first year team needs help

[Air Soarer]

Hello. This is the first year my school has participated in the FIRST competition. I go to a small school, so participation is very limited. Also add on the fact the there are only 3 seniors(me being one), and we're the only ones who have any... skill, work ethic, or education in engineering. To put it bluntly, we're extremely far behind. The other two seniors are working on the programming/electronics, and are making decent progress. I'm the head of hardware, as I'm really the only other competent student. The engineers at our sponsor have been very helpful in getting things built, however designing things is our fatal flaw.

I'm asking if anyone had some suggestions for a very easy strategy that we might be able to pull off. As of right now, we have nothing. Building complex things is going to be virtually impossible, so please keep it simple. I have no experience in the competition, so I don't know what works and what doesn't. Thanks in advance.

[Mike Norton]

Make a very simple robot that will run everytime you put the robot on the floor. Don't worry about anything else. If your robot does run then think about pushing the balls to your human player.


Just that should be enough fun for your team.

[KenWittlief]

simply from the potential points perspective, getting the release ball to drop, and then getting those 18 balls on the floor can get your team the most points for doing 'one' thing - herding the small balls.

you can get 18*5 = 90 points just for doing that, if your human player can toss them in your goal

and since there are 6 freebee balls behind the wall when you start, thats another 30 points. So you would have a potential score of 120

all you need to knock the release ball over is a pneumatic cylinder - If your programmers can get you in the right spot in auton mode, that should be a piece of cake.

To gather the balls off the floor and get them to the human player, you could build a base frame using the transmissions that first gave you - one wheel on each side - like the one on the kickoff video - and have a plow shape on the front to push balls across the floor.

you will want to do some testing on this - pushing the balls with a pole or piece of alum is not trivial - you have to have your 'plow' the right shape and push the balls in the right spot, or your robot will try to climb over them, or they will get wedged infront and you wont be able to move at all.

If you get that working, and have time left, you might make something like a jousting pole that springs out, or unfolds with a pneumatic cylinder, for knocking the 2X ball off your goal (so you can toss balls in it)

or another simple addon would be a hook for snagging the lip on the portable goal, so you can drag it closer to your human player.

and dont forget, this game is not a race against the clock - its 2 teams playing against 2 teams - you can come up with some defensive strategies, to get in your opponets bot 'face' and keep them from scoring more points than you.

[KenWittlief]

also remember you will have an alliance partner in each match you play - you are almost certain to be allied with teams that can get the release ball, manipulate the 2X ball or climb the bar

so as long as you are able to do one function well, between you and your alliance, you should do great.

[KenWittlief]

note that the 2X ball is sitting on top of 4 foot high pvc pipes, and you are allowed to make your bot 60" (5 feet) high - so it would be very easy to make a pole or arm that twists around or springs out to knock the 2x ball off the top of your goal.

[jneumiller]

Originally Posted by KenWittlief

also remember you will have an alliance partner in each match you play - you are almost certain to be allied with teams that can get the release ball, manipulate the 2X ball or climb the bar

so as long as you are able to do one function well, between you and your alliance, you should do great.

Ken:

You must have been at another FIRST competition last year...while you're correct, autonomous shouldn't be that hard, it sure looked like it was at the Lone Star Regional...probably the only thing that kept us in the hunt was that we'd noodled that one through correctly.

I hope you're right and we see alot more effective robots in the first 15 seconds, but I'm not putting a paycheck on it.

See you on the high ground or Atlanta,

Jim

[Ben Mitchell]

What I would do:

Make a simple drive train, then build a simple little V-shaped piece that fits the outside of the goal. Attach this to one end of the robot

On the other end, make a scoop or wings, or something to semi-contain and gather balls - like a snowplow, but for balls.

Out of the top of the robot, a simple pole or arm to knock the ball down of the tees or off the goals.

The end result: a robot that can knock the ball down in autonamous, push goals around, and gather balls.

That would be an optimal design, since it is very multifunctional and would be well suited to offense or defensive playing.

Originally Posted by KenWittlief

so as long as you are able to do one function well, between you and your alliance, you should do great.

This about sums it up - if you can do one thing (I suggest gathering balls, since they are the primary source of points this year) and do it well, you will be very successful on the field. The large balls are tough to work with, and hanging on the bar is as well. I'd stick to pushing the goals and gathering balls.

Though, from past experience, it is the drive train that is the most important part of the robot - make sure it is very robust and reliable.

[Air Soarer]

Thanks for the suggesitions. We already have a rectangular frame that is almost to the size limit, so adding on a plow will be difficult, but I'll think of something. We did plan on making a hook arm, so i'm glad that someone else thinks it's a good idea. Our programmers are good, so I'm not concerned about the autonomous part. Again thanks for the help.

[Mike Norton]

http://www.valleytech.k12.ma.us/robo...2003_Robot.JPG


this is what you can put on your robot. you don't need steel you can use something light

[generalbrando]

Pneumatics, Pneumatics, Pneumatics!

Pneumatics are very easy, reliable, tollerable. They don't fail as often as a motor because they aren't relying on gears or sprokets or whatever. Anyway, I could suggest using pneumatics if you can for some of the simple mechanisms you add to the drive train. You could easily make a plow with some pneumatics - just have little arms/wings that swing out and then put a cylinder on them. If you need help with the pneumatics, don't forget to check out the manual posted online on FIRST's site - it's very good.

Best of luck - to you and all rookies! Keep with it guys - the best feeling is seeing your robot move on the field the first time (even if it is July instead of March! ).

[KenWittlief]

that valleytech photo is a good start, but Im pretty certain (due to some prototype testing we did wed nite) that with the arms that high the balls will wedge under them (make sure you test it on carpet - these balls have very high friction surfaces).

[KenWittlief]

(ok its time to deploy the FIRST secret weapon)

HEY! YOU TEAMS UP IN NEW HAMPSHIRE - THE ROOKIE TEAM WHO STARTED THIS THREAD IS ASKING FOR HELP

WARNER NH IS A STONES THROW FROM MANCHESTER

REMEMBER WHAT DEAN SAID OUR HOMEWORK IS THIS YEAR?

HOWBOUT SOME VETRAN TEAMS HOOK UP WITH THESE GUYS AND PAY THEM A VISIT THIS WEEKEND?

(you are having a team meeting this weekend, right?)

[Lil' Lavery]

Just build something that runs with a simple plow in the front. Maybe simple hooks in the back to control the mobile goals.

[Air Soarer]

Yeah, if a veteran team would like to just come check us out/help us, let me know. I'll get you the info you need. I'm not sure if we're having a weekend meeting, but I'll find out tomorrow. P.S. We're actually working in Sutton, but it's only one exit farther on 89.

[ChrisH]

Originally Posted by Air Soarer

Yeah, if a veteran team would like to just come check us out/help us, let me know. I'll get you the info you need. I'm not sure if we're having a weekend meeting, but I'll find out tomorrow. P.S. We're actually working in Sutton, but it's only one exit farther on 89.

The earlier suggestions for things to do are all good. But some of them left out important aspects, probably because the vets that proposed them didn't think to mention them. They fall into the "Of Course!" catagory.

So here are two hints from a veteran team that learned the hard way:

1) If you can aquire it you need to be able to get rid of it.
2) If you deploy it you need to be able to retract it.

I'd love to come out and visit, but 3000 miles is a little far...