Ethical Question

[White_Orpheus]

I've been poring through the rules for the AVA about using work completed outside of the season. In the past my team has always completed the entirety of our animation during the build season, but this year, I'm really tempted to use some older work. We're doing something with cars, and I have that completed 350z to use. On the one hand, I could still complete the animation without using it, but on the other, it would add to the overall impressiveness of the animation. I know a lot of other teams start working on their animations far in advance, but it just doesn't feel right to me. As it stands, I don't think I'm going to use it. Am I making the right decision on trying to do the whole thing during the build season, or is it generally accepted to use old work?

[Ryan M.]

If there are no rules against it, there's nothing wrong with it.

--EDIT--
But make sure there aren't any against such things. *shrug*

[Nuttyman54]

go for it! i'm looking forward to a great animation, so don't dissapoint!

[Capt.ArD]

don't worry about it. I had a rough storyboard finished about 2 weeks before the new rules were released, and had begun training noobs and doing a bit of modelling by the week before that. alot of people already have a head start, and as there are no rules against it you might as well use your model. (which was pretty impressive, i must add) Even if it isn't really *supposed* to be done, how can Autodesk/the judges check on you? Go for it.

[Katie Reynolds]

Originally Posted by Capt.ArD

Even if it isn't really *supposed* to be done, how can Autodesk/the judges check on you? Go for it.

They trust that you're being honest and following the rules. Just like with the robot - sure, you can build an awesome transmission, chassis, control system, etc during the off-season, use that part on your robot, and the judges and other teams will be none the wiser. But we've been taught this thing called gracious professionalism - disrespecting other teams by showing an obvious disregard for set rules is not at all part of this ethos.

Would your grandmother be proud of you breaking the rules just 'cause you can?

[White_Orpheus]

The thing that is confusing me is that there aren't any rules against it. I know with the robot, you're supposed to do your work during the season, but with the animation, I dont' think there are any such restrictions. I just want to know if it is allowed or not. If it isn't, I won't use the model, but if there aren't any restrictions on it, I'll go ahead and do it.

[Nuttyman54]

Our team always went by the "you start when you get the new software" idea. We started brainstorming and testing effects as soon as we got the package

[kcy88]

I think it's fine to start brainstorming and learning the software before the season starts. I believe it is FIRST and Autodesk's intentions to let the teams learn the software by having the Safety Animation comeptition. Even if your team doesn't summit a safety animation, it is still OK to practice with the software. But I don't think it is ethical to finish an animation before the season starts. Howevever, to answer your question, I believe it is OK to use past models, maybe as background objects and not as an object of main focus.

[Capt.ArD]

They trust that you're being honest and following the rules. Just like with the robot - sure, you can build an awesome transmission, chassis, control system, etc during the off-season, use that part on your robot, and the judges and other teams will be none the wiser. But we've been taught this thing called gracious professionalism - disrespecting other teams by showing an obvious disregard for set rules is not at all part of this ethos.

Sorry if it sounded like that. Not really what i meant. If it is out right forbidden, then of course not, don't do it. But seeing as how it isn't, then why not? I said the "supposed to be" because a lot of people i know would say that you shouldn't anyway, even if it isn't a rule. Again, sorry for sounding like a scofflaw or something.

But I don't think it is ethical to finish an animation before the season starts. Howevever, to answer your question, I believe it is OK to use past models, maybe as background objects and not as an object of main focus.

Wow! the concept of finishing the animation before 3:00AM the day it is due totally blows my mind!
And yeah, it isn't plagiarism if you made the model yourself. No problem using your own models.

[stevek]

I always have my team wait to start the actual animation. However, reusing a model that you made for another project it not bad. I know there is a fine line for somone that wants a head start and they could say that they were working on another project and reused elements- but if someone wants to lie or cheat then you cant stop them. If it's actually true, then I have no problem.

I know there is no rule, so I always based it on the Shipment of the software as well. My reasoning is simple- Does the fact that we have 6 or 7 years of software give us an unfair advantage over somone that is new and just gets it for the first time? So if we start when the animation arrives then its fair. I think that's gratiously professional.

Honestly, I think of things all year long that may make a good animation. So there's no time frame on your minds ability to think and create. We are a veteran team and have produced a pretty strong animation consistently for the last 5-6 years (If I do say so myself) And we have always worked in the Robot Build Season. Besides the reasons mentioned above- which are the main reasons for my rule (for our team) We also have limited access to the school out of season- unless there is a teacher to let us in the building, we cant get there. Also everyone gets so burned out by the end of the build session, that starting early will possibly give premature burnout- before shipmode kicks in and you go all out. This could be Bad.

One other Ethical issue to consider- Adult Work in the animation. I personally work with my team and I am a graphics professional, but the Students do it all. I give them techniques and I teach them skills and methods- but I don't really know MAX all that well. I use other software in my work. However, I have heard of Mentors bragging about all the work they put in. The rules do state - STUDENT ANIMATION. So there are some more things to ponder.

Good luck all.

[White_Orpheus]

When I first got involved in FIRST, the whole "mentor work in a student animation" thing really bothered me, but I've found that most of the successful teams have been student run anyway, so it doesn't seem like a huge issue to me anymore. Here's to student animators!