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Unread 14-04-2002, 08:01
Chief'sDad Chief'sDad is offline
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Good job on the picture. Thanks
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Unread 14-04-2002, 14:36
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you guys need to stop badgering 862. They thought of a neat strategy that was in the rules and i peronally think its fine. it is not like they are flipping your robot over. Anyway, i am sure thatmatces with them are probably more exciting, seeing as how their oppoents have to play the game while avoiding 862. I for one cogratulate them
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Unread 14-04-2002, 15:45
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thank you perseus (sp?)
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Unread 15-04-2002, 11:41
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the forks in the picture were broken off but by the picture you can get a basic idea of what they look like. Normally the forks are attached firmly to our robot, in that picture they wern't.
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Unread 16-04-2002, 12:09
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If it's legal, it's legal...

A few comments on the Forklift debate:

1) If it is legal, it is LEGAL. Lifting robots was explicitly declared legal. Therefore, it does NOT violate "Gracious Professionalism". Let's get past this. Just because a team decides NOT to do it, it doesn't make it "unfair" if another decides to do so.

BTW, Our team thought about forklifts and wedges, and as a group DECIDED to go another way. Also, as our robot had a center wheel differential drive with casters at the four corners, we were conscious that we were VERY vulnerable to lifters, who could easily have turned us into a wheelbarrow on either end. <whew>

Some of us are kicking ourselves now as had we had kept a traction breaker of some kind, it would have been great against any robot who "commits" to a goal grab with a locking gripper & parks with it. Not having a Goal Release becomes a serious liability for them!

2) Do NOT confuse "equipment" with "driver intent". There is a BIG difference between the ability to lift or move, and intent to damage . The driver decides how to use the robot. Just because a robot has a wedge or a forklift, doesn't mean it is going to "spear other robots" or break things with it. A driver could just as easily use a ball gadget or goal gripper as a weapon if they so chose.

In fact, we would have preferred being forklifted than what did happen to us!

Our machine's drivetrain was shattered FOUR times by ramming. Our gears were attached to our driveshafts by steel pins. In four separate rounds, one or another drive pin was literally sheared right off. It took us dying four times before we could strengthen all of the pinned joints enough. In fact, one of the times we were dead on the field from a shattered drive pin, a robot hijacked us via pushing, and took us into their home zone to add to their score. There was NOTHING we could do about it.

Now had they simply forklifted us instead of ramming us, we would have sustained a lot less damage, and may even have been able to wiggle free or drive back out!

3) Two Goal Handling Tanks are dominating now. I'm really tired of that. After two Regionals, I saw the game time after time totally swamped by a "rush out, grab two, and park in your zone in the first 30 seconds" strategy. Very little field ball work, etc. Boooorrrrring... They think they "know" that no one can touch them!

But... If anyone that tried that and sat with their "hands full of goals" had to worry about attracting opposing traction breakers who'll steal them AND their goals, that opens up a whole new strategy area!

So, to any team that has a traction breaker of some kind (or can whip one up in a day in the pits and add it on ), I say GO FOR IT! Too many teams out there who think the key to this game is to grab and hold two goals and forget about the field balls. IMHO "scrum moving" is a great counter move!

It opens things up for much more interesting strategy possibilities. It'll be like "rock, paper, scissors". Goal hoarders that use goal weight to lock themselves down won't dominate any more, and "ball count balancing" becomes more important again. If you keep the goal between you and another bot, they'll lock onto it and play tug of war. If you keep yourself in the middle, they lift you and steal you AND the goal!

The chance of a situation reversal with the clock running out is always the biggest major adrenaline point in any good game. WHO will grab WHAT first? Who will then try to steal THEM? There'd be waiting games, "who'll flinch first", and less stalemates. "Dancing with goals" becomes much more complex because now you'd have to avoid other goal grippers AND forklifts.

We're done now, but if I was working with a team that wasn't (AND had a strong enough drivetrain to move a scrum), I'd strongly consider using the competition Workday Thursday to whip up a simple drop wedge on a roller, or a simple "plate & roller tow dolly" of some kind which could be jammed under a darn goal parking tank with a spare cylinder to break their traction. Anything that would let us move any machine that tried to imitate a "brick" with a goal or two in their possession...

- Keith
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