New numbering rules?

[evanperryg]

R2 lays out the new numbering rules, and altough they only added a small section, it is awfully specific:

Team numbers must be displayed on the ROBOT and meet the following criteria:
A. consist of numerals at least 3.5 in. high, at least 0.5 in. in stroke width, and be black in color with a white background extending at least 1 in. from the edges of the numbering,
B. be positioned around the ROBOT such that an observer walking around the perimeter of the ROBOT can unambiguously tell the Team’s number from any point of view.

It's all pretty normal, but the limits on the color of the numbers seems rather picky. Why not specify that the numbers must be of a reasonably high contrast, or easy to read? Perhaps it's becaue i was hoping to be able to do backlit numbers in waterjetted aluminum, but i'm dissapointed by how specific it is.

[orangemoore]

The numbers rules likely strict so that there isn't any confusion an what is high-contrast.


Also backlit leds could fail.

[evanperryg]

Originally Posted by orangemoore

The numbers rules likely strict so that there isn't any confusion an what is high-contrast.
Also backlit leds could fail.

The issue of contrast could easily be interpreted as part of R2-B, as numbering would have to be easily visible in order to be "unambiguous." And, if done properly, backlit numbers could easily be made visible regardless of if they are actually lit.

As far as I can tell, it's not illegal to have backlit numbers in waterjetted aluminum, as long as you also have black numbers against a white background

I figured this would be the final solution, as im sure my whining will have no influence on upcoming rule revisions but I still find it dissappointing, and a little odd that such a specific rule would be placed in an otherwise very flexible game.

[Foster]

Originally Posted by evanperryg

The issue of contrast could easily be interpreted as part of R2-B, as numbering would have to be easily visible in order to be "unambiguous." And, if done properly, backlit numbers could easily be made visible regardless of if they are actually lit.


I figured this would be the final solution, as im sure my whining will have no influence on upcoming rule revisions but I still find it dissappointing, and a little odd that such a specific rule would be placed in an otherwise very flexible game.

It's a big robot. They are small numbers. Having two sets, one in black and white and another in your dancing disco LED lights isn't against the rule.

In prior years, you needed to paint the bumpers. This year, no bumpers but you still need the numbers. Think of the 100's of teams that can't do back-lighted colored numbers. So the min cost effort is black on white that was imposed by FIRST. Think black marker on an index card.

With your resources think of the fund raiser for next year (or maybe this year!!!!) "We'll do your Robot number for $10 per digit per sign!!!!" and away you go.

On the other hand when I look across the 4000 teams building a robot, your team's biggest issue is the back light. I'm humbled that you have solved, designed and are ready to build a robot and have extra, nay, vast amounts of extra energy and build time to move a lighted team number to the top of your build list.

I've added your team to my personal "robots to watch" list, can't wait to see how you make out.

[Billfred]

The color and background restrictions are still a little obnoxious, but no more obnoxious than the restrictions on bumper numbers and infinitely easier to implement. All you need to get compliant is a printer, two sheets of paper, (print two to a page) and some tape, which beats the pants off of any process to get numbers on the bumpers. I've used most of them, from silver sharpies to paint to sewn-on white fabric, and it is VERY hard to get good-looking results.

As for 4901? We'll take the files for our bumper number from last year, flip the colors from white to black, add it to our vinyl stickers with the sponsor logos, and save ourselves at least a couple nights of work.

[Koko Ed]

As a graphic designer R2 kills my dreams.

[MrForbes]

There are still more than 10,000 square inches of space on your robot to fill with your wonderful graphic design. Just make the numbers so us blind old folks can read them, please?

[EricH]

Originally Posted by MrForbes

Just make the numbers so us blind old folks can read them, please?

This. I would also suggest the following test:

If you (Edit: or, preferably, your grandparents) cannot read your robot's numbers from 50 yards out (150 ft), give or take a bit, then you may want to reconsider font, size, or stroke. Why 50 yards? That would be some of the farther scouts who are wishing they'd brought binoculars to read your numbers.

[cglrcng]

It is why I have only scouted once...Reading those numbers from way up in the nosebleeds is so very difficult to say the least....And all that data feeds back to the robot team # firstly. (I am nearsighted, I'll run that thread through the needle for you in a flash & read off those tiny numbers on a capacitor or chip without the magnifying glass (but you have to tell me what robot I'm scouting this round, and you better say the number real clearly, then find my golf ball also please). Getting old is hard.

[RamZ]

This is one of the times that having a single (or generally low) digit team number comes in handy! My suggestion was to make our entire robot into a giant 4.

[Amar Shah]

I'm thinking black acrylic inlaid in white acrylic would look neat.

[atucker4072]

Originally Posted by Koko Ed

As a graphic designer R2 kills my dreams.

Also killing 148's dreams.

[orangemoore]

Someone should ask for a change in the Q/A. I wouldn't be surprised if they changed the rule because of it.

[Billfred]

Originally Posted by orangemoore

Someone should ask for a change in the Q/A. I wouldn't be surprised if they changed the rule because of it.

On what basis? The GDC is not known for robot rule changes except to clarify or to address a technical issue in their regulations.

[orangemoore]

Originally Posted by Billfred

On what basis? The GDC is not known for robot rule changes except to clarify or to address a technical issue in their regulations.

Your probably right. I still say ask it. You will never get anything you want unless you first ask.