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Unread 23-06-2002, 22:16
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Throwing matches

Posted by Chris, Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monster, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.

Posted on 3/29/99 10:08 AM MST



Even if rejecting an alliance partnership offer was disallowed, throwing matches could still be a problem. The situation could have occurred at the Great Lakes regional. Going into this regional, it was generally thought that the two best teams would be Beatty and the Bomb Squad (at least that's the feeling I got from reading these forums). Just before the last matches, Bomb Squad was #1 seed and Beatty was #8. Beatty could have easily thrown their match and been picked by the Bomb Squad. That alliance might have been unbeatable. In this situation, not allowing rejections would not help.

Disallowing rejections might help somewhat, but it won't completely solve the problem.


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But would they?

Posted by Nate Smith, Student on team #74, Holland FIRST Robotics, from Holland High School and Haworth, Inc..

Posted on 3/29/99 12:50 PM MST


In Reply to: Throwing matches posted by Chris on 3/29/99 10:08 AM MST:



Yes, they could have, but would they have? For the most part, I think that even though all of these terrible things COULD have been done, we all understand "gracious professionalism" enough so that they won't. After all, how different is this situation from the past, where teams could sandbag through the seeding rounds, get ranked low, and then go through and easily all of their rounds to make it far in the competition? I don't know of anyone personally who did that last year, or any other time in the past...

: Beatty could have easily thrown their match and been picked by the Bomb Squad. That alliance might have been unbeatable. In this situation, not allowing rejections would not help.

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Re: But would they?

Posted by El Bizro of team #xxx from not in school.

Posted on 3/29/99 3:47 PM MST


In Reply to: But would they? posted by Nate Smith on 3/29/99 12:50 PM MST:




I think all of you are all getting woried nad upset about teams throwing matched and the like and I have just a few tings to say about it all :

1) With only 4 matched, throwing even one could put you wayyy back in seeding.
some of you think that is what teams will want, so that they get picked by their "top 16"
friends. Well, with so many teams at florida, whos to say who will be top 16 in flordia.
it may be 16 teams that didnt go to any regional ! whi knows. You throw a match.
Then find out your partner got beat. yer both screwed. IT's SAFER TO GET to
the top 16 on YOUR OWN.

2) There are all these big names flying around (BomB squad,delphi,Beatty,Wildstang,etc...)
I'm not on a team this year, so I feel I can rightly say, that I know all of these teams.
I've met with them many times on and off the field. They are all good people.
and None of them would throw a match.Regardless of anything else. Now I dont know EVERY team,
So I wont comment on ALL of them, but of the teams that "should" make the top 16.
None of them, to the best of my knowledge are"Back door deal" teams.
They are all teams with integrety and gracious professionalism. So if you all think these
"power house" teams will be the top 16, you've got nothign to worry about, because they're all good teams.
You don't gain the reputation of being a "power house" team by making back door deals. the teams that are
"feard" and feared becuase they are known to build good robots, not make good deals.
So,to sum it up... If you are worried that the top 16 teams will be the big famous powerhouse teams
ans that they are going to be making back door deals. Dont be.





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Unread 23-06-2002, 22:17
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Re: But would they?

Posted by bill stahlman, Student on team #16, baxter bomb squad, from mountain home high school and baxter healthcare.

Posted on 3/29/99 10:50 PM MST


In Reply to: Re: But would they? posted by El Bizro on 3/29/99 3:47 PM MST:



:
I am a member of the bomb squad so I know what I'm talking about.
Yes, Beatty could easily have thrown their match but, we wouldn't have
let them even if they had wanted to. That is just not in the spirit of
FIRST. I think Beatty did a good job of coming up from behind. And I
didn't mind losing to them.
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Unread 23-06-2002, 22:17
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Re: I think everyone missed the point

Posted by Chris, Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monster, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.

Posted on 3/30/99 7:57 AM MST


In Reply to: Throwing matches posted by Chris on 3/29/99 10:08 AM MST:



: Even if rejecting an alliance partnership offer was disallowed, throwing matches could still be a problem. The situation could have occurred at the Great Lakes regional. Going into this regional, it was generally thought that the two best teams would be Beatty and the Bomb Squad (at least that's the feeling I got from reading these forums). Just before the last matches, Bomb Squad was #1 seed and Beatty was #8. Beatty could have easily thrown their match and been picked by the Bomb Squad. That alliance might have been unbeatable. In this situation, not allowing rejections would not help.

: Disallowing rejections might help somewhat, but it won't completely solve the problem.

Whether or not a team WOULD throw a match is in another thread about 20 posts down. In that thread, they are debating whether or not teams would throw matches and that they should eliminate rejecting partnership offers to solve this problem.

The point of my original post was that forcing a team to accept the first bid WOULD NOT solve the problem. I simply brought up an example of a situation that occurred in which forcing a team to accept the first bid would not work had the teams decided to make a deal.

Whether the teams in question WOULD make a deal is irrelevant to the point. The point is that the proposed fix does not actually fix the problem.



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