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#1
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Oh man so much to reply to - well you guys posted YOUR bias opinions. Time for me to post mine, eh? I wish some posts could be made without jumping to a "who's better than who" Well, let me address some stuff without sounding like im flaming..just answering some comments thats all. Can't we just be civil and have a discussion without saying a FIRST bot is more sophisiticated? I can tell you right now that is WRONG. Just look at robots like Mechadon, Warhead, Snake, etc. Those are beautifully crafted machines...much more sophisticated than any FIRST robot in my opinion. You can't tell me mechadon isn't cool - it's a spider and each body section moves individually, it rolls, and it can walk like a spider. Mechadon and the Snake were made by a man that makes robots for movies (He made some for MIB, I can call those off the top of my head.) Warhead well, look him up, that robot is amazing. It's first appearance was last may...I can't explain how cool it is.
"i'm sure if we went up against a battle bot, we'd be able to push them around with no problem. but, if we were to get pushed into say a killsaw, it's all over. treads, gone. wheels, pretty much gone. " Well, lets take this by weight class first. A First robot would qualify as a Heavyweight but to be fair I'll place it as a middleweight, 120 lbs being the max weight there. Very commonly used motors in battlebots are 24 v dewalt motors, NPC Motors(npcrobotics.com), magmotors (yes, for drive, www.robotbooks.com), and they're running at 24 volts. Due to the lack of limitation on the motors you can use and having a max operating voltage of 24-36, I can tell you that most battlebots WILL push around your first bot, without much effort too. Next comment =) "all in all i think the quality of the first bots are much better than battle bots... of course we have how many actual engineers and big corporations backing us... imagine if some big corporation had a robot built and entered it into battle bots... because of funding it would probably be quite good." "yeah if a big corperation sponsored a battle but but they probably wont because battlebots isnt nearly as good as FIRST." Wrong! Sony, Microsoft, Lincoln Welders, Comedy Central, Bosch(the providers of your drill motors), and many other companies I just wont bother to list. The list is huge there are MANY corporate sponsors vying to sponsor a battlebot. My team is currently talking to a big biomedical company (And yes - they do sponsor a FIRST team.). Sorry, I just had to get rid of this misconception. "yes, FIRST robots tend to be more sophisticated in some ways, but battle bots always seem to look nicer (like cleaner and slightly more proffesional). now, we all have to remember, each robot is designed for a different purpose, so each will do one thing great, and pretty much suck at others. " I love your mentality. You made a post without bashing either side. Thank you - atleast some people here post without any bias. You have to understand they are two DIFFERENT competitions with similar goals. I love the idea - there are a lot of great minds in both sports. In fact some of those benefit from competing in both. I think it'd be interesting. Now that there is BBIQ there are high schools competing in a battlebots competition as well as FIRST. Many of those people in the pit next to you may have even been there. It's good to be open minded...I just wish that the bias and superiority complex was non-existant. Wow, long post, thanks for reading if you did =) -Dallin |
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#2
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lol, you both bashed and praised me...
![]() anyways, i was under the impression that battle bots used similar motors and voltages, mostly because i keep hearing that FIRST things are being used with battle bots, and as far as i know, FIRST things only work with the %%%% batteries they give us (and that's why i'm not an electrical engineer ). although, i still think that our robot would have a fighting chance at pushing some battle bots on a level surface, and an even better chance on carpet. but, as i said before, they're designed for different purposes, so even if my robot could push a battle bot, that battle bot that i just pushed could come right back at me with a giant machette or something, and kinda simply hack my robot to pieces.i think that if battle bots and FIRST could work together, some great things could happen. too bad so many people are completely biased though. sure, i like FIRST better, now, but that's because i've only seen battle bots on tv, and in my opinon, it sucked because comedy central took the good stuff out. i'm sure in a battle bots competition, the spirit is the same, except during a match . |
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#3
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It probably could but it all depends on the battlebot really. The battlebox arena is a steel floor. There are some treaded bots in Battlebots, probably using better drive motors(Battlebots is not restricted to a kit of parts, or anything for that matter...just the rules that state what weapon is allowed and a max voltage). El Diablo, El Diablo Grande, I can't remember the others but there have been a few..
