Rookie team status (animation)

[NoRemorse]

I was wondering if we would loose our rookie status as an animation team if we submit our forms, but fail to finish our animation.

Quick feedback would be apreciated! We deen to make a decision soon on the matter of sending in forms for our animation

I might add this is our second year as a team, but our 1st submitting an animation.

[NoRemorse]

sorry, have to do this

*BUMP*

[Josh Siegel]

Yeah, I'd like to know too... Deadline looms!

[Matt Hallock]

No you don't lose it.

My team submitted the entry forms and an animation last year (It was rejected due to an inexperienced technical foley) and we are rookies. So if you don't finish this year, you will be a rookie for the next.

[squide]

Wow, I didn't know that. Thanks for bringing this to my attention. My team didn't submit an animation last year so we're rookies again!

[thoughtful]

if u are a rookie team but your animation is good, can u get the other award?

[Ricky Q.]

This is from the Award info in the manual and on Streamline:

Schools, which have submitted previously but have been disqualified, do not qualify as “Rookie” teams under these Guidelines. Should a “Rookie” team win the 2004 Championship Award there will be no ”Rising Star” Award presented.

So if you have submitted before and got disqualified it seems as if you are not rookies, thats the way I see it.

[Josh Siegel]

Are you DQ'ed if you turn in paperwork but no final animation? The dorms at our school couldn't get online, and now we have no SFX to use... I'd like to be able to be a rookie team next year, but for some reason I don't see that being the case.

[dlavery]

For this year, you can be a veteran team and still submit an animation as a "rookie" if, and only if, your team has never submitted an animation before. As noted above, if your team has submitted an animation in prior years but it was disqualified for any reason, then it still counts as a submission and you can no longer claim to be a rookie.

However, and this is the important part, this definition is good for this year only. DO NOT assume that the rules will be the same next year. Personally, I believe that a rookie team is a rookie team, and a veteran team is a veteran team (i.e. words mean what words mean). If your team has participated in the FIRST competition for more than one year, then the team is a veteran team - including the animation group. If the team chose not to submit an animation during their rookie year, then it is their choice to pass on this opportunity and they should not be able to submit as "rookies" later.

Otherwise, you could make the same case for every other subgroup on every team. Your team didn't submit a Chairman's Award nomination for the first seven years? No problem, just claim to be a rookie "Chairman's Award Group" and send it in and apply for the "Rookie All-Star" award. Your team never submitted anything for the "Controls Innovation" award, but wrote control system software for the first five years? No problem, just document your six years of experience, claim to be a rookie "Controls Innovation Group" and apply for the award. etc. etc. etc. I think you can see where this would lead.

So I would recommend that if you developed an animation this year, go ahead and submit it. Even if you think it doesn't stand a chance against some other animations, give it a shot. You never know what might happen! And don't automatically assume that the rules will be the same next year. If you want to withhold your submission and try it again as "rookies", and the rules are different in 2005, don't say you were not warned.

-dave

[MConte05]

Personally, I believe that a rookie team is a rookie team, and a veteran team is a veteran team (i.e. words mean what words mean). If your team has participated in the FIRST competition for more than one year, then the team is a veteran team - including the animation group.

I would have to disagree with you on that, simply because a lot of rookie teams don't have the time or resources to be able to do an animation or website, plus the animation is a lot of times a personal thing, only one or two people work on it. So technically if this is their first time doing it, they should have a chance to be a rookie. Being a rookie in the animation is just as hard as being a rookie in the robotics competion; alot of times the rookies of the animation have to figure out the program on thier own, develop their own stories and finally, get everything together for the first time, not knowing any tips or tricks. While teams with more experience in doing the whole animation thing should, in turn be able to turn in higher-quality animation simply because they have more experience.....

Just my $0.02

[dlavery]

Originally Posted by MConte05

I would have to disagree with you on that, simply because a lot of rookie teams don't have the time or resources to be able to do an animation or website, plus the animation is a lot of times a personal thing, only one or two people work on it. So technically if this is their first time doing it, they should have a chance to be a rookie. Being a rookie in the animation is just as hard as being a rookie in the robotics competion; alot of times the rookies of the animation have to figure out the program on thier own, develop their own stories and finally, get everything together for the first time, not knowing any tips or tricks. While teams with more experience in doing the whole animation thing should, in turn be able to turn in higher-quality animation simply because they have more experience.....

Just my $0.02

We definitely disagree.

Let's imagine the following hypothetical situation. The "animation team" for a team consists of just one student, who starts to develop an animation for the 2004 competition. The animation is started at the same time as every other team, and worked and developed throughout the season. As submission time nears, the animation team decides that they are not happy with the quality of their efforts, and do not submit in 2004. However, the team continues to work on the animation over the spring, summer and fall, improving it with each iteration. By the time the 2005 competition rolls around, it is a photo-realistic quality, near-professional product.

Why in the world should that team be allowed to participate in the 2005 competition as a "rookie team" entry? At that point, the team has over a year's worth of experience with the software. The animation has nearly a year of development effort behind it. Every other legitimate "rookie" team gets just six weeks to learn the software, develop their ideas, and create their animation.

It would be beyond reason to put a group like the team described above in the same class as the true "rookies" and then try to call it fair. And yet, as we have seen in this and a few other threads, we know that some teams are going to try this. "Rookie" status should be determined by your experience and knowledge base, and not by your entry status from last year. If the full team has been in existance for more than one year, then they have had the opportunity to gain that experience and knowledge. If the team, not FIRST, makes the decision to opt out of the 2004 competition, then I believe that they should live with the ramifications of that decision (just like professionals have to do every day).

-dave