How many Motors are we allowed to use

[Jared Rillings]

I know that in the rules it says that we can use a maximum of 2 3in CIM motors and 4 2.5in CIM motors but are we limited to a certain amount of the other motors (denso window motors, FisherPrice Motors, globe motors, left and right keyang motors, Mabuchi Motors etc.)?

[Paul Copioli]

The motors you can use (and their respective quantities) listed:

QTY 4 2.5" CIM Motors (2 in the kit plus 2 for purchase)

QTY 2 3" CIM Motors, aka the Mini-Bike motor (1 in the kit plus 1 for purchase).

QTY 2 Globe motors (both in kit only)

QTY 2 window motors, the shiny ones with RH / LH (both in kit only)

QTY 1 Denso motor, the other window motor (in kit only)

QTY 2 Banebots motor (in kit only)

QTY 2 FP motors (in kit only)* - this one is still pending a clarification since we received 2 but the list states 1.

The total is 15. Of course, direct replacements are O.K. for any of the motors (if one breaks), but the only motors you can use in larger quantities than provided in the kit are the 2.5" CIM and the 3" CIM.

[Peter Matteson]

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli

QTY 2 FP motors (in kit only)* - this one is still pending a clarification since we received 2 but the list states 1.

This was corrected in team update 1, so now we can officially use 2 FP motors.

[ChuckDickerson]

This exact question seems to come up about 10 times every year. I'm not jumping you but folks please read the manual that FIRST spends a lot of time writing! This subject is well covered by rules R27, R45, and R46 as it is every year. If you don't understand the manual (which can be very confusing we all admit) please search CD before you post.

To answer the question: You are not allowed to use any motors other than those that came in the kit this year and in the quantity that came in the kit. You cannot purchase additional motors of like or different kind to use on the robot in addition to those that came in the kit. You can purchase additional motors as EXACT replacements (from IFI or Banebots) only to use as spares. You may purchase 2 more CIM motors and 1 more mini-bike motor to use in addition to those that you were shipped in the kit. The checklist only listