the Sky Lab guys?
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:07
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with all the arguments that everyone is saying about the original 6 teams that are still here out of those 28, and how they get a free ride is finally getting to me. i am going to continue this post on my own thoughts and conditions, it has no input from my team nor any other the other 5 left. What i want to say is going to be a very harsh reality to many of you and i will prob get grief back at "home base" of 250 for saying this but i am going to post it to show some truths behind the craze of being on a team that was formed in 1992 and has competed each year since then.

This organization brought me in when i was an 8th grader, i did not join a team until my sophomore year in high school because i wasn't sure if i wanted to be on a team or just watch it on TV still. though i was lucky enough to be brought into a family when i joined named; Team 250: Capital Region Robotics, The Dynamos. these people have been close to me and have shown me what the truth behind FIRST really is, and at points i wish i didn't join this team, as every team does have their bad times. But you may think oh were an original team, it must be easy to stay around now! But that truthfully is the exact opposite of what it is like to be on this team. our funding has not been the steadiest and our team at points have not been the closest. i am not going to go into personal events as this is not the time nor place for them, but our team is like each and every other team out there. we may get a "free ride" to the nationals event but believe me when i say this and many other teams can contest to this, the original 6 teams that still are around today, and personally i can speak here for 250, WE WORK OUR A$$ES OFF STILL AND SHED OUR BLOOD, SWEAT AND TEARS FOR THIS ORGANIZATION WE CALL HOME. We don't do it though for the ride to Nat's or for the recognition, we do it for the main purpose of FIRST and that is to spread this organization to our next coming generation and to other schools then just ourself. We may have been here longer then almost all other teams but we still are dynamic and we are never the same one year to another.

At this time i would like to once again ask you all to take a step back from your monitor and look at what everyone has done including yourself to make this place we call home, a better place. Also if you can for a minuet, just think what this place might be (or NOT be) with out the 6 teams that are still around from 1992.

~Mike
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:19
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Sigh

I know that they were hard years. I know. I REALLY DO. I know about everything you told me. But my problem is why just limit it to the '92 year teams? And what about the numerous other teams that have helped tons over the years? Do they get 'free rides'? Understand where I come from?

Now I'm just going to back off. I don't want to get killed again.
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:25
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i understand where you are coming from, but i don't think you are completely understanding the reason why these 6 teams are going. they took the initial investment and time to see if first would work. they spent the money they could get for the first year to compete in a high school gymnasium in new Hampshire with things that if we saw now we might wonder what they were. these teams not only have defined what the meaning of first truly is but have defined what it means to give to others before they receive anything back. if you have a problem with these 6 teams getting as some people call it a "free ride" to you have a problem with all past national chairmans award winners getting that "free ride" also, because truthfully not all past national chairman award winners are still around today, but we still are.
~Mike
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:30
KenWittlief KenWittlief is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by JosephM
...I said where do you draw the line? Will you let the rest of the Apallo guys on, what about Gemini? Or how about the Sky Lab guys?
I guess if Collins shows up, you could make him sit outside in the car for two days (again :c)

just tell him its the command module
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:37
KenWittlief KenWittlief is offline
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BTW - all 6 teams are not getting a free ride

191 - the Xcats have also won the Chairmans award

twice!

so, they really SHOULD be allowed to bring two friends with them - since they have earnd a seat at the table three times over

(two 'friend' teams :c)

so unless other founding teams have also won the chairmans award, that means only 5 teams are squeaking in

by virture of their unique history (moldly oldies :c)

Last edited by KenWittlief : 19-10-2003 at 21:39.
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:38
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A brief Aside...

Mike and Joe-

You ARE representatives of 250 and 384 respectively. When you are on here, you are representing your teams. Just as I am representing 229, Andy Baker is representing 45, and Tytus Gerrish is representing 179.

The disclaimers in your signature... do not take away from this.

I do not want these "Whatever comes out of my mouth is the responsibility of no one" disclaimers to become a trend.

This is not the case. People make judgements all the time based on much less, regardless of how wrong they are. The things you say, can and WILL influence the opinions of people concerning your team.

John
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Last edited by JVN : 19-10-2003 at 21:41.
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:41
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yeah, team 250, we got the engineering inspiration award last year at U.T.C. so can we bring a friend too, come on and look at reality, we wouldn't be arguing here now if it wasn't for these 6 teams. so personally i think that these 6 teams have more then earned and still are earning these spots.

~Mike

P.S.~John that has been there since last year and its in part of another post, i would remove that but i don't want the head aches again. and yes i know what i post here reflects 250.
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:44
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:47
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Quote:
Originally posted by dez250
i think that these 6 teams have more then earned and still are earning these spots.

~Mike
Careful now...
You will start sounding elitist.

The 13 year teams are not *special*. There are plenty of other teams who do much more than what these 6 are doing. To say that you have "worked hard and earned your spot" is unfair. Plenty of other teams have done more to earn their spot as well...

You get to go as a "Favor" if you will... this is FIRST's way of saying thank you. Do not even START to assume that you are "better".

John
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:55
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These teams are not Neil Armstrong or Buzz Aldrin. They're their kids, nephews, nieces, and third cousins.

In some cases, I know that there are teachers or sponsors who have been involved with the team since its inception -- but then that opens up a whole other can of worms, doesn't it? Who is a team? The students or their mentors?
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Unread 19-10-2003, 21:58
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now that I think of it, there is a way for other teams to get 'most favored' status

1. invent a time machine
2. go back to 1992
3. start a team at your school for the original FIRST comp
4. come back to 2003, now there will be 7 teams on the list

piece of cake :c)
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Unread 19-10-2003, 22:05
KenWittlief KenWittlief is offline
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gosh, I never thought about that!

i HOPE there are not still students on the original6.org teams who still havent graduated from HS, and are still on the team!

come on guys, this is getting silly. Ever since Ive been involved with FIRST, the original teams have always had a special recognition amoungst the students and adult mentors

along with the chairmans award winners

and the championship winners

FIRST is all about getting students to see technology leaders as heros - and these teams are heros for stepping up to the plate in '92

If it really begrudges your team that much that these teams are given this recognition, Im sure we can start a petition, and hold a demostration outside Deans house

until they increase the size of the championship from 300 teams

to 305!

Whos with me? lets march on WestWind! :c)
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