The Monster Roars (308 pics)

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Posted by Chris Hibner at 2/19/2001 10:11 AM EST


Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monster, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.



Our robot is now complete (minus a few modifications and the decorative stuff).

What do we do, you ask? We balance both goals from the ground (quite quickly and reliably) and then get into the endzone to stop the clock. Our philosophy this year was to do one thing and do it very well. We've never NOT been able to balance the goals so we're not sure of our exact reliablity - only after a whole lot more sample points will we get an exact number, but 100% for our first 5 tries is a good start. The one great thing is that 4 robots in the end zone + loading the goal at the HP (12 balls) + two goals balanced in 1:30 is 416 points. So unless a catasrophy occurs, we think this will be our minimum score (we're keeping our fingers crossed).

The picture below shows the goals just after being balance and our robot starting to back away. A complete set of pictures showing the entire balancing process can be seen at the link below. I will try and post an AVI file tomorrow.

Feedback is welcome and I can't wait to see everyone at the competitions.

-Chris

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Posted by Erin at 2/19/2001 4:26 PM EST


Other on team #65, Huskie Brigade, from Pontiac Northern High School and GM Powertrain.


In Reply to: The Monster Roars (308 pics)
Posted by Chris Hibner on 2/19/2001 10:11 AM EST:



I really like your design.


but I am going to miss the gears/wheels.

Where will we be seeing you- Great Lakes, West Mich, or both?

Good luck.

-erin
"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."

- Socrates

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Posted by Chris Hibner at 2/19/2001 4:38 PM EST


Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monster, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.


In Reply to: The monStars do it cool again
Posted by Erin on 2/19/2001 4:26 PM EST:



: I really like your design.

:
: but I am going to miss the gears/wheels.

: Where will we be seeing you- Great Lakes, West Mich, or both?

: Good luck.

: -erin
: "The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."

: - Socrates

We'll be at West Michigan and Great Lakes.

BTW, the wheel design is essentially the same. We just made them out of Lexan this year instead of aluminum (like last year). They just looked like gears due to the way we lightened them last year.

-Chris

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Posted by Gary at 2/20/2001 2:36 PM EST


Other on team #236, Techno Ticks, from Lyme Old lyme High School and Millstone Power Station.


In Reply to: Re: The monStars do it cool again
Posted by Chris Hibner on 2/19/2001 4:38 PM EST:



: : I really like your design.

: :
: : but I am going to miss the gears/wheels.

: : Where will we be seeing you- Great Lakes, West Mich, or both?

: : Good luck.

Can't see your page @ work,

: : -erin
: : "The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing."

: : - Socrates

: We'll be at West Michigan and Great Lakes.

: BTW, the wheel design is essentially the same. We just made them out of Lexan this year instead of aluminum (like last year). They just looked like gears due to the way we lightened them last year.

: -Chris
Can't see your Site
"FORBIDDEN SITE VIOLATES ACCEPETED USE POLICY" IT here thinks this is a sports site. GO UCONN HUSKIES!!!

Have Fun, and Get Some SLEEP !!

Gary Stearns Team Dad Late Night Machinist

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Posted by Andy Baker at 2/20/2001 1:02 AM EST


Engineer on team #45, TechnoKats, from Kokomo High School and Delphi Automotive Systems.


In Reply to: The Monster Roars (308 pics)
Posted by Chris Hibner on 2/19/2001 10:11 AM EST:



Man, I love this design. We had a similar concept, but we bailed on it because of the difficulty of having the long arm to control the rear goal... that cannot be easy at all.

Way to go for getting this design to work. Everyone will be impressed, that's for sure.

Andy B.

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Posted by Raul at 2/20/2001 10:32 AM EST


Engineer on team #111, Wildstang, from Rolling Meadows & Wheeling HS and Motorola.


In Reply to: The Monster Roars (308 pics)
Posted by Chris Hibner on 2/19/2001 10:11 AM EST:



Chris,

We also thought of this concept and felt it was a bit complex. Then again the concept we chose turned out to be very complex also (although as some have said it LOOKS simple). Congratulations on pulling it off.

In reponse to your prediciton, I think you should not set your expectations so high that you think you will score 416 as a minimum. We had a scrimmage with 4 other local teams that actually complimented our concept well and were not able to score any higher than 192 in any of the 15 matches. I'll admit that we all had software, control and hardware glitches that slowed things down. This was a great learning experience, almost like going to an extra regional.

There are so many coordination, timing and goal handling issues and 3 other robots that all have to do precisely as planned to get your objective score, that I think it will be rare that you actually score 416 during qualifying. During eliminations when all 4 teams have had a long time during the break to precisely dicuss what each robot will do, you will have much more success.

Raul

PS. I've been so busy, that I have not had a chance to enjoy these forums since Thursday. I have some catching up to do.

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Posted by Kevin at 2/20/2001 4:00 PM EST


Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monsters, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.


In Reply to: 416 Minimum Score??
Posted by Raul on 2/20/2001 10:32 AM EST:



Raul,

Our basic strategy this year is quite simple. As long as the 3 other robots can travel from the starting position to the endzone within 45 - 60 seconds, we should have no problem having the goals balanced within 75 seconds and being in the endzone within 90 seconds. Of course, we'll fill one goal with 12 - 15 balls at the human player station before completing the balancing act.

We believe we'll be able to significantly cut these times down with enough practice, and that if paired with the right robots, can significantly increase the score with small balls in the far goal and large balls on both goals. However, at the least we should have 52 points (10 for each robot, + 12 for the small balls) and an 8 times multiplier (both goals balanced within 90 seconds) which yields 416 points. Since we don't rely on other teams handling the goals, we hopefully won't have to worry about coordination or goal handling issues.

Therefore, we think 416 points is a minimum score, providing the other 3 robots simply plant in the endzone within 45 - 60 seconds, and hit the stop button.

Best of luck this year!

Kevin

: Chris,

: We also thought of this concept and felt it was a bit complex. Then again the concept we chose turned out to be very complex also (although as some have said it LOOKS simple). Congratulations on pulling it off.

: In reponse to your prediciton, I think you should not set your expectations so high that you think you will score 416 as a minimum. We had a scrimmage with 4 other local teams that actually complimented our concept well and were not able to score any higher than 192 in any of the 15 matches. I'll admit that we all had software, control and hardware glitches that slowed things down. This was a great learning experience, almost like going to an extra regional.

: There are so many coordination, timing and goal handling issues and 3 other robots that all have to do precisely as planned to get your objective score, that I think it will be rare that you actually score 416 during qualifying. During eliminations when all 4 teams have had a long time during the break to precisely dicuss what each robot will do, you will have much more success.

: Raul

: PS. I've been so busy, that I have not had a chance to enjoy these forums since Thursday. I have some catching up to do.

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Posted by Joe Ross at 2/20/2001 4:39 PM EST


Engineer on team #330, Beach Bot, from Hope Chapel Academy and NASA/JPL , J&F Machine, and Raytheon.


In Reply to: Re: 416 Minimum Score??
Posted by Kevin on 2/20/2001 4:00 PM EST:



I think that the single hardest thing you are going to
have to do this year is get your alliance partners to
merely go over to the other side and sit there.

As a coach, you have to reach a compromise. that
compromise isn't the strategy that theoretically scores
the most points but the one that all four teams can
agree to. You are going to have a very hard time trying
to convince a team that spent 6 weeks working just as
hard as you did to go and sit in the endzone, even if
you can score more points if they do so.

This comes from the experience of someone who has been
on the field and tried to negotiate with other teams.

[archiver]

Posted by Chris Hibner at 2/20/2001 6:45 PM EST


Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monster, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.


In Reply to: spoken like an engineer
Posted by Joe Ross on 2/20/2001 4:39 PM EST:



: I think that the single hardest thing you are going to
: have to do this year is get your alliance partners to
: merely go over to the other side and sit there.


We're not going to ask any teams to just sit in the endzone. We just stated that if that's all they can do (if all of our partners are having some sort of trouble with their manipulators or something since this can conceivably happen), we can still score 416 as an alliance. If they can do more (like drag a goal into position to save time, put in small balls in the goal, or put large balls on the goal), that's a huge bonus. All we're stating is that with a little practice, 416 is a MINIMUM, not our ideal strategy.


: This comes from the experience of someone who has been on the field and tried to negotiate with other teams.

This is our 5th year as coaches in the competition (3rd with alliances). We're pretty familiar with the negotiation part of the game. With this in mind, we figure that our robot will most likely do the balancing since most other robots can't get in the end zone after balancing. Afterall, I don't think an alliance would pass up and extra 80-100 points (after multipliers - 10 pts * 4 * 2 or 2.5(for time).

[archiver]

Posted by Kevin at 2/20/2001 6:57 PM EST


Coach on team #308, Walled Lake Monsters, from Walled Lake Schools and TRW Automotive Electronics.


In Reply to: spoken like an engineer
Posted by Joe Ross on 2/20/2001 4:39 PM EST:



Actually, as a coach, I'd be willing to compromise such that we implement the strategy that theoretically scores the most points, even if it meant we ride on the stretcher, effectively removing our robot (and its six weeks of work) from the match. If we place our egos above the good of the alliance, then we will find it harder to be in the finals, and that's our goal.

I've found that other teams are typically very willing to implement the strategy that maximizes their total score in my experience of being on the field and negotiating with other teams.

: I think that the single hardest thing you are going to
: have to do this year is get your alliance partners to
: merely go over to the other side and sit there.

: As a coach, you have to reach a compromise. that
: compromise isn't the strategy that theoretically scores
: the most points but the one that all four teams can
: agree to. You are going to have a very hard time trying
: to convince a team that spent 6 weeks working just as
: hard as you did to go and sit in the endzone, even if
: you can score more points if they do so.

: This comes from the experience of someone who has been
: on the field and tried to negotiate with other teams.