When it all comes down to it, you guys have had your bots tested before. There are many first time, out of the garage, bolt on parts only, no machining battlebots out there because a father & son decided to build one together. I think what is happening is great, what FIRST doesn't offer(You have to be in a HS and you have to be able to mentor) is available in other mediums. And yes, maybe your FIRST bot could push those rookies around... but I welcome any FIRST bot to try and push around my bot while it's spinning at 1500+ (estimated, never clocked, the gear ratio/rpm per voltage indicates something around the 1500-2500 range) =) lol I kid, I kid! Mmm..the smell of melted 1/16" lexan! (Disclaimer: The last part of that last paragraph was a joke and was not ment to be read as anything serious =) ) I hope what I explained about the rules/kit answered your question. There really is no limitation in Battlebots, only safety limitations which indicate how to turn it on/off, max voltage, max PSI, and certain safety precautions to be taken with anything. There are illegal weapons too, untethered projectiles, liquids, EMP, fire.. -Dallin PS: I read a post made by Mr.B and I completely agree with him...I'll dig up the link/post number. http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/sh...t=battlebo ts Also, I was thinking about this last night - Gracious profesionalism should not only be extended to fellow FIRST builders. It should be followed everywhere in life. I think that is the whole reason behind Dean and Woody teaching it to you. You excercise it in the FIRST competition but not when dealing with Battlebots or talking about the subject. Think about it as another corporation - you should extend gracious profesionalism to them. Im a bit sketchy about it's definition but it seems simple enough and I dont see why my theory wouldn't work, Dean expects us to use it in the future when we work at an Engineering firm or whatever...just something to think about. I was looking for an actual definition of "Gracious Profesionalism" but can't seem to find it anywhere. |
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#4
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Quote:
And on the subject of FIRST robots vs BB robots in the battle box, why bother? It's like racing a top fuel dragster and a mini-van in the 1/4 mile. Of course the dragster will win. But how well will the dragster haul 4 screaming and whining kids plus luggage from Chicago to Orlando? Different requirements lead to different designs. I'm sure many FIRST teams could build good BB robots and many BB teams could build good FIRST robots. not many of us have seen the positive aspects of BB, all we know about the competition is what we see on TV. Mike |
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#5
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maybe i made a mistake
I like how people are examining the positives of both BB and FIRST but I do believe this topic is deviating from its original lighthearted theme and turning into something else.
p.s. I also don't have as much time on my hands and the posts are getting longer |
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#6
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Re: FIRST vs. BB
Quote:
![]() Just wanted to bring back the light-hearted conversation for Evan. Mike |
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#7
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First off it would be cool. Just in general to have 2 different leagues of robotics battling. FIRST Vs. BB. All in all FIRST will win since we (all FIRST robotics teams) even though you guys admit or don't; we ( all FIRST robotics teams)build "ROBUST" robots and this year pretty much proved and i hope that next year there will be a little bit more BB impression added to FIRST.
![]() Second Off who wants to tell Dean that we should have a FIRST Robotics team build a 300lb. robot and send it to BB where it can show spectators the difference between FIRST built robots and BB built robots. ![]() |
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#8
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and yes of course have at least one student representative from each FIRST team make up a combination of 5 teams consisting of about 4 - 6 people.
mechanics, drivers, programmers etc... |
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#9
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go programmers!! whoo!!
![]() actually, the only bad part about a FIRST team that is not there in BB is that the team will segment. i became the lead programmer (out of two programmers, me and dan), and one of the drivers. i would kinda stand by and watch the mechanical side work, and try to help, but i'm still no where as good as the kids who worked just on the mechanical side. in BB, you and your small team do EVERYTHING, especially if it's a father/son team. so, in that aspect, the BB people would have a much better chance in a junkyard, cause you take anyone, and they'd know what to do. once all the parts were back though, the FIRST team would be able to shoot ahead, because person A does motors, person B does electrical, person C does programming, etc., where the BB team, you have a harder time figuring out who excels where, unless you already know. so, there are some places where a BB team would kill a FIRST team, and others where a BB team would be left behind in the dust. i think you can't really tell who would win, because each team has it's own unique (yeah, a bit redundant) problems, so they probably balance each other out. it would still be a very interesting competition to watch, even more so to be in. |
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#10
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Comparisons inhale audibliy
You designed your FIRST robot to compete in FIRST; speculating about using it in any other way is an insult to your design.
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#11
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Yeah, I'd have to agree with you there BSMFirst. Besides, I don't care how robust the robot is - 1/16-1/4" lexan is still butter to many spinners. (Off topic, I know..but really annoys me when people think their first bot to be the most complicated and sophisticated piece of machinery out there.)
