Legality of stepstool

[cjl2625]

From my week 0 experience, the drawbridge is a terrible hindrance to the drivers' line of sight. But it's almost short enough to see over. If I were six feet tall, the view would be quite better.

Would it be illegal to bring a stepstool or platform for drivers to stand on during a match? I don't seem to recall any rules prohibiting that, but if legal, it may be useful under certain circumstances.

[Hitchhiker 42]

I think this would be certainly fine. Seeing as the rules only prohibit powered devices or vision-impeding things, a stepstool should be fine, as long as it isn't powered. Not that I can think of a way you could power it .

Also, seeing as the GDC says ok (jokingly, but still) to baguettes and turkey legs, this should definetly be fine.

[Chris_Ely]

No, see rule T26-1:

Originally Posted by T26-1

The only equipment, provided it does not block visibility for FIELD STEWARDS or audience
members or jam or interfere with the remote sensing capabilities of another Team, including
vision systems, acoustic range finders, sonars, infrared proximity detectors, etc. (e.g. including
imagery that, to a reasonably astute observer, mimics the Vision Guides), that may be brought in
to the CASTLE are as follows:
A. the OPERATOR CONSOLE,
B. non-powered signaling devices,
C. reasonable decorative items,
D. TEAM STANDARDS and devices, if needed, to assist placement in the Standard Holder,
E. special clothing and/or equipment required due to a disability
F. devices used solely for the purpose of planning or tracking strategy provided they meet all of
the following conditions:
i. do not connect or attach to the OPERATOR CONSOLE
ii. do not connect or attach to the FIELD or ARENA
iii. do not connect or attach to another ALLIANCE member
iv. do not communicate with anything or anyone outside of the ARENA.
v. do not include any form of enabled wireless electronic communication (e.g. radios,
walkie-talkies, cell phones, Bluetooth communications, Wi-Fi, etc.)
vi. do not in any way affect the outcome of a MATCH, other than by allowing PLAYERS
to plan or track strategy for the purposes of communication of that strategy to other
ALLIANCE members.
Items B, C, E and F also apply to the DRIVE TEAM Member in the SPY BOX.
Violation: MATCH will not start until situation remedied.

[Anonymous_Sheep]

T26-1 clearly allows for the use of a step stool...

D. TEAM STANDARDS and devices, if needed, to assist placement in the Standard Holder

E. special clothing and/or equipment required due to a disability

D. Allows you to bring a step stool to place your standard and does not require you to remove it from the driver station

E. Allows you to bring a step stool provided the ref's agree that being short is a direct hindrance on your ability to play the game

Also I noticed someone has already submitted it to the Q/A so we will know for sure soon.

[gpetilli]

Originally Posted by cjl2625

From my week 0 experience, the drawbridge is a terrible hindrance to the drivers' line of sight. But it's almost short enough to see over. If I were six feet tall, the view would be quite better.

Would it be illegal to bring a stepstool or platform for drivers to stand on during a match? I don't seem to recall any rules prohibiting that, but if legal, it may be useful under certain circumstances.

We asked this exact question on the Q&A (search on stool) and got the answer that is is up to the local head ref if he wants to consider "vertically challenged" a disability.

[EricH]

FRC4522 asked something similar on Q&A just now.


Now taking bets on whether the GDC will say "No per T26" or "We think the answer to QXXX answers this question. If it does not, please rephrase and ask again."

[Hitchhiker 42]

I think you can consider this a "signaling device" or an assist to a vertical height disability.

[EricH]

Originally Posted by Anonymous_Sheep

T26-1 clearly allows for the use of a step stool...

D. TEAM STANDARDS and devices, if needed, to assist placement in the Standard Holder

E. special clothing and/or equipment required due to a disability

D. Allows you to bring a step stool to place your standard and does not require you to remove it from the driver station

E. Allows you to bring a step stool provided the ref's agree that being short is a direct hindrance on your ability to play the game

Also I noticed someone has already submitted it to the Q/A so we will know for sure soon.

Originally Posted by Hitchhiker 42

I think you can consider this a "signaling device" or an assist to a vertical height disability.

OK, guys. I've got a couple of notes for ya.

First, that item is "if needed" on the standard. Driver's station is roughly 6.5' tall. MANY people can reach that high without much effort--slap the sill of a normal doorway, you're probably good. Reaching that high with a standard might be a bit more difficult, but should be doable.

Second, if you are ACTUALLY disabled by being short (as in, short enough to trigger ADA--there are, in fact, regulations on this), then you can make the argument that you need the stool (though you might get the wheelchair ramp instead). However, if you're just "not tall enough to see the field", that is NOT a disability! If, for example, someone under 5' is on the drive team, they'd probably have a good case for the stool. If the entire drive team is over 6'? Not a chance.


And also, I should remind you guys: SPY. Use him/her.

[droswell]

If passive assistive devices are allowed, we are totally bringing these:

[EricH]

Originally Posted by droswell

If passive assistive devices are allowed, we are totally bringing these:

Guess who's not bringing those, because those land under T26-1's "banned" list?

[Landonh12]

Our team had this idea, I am pretty sure we are going to use this.

https://frc-qa.firstinspires.org/Que...ring-the-match

Q. Are teams allowed to mount approximately a ten foot pole with a wired camera on top to their individual driver station and get a bird's eye view of the match for driver use during the match?

A. There is no legislated maximum height of the OPERATOR CONSOLE. However, be aware that some venues and production setups may have basketball hoops, lighting fixtures, or other installments that can not be moved and may inhibit exceptionally tall OPERATOR CONSOLES. Also, please keep safety in mind when moving and setting up tall OPERATOR CONSOLES like this.

[rich2202]

Funny you cannot have a periscope, but you can have the electronic equivalent

[nighterfighter]

Originally Posted by rich2202

Funny you cannot have a periscope, but you can have the electronic equivalent

Having a periscope around your face blocks your vision, which is a safety hazard.

[mrwright]

So it appears that step stools are officially illegal. We figured they would be but it was worth a try!

Q872

Q783

[dradel]

By federal law the refs wouldn't be able to ask about a persons disability per the ada.
And we can't say girls are allowed to bring stools cause that would be straight up sexist.
I like the combined height of driver plus stool not to exceed 6'. But what if your driver stands 6'2" without a stool are they then illegal??