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#1
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Computer generated initial alliances
What are the criteria the 2014 FRC algorithm uses to generate the initial team alliances? Is it different District vs Regional events? Does it factor in a District win by aligning a team with a district win with lower ranked teams for the second play? I can only find data on the web for the 2008 algorithm and that must have changed as we were against the same team three times in only 12 rounds so “Minimum possible number of times a team plays opposite any team” doesn’t seem to apply? Thank you for any assistance in finding this information.
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#2
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
Per section 5.3.2 of the manual:
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#3
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
Game Manual, Section 5
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#5
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
Thank you Shnabel FRC #0314 for the link that answers so many questions!
I was sure there was a different algorithm for district events as we had 36 teams and 12 matches so no surrogates and yet played against the same team 3 times and never played with at least 4 teams. I now see there are other factors that figure in to the equation. |
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#6
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
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does "played with" as used here mean "played on the same alliance as" or "played in the same match as"? |
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#7
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
Yes I mean played on the same alliance as
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#8
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
In that case, I am not surprised in the slightest. Since you are only partnered with 2 robots/match, and you play 12 matches, you only play on the same alliance with a maximum of 24 robots at a 12-match event. Since there were 35 teams at your event that weren't you, this means that you will not play with at least 11 of them in quals, no matter what the algorithm is.
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#9
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
I also noticed that 2791 played with / against the same teams a ton of times at Finger Lakes. Events that large normally have less repeats. Other teams had a lot of repeats as well.
We played with / against 341 three times (1/2). We played twice against 1126. We also played 1 with and 1 against teams 20, 1592, 174, 1450, 1551, and 3173. Not that upset about it or anything, just thought there was a bit less emphasis on playing unique teams this year than prior years. |
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#10
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
Quote:
![]() Last edited by Electronica1 : 03-04-2014 at 21:41. |
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#11
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
The scheduling algorithm focuses on minimising repeated alliance partners while also trying to limit the number of repeated opponents and the number of times you see the same teams in either role.
While the algorithm is great for standard regional events (50+ teams and around 10 matches) and gives a reasonable schedule for all events, it struggles a little when the number of teams is between 2 & 3 times the number of matches per team. |
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#12
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
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We saw 2590, 341, and someone else (i'm burned out and my brain isn't working) at least three times, whether they were on our side of the glass or across the field. It was unexpected for sure. |
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#13
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
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#14
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
From the link provided...
MatchMaker Scheduling Algorithm By Tom and Cathy Saxton © 2007-2008, Idle Loop Software Design, LLC Latest Revision: January 11, 2008 MatchMaker Version: 1.0.2b1 “The algorithm used by FIRST to generate the qualification match schedule at the FIRST Robotics Competitions (FRC) is critical to the success of the regional and championship competitions. This paper discusses the desired properties of the match schedule, and an algorithm that finds near-optimal solutions in a practical time frame. The algorithm begins by seeding the match schedule with the simplest possible schedule: the teams are dumped in the schedule sequentially in the exact same order for every round. Thereafter, teams are only rearranged within rounds. This guarantees the round uniformity requirement: no schedule that breaks the round uniformity requirement is ever even generated.” I am not going to get into the debate about whether an older team (lower number) is better or not, but I have noticed the match schedule seems to lump lower number teams together a little more often.(As well as bunch the higher numbers) For example, in the Curie Division last year, there were 50 teams numbered above 2130 and 49 below. We played 8 matches against 24 teams, 11 of which were numbered over 2130 and 13 were below. Of the 16 alliance partners, 13 were numbered above and only 3 were below. Maybe the schedule generator should randomize the numbers before the teams are dumped in the schedule instead of sequentially. |
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#15
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Re: Computer generated initial alliances
The algorithm is the same for all events, but when there are so few teams and so many matches at districts, the likelihood is simply that you end up playing with/against the same teams more often than a traditional regional. The FTAs at each event review the schedules after generating them, and review the number of times each teams is paired with/against teams and maximize the number of opponents and partners, per the rules quoted previously.
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