Alliance Color in Eliminations

[dna1990]

Is there a set pattern of how color changes occur in eliminations? And/or point me to the official guides or rules concerning this topic.


So for example in QF1, Red wins. They stay red in SF1.
And presumably if Blue wins QF2, they stay blue in SF1.

But what about reverse? Blue upsets Red in QF1, and Red wins QF2. Do each retain their color (to minimize the effort), or does it follow a more set pattern following the bracket, not the possible outcomes? In other words the winner of QF1 is always red and the winner of QF2 is always blue in SF1.

I suppose the last permutation is Red wins both QF1 and QF2, it would the alliance from QF2 to switch over to blue. Yea?

Whatever the pattern, it is the same concept for SF1/SF2 going to F1?


And finally, is this set and universal in the FMS, or is it up to tournament officials?

[Jay O'Donnell]

I believe the way it usually works is that Red is the higher seed, Blue is the lower seed. I don't know this from any source, its just what all of the veterans on my team told me when I was a freshman and it's always been that way for us in eliminations.

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by Jay Money 1058

I believe the way it usually works is that Red is the higher seed, Blue is the lower seed. I don't know this from any source, its just what all of the veterans on my team told me when I was a freshman and it's always been that way for us in eliminations.

This is correct.

And seed is tied with side of the bracket, not the initial starting seed.

So the #1 seed w/ always be red in eliminations, #2 would be red,red,blue. If the #8 beats the red in quarters, it would be red in semis, red in finals. I'm pretty sure the brackets that are printed out at events have this color relation on them.

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

And seed is tied with side of the bracket, not the initial starting seed.

So the #1 seed w/ always be red in eliminations, #2 would be red,red,blue. If the #8 beats the red in quarters, it would be red in semis, red in finals. I'm pretty sure the brackets that are printed out at events have this color relation on them.

The top line of the bracket is always red. The bracket is as follows:

1--|
   |1 or 8|
8--|      |
          |1 or 8 or 4 or 5|
4--|      |                |
   |4 or 5|                |
5--|                       |
                           |   
2--|                       |
   |2 or 7|                |
7--|      |                |
          |2 or 7 or 3 or 6|
3--|      |
   |3 or 6|
6--|

[dna1990]

Originally Posted by Karthik

The top line of the bracket is always red. The bracket is as follows:

1--|
   |1 or 8|
8--|      |
          |1 or 8 or 4 or 5|
4--|      |                |
   |4 or 5|                |
5--|                       |
                           |   
2--|                       |
   |2 or 7|                |
7--|      |                |
          |2 or 7 or 3 or 6|
3--|      |
   |3 or 6|
6--|

Great replies all, thanks.

So yes, alliance #7 for example could find themselves QF3, SF2, F1 - switching after each (upset) win.

Or an 8-4 matchup in SF1 would have them 'both' switch.


This all makes sense, I just had never seen it written anywhere.

[Steven Donow]

Originally Posted by Jay Money 1058

I believe the way it usually works is that Red is the higher seed, Blue is the lower seed. I don't know this from any source, its just what all of the veterans on my team told me when I was a freshman and it's always been that way for us in eliminations.

This is correct. It continues through, meaning that the winners of the 1v8 and 2v7 are red for the semifinals

[Jeremy Germita]

There is a set pattern. It isn't explicitly stated in the rules, but it goes by the tourney bracket.

1 ---
QF1  | --    |
8 ---          |
         SF1  | --    |
4 ---          |      | 
QF2  | --    |        |
5 ---                 |
                FINALS|
3 ---                 |
QF3  | --|            |
6 ---      |          |
         SF2  | --    |
2 ---      |
QF4  | --|
7 ---

please excuse the bad ASCII art for a bracket I drew

The upper side of the bracket in each set is red, the lower side is blue.
For example, if 8 beats 1, 8 becomes red because they are now in the higher side of the bracket.
As you've probably seen, 1 is perpetually red because they are on the higher part of the bracket throughout.

In the quarterfinals, it's easy to tell. The higher seed is red, and the lower seed is blue.

That rule is no longer true in the semis and finals.
In the semifinals, the winners from QF1 or QF3 will always be red and the winners from QF2 and QF4 will always be blue.

In the finals, the winner from SF1 will always be red and the winner from SF2 will always be blue.



Here is one example of an upset and how the bracket plays out

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by jeremypg399

1 ---
QF1  | --    |
8 ---          |
         SF1  | --    |
4 ---          |      | 
QF2  | --    |        |
5 ---                 |
                FINALS|
3 ---                 |
QF3  | --|            |
6 ---      |          |
         SF2  | --    |
2 ---      |
QF4  | --|
7 ---

please excuse the bad ASCII art for a bracket I drew

Close, but you have QF3 and QF4 swapped. QF3 is always the 2 vs. 7 matchup, and QF4 is always the 3 vs. 6 matchup.

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by Karthik

Close, but you have QF3 and QF4 swapped. QF3 is always the 2 vs. 7 matchup, and QF4 is always the 3 vs. 6 matchup.

I love that you knew this presumably from memory.

[Richard Wallace]

Originally Posted by Karthik

Close, but you have QF3 and QF4 swapped. QF3 is always the 2 vs. 7 matchup, and QF4 is always the 3 vs. 6 matchup.

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

I love that you knew this presumably from memory.

I presume so also, and admire the attention to detail. Details are important. Winning strategists and engaging MCs need to know who plays who, and in what order.

Karthik is world class in both roles.

[Karthik]

Originally Posted by AdamHeard

I love that you knew this presumably from memory.

I've always been a stickler for details. Also, it comes from years of saying "Introducing Quarterfinal 3-1, with the #2 seed facing the #7 seed".

Originally Posted by Richard Wallace

I presume so also, and admire the attention to detail. Details are important. Winning strategists and engaging MCs need to know who plays who, and in what order.

Karthik is world class in both roles.

Thanks, Richard. I aim to please.

[lemiant]

Is this in the rule book. Or is it just tradition?

[EricH]

Originally Posted by lemiant

Is this in the rule book. Or is it just tradition?

Tradition, and the FMS.

The FMS knows what the pairings called for by the Manual are--there's a bracket in Section 5.4.3. The only thing dictating the color is that FMS apparently thinks that red is the top line on any given bracket pair. Therefore, it assigns red to the higher-seeded alliance, and then the winners of the odd QFs and the odd SF.



Incidentally, if you are on either Alliance #1 OR Alliance #6, you really only need to bring one set of bumpers to the arena for the finals. Alliance #1 is always red; Alliance #6 is always blue. All other alliances switch at some point if they make it that far.

[GaryVoshol]

It was not in this year's rules. FMS just does it.

In past seasons, the rules had it wrong. They stated that the lower number seed was Red. And didn't say the part about inheriting the seed if you beat a lower seed (e.g. if 6 beats 3, they inherit Red from 3 for the next round).

Head refs and lead queue positions also know how it works.

[Koko Ed]

Originally Posted by GaryVoshol

It was not in this year's rules. FMS just does it.

In past seasons, the rules had it wrong. They stated that the lower number seed was Red. And didn't say the part about inheriting the seed if you beat a lower seed (e.g. if 6 beats 3, they inherit Red from 3 for the next round).

Head refs and lead queue positions also know how it works.

I make it a point to know this by heart.
People are always stunned when the fourth or fifth seed upset the top seed and become red instead of the second seed. It's the bracket setup.