A first bot is a FIRST bot, not a battlebot. Let's face it, a battlebot can score points(other than being in the endzone and maybe pushing other bots into it =)) about as much as a FIRST bot can overtake a battlebot in a push and shove match. Now to be on topic: I like the idea. Though - using my FIRST/BBIQ team as an example(and the other BBIQ teams I've seen) have people specializing in different fields such as welding, milling, turning, and doing the programing/wiring. I think it works about the same anywhere, the subdivision can be found in about any job. Everyone on my team can perform just about any task on our robot with the exception of some things for which we have an "expert" do. That's one of the great things of being on a small team, you get machinining time on everything. Theres this new show, forgot the name, that's looking for teenagers to compete in it. It's similar to junkyard wars, I read up on it in the battlebot tech forum. Might wanna do a search for it. -Dallin |
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#12
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yes, do a search on that show. be something cool to see, maybe even get some of my friends to participate in
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#13
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new Robotics show
Here's everything I know about this new show. I guess the first paragraph of the last post describe the show best.
Dan ------------------------------------------- Posted by Brian Nave on the BattleBots forum on July 9th: "OK, here is the deal... Buzz and I have been chosen to co-host a new television series that is being produced in Knoxville, TN. We shoot the pilot on July 17th. As it turns out one of the college teams that was scheduled to do the shoot may not be good TV material. The producer of the show has contacted me to see if there are any other college-aged people available to do a shoot on July 17th. This is NOT a promise, or commitment that ANY of you will be chosen... Do NOT get your hopes up! This is ONLY to find out what people are available, just in case some alternates are needed at the last second. So YOU are committing that you will be available on that date, including reasonable travel time (they are covering the travel and expenses). We need a team of three that will represent a college. So you must be college aged and able to build robots. My understanding is that you need not be IN college or even from the same place, only that you are college AGED. I am seeking clarification of this now. These will be complex autonomous robots, so a remote controlled box of motors is NOT a robot." -------------------------------------- Same botguy, same bot-forum, same bot-date: "The best way to describe the show would be Junkyard Wars with Robots. If any of you have seen the show "Warehouse Warriors" then you know the concept... it is the same Production Company. Two teams are given a task and a certain amount of time to complete it. Parts are available in the warehouse. Design the bot, get the parts, build it, make it work better than the other team, win. I don't know what prizes, if any are being offered. I DO know it is all expenses paid. P.S. That's funny... the font shows up bigger on my screen than the normal font, not smaller... what does the font look like to others, I wonder?" _____________________ Posted by the other host of the show, Brett "Buzz" Dawson on July 10th on the BB forum: "The concept of the show, as Brian said, is to build a bot from scratch in 8 hours to perform a specific task. The task will vary from episode to episode and the teams will not know what the task is until the day of the show. And, it is quite possible that they will not all be autonomous. Some show may incorporate hobby controllers like Futaba and HiTec to show that it can be done with a variety of controllers. The show will be on DIY, the Do It Yourself network and therefore will be not only about the competition but how the viewer can do it at home. So, how did we come by this gig? The show's producer have given a professor at UT (I think) the duty of finding a couple of hosts. Well, I guess he dropped the ball and things didn't get done so the producer hired a head hunter to find someone. Well, this head hunter used to work at the KSC Press Site and asked one of her former coworkers if there were any engineers here at NASA that had robotics experience that may consider it. I was at the top of the list and therefore got the call from Lucha, the headhunter, about 15 minutes later. She explained the concept and asked for an audition tape (that had to be in their hands in two days). She asked if I knew of anyone else that may be interested in doing it as well. Since Brian and I are good friends and talk quite frequently and he is very good in front of a camera I forwarded the info to him and told Lucha, Gary, and Tom about it. My understading from Tom and Brian are that 12 people applied for the spots, 10 from US FIRST and 2 from Battlebots. Well, I guess we know now which direction they went ;-) Aside from all of that we really can't say much. If it all goes well then we'll shoot a whole season. Me personally, I am nervous as hell because I feel like a mental pygmy compared to some of you guys here so please take it easy on me :-p" |
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#14
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Me too
I got a call about doing this show also. It was on a Wednesday, and I had to send a resume, cover letter and video of me doing something to them, in their hands, by Friday. So, I do all of this, and they never called me back. Now, I know the rest of the story... Thanks BSMFIRST.
I'm kinda perturbed about not getting any notification back, especially since I was recommended to them. I understand if they didn't want me, but the least they could do was let me know. It does sound like a fun show. The producers are "Rivr Media" and they are the same outfit who started "Trading Spaces". Andy B. |
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#15
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FIRST would win, we are WAY geekier!
P.s. I am a Sox Fan GO SOX!!! ![]() |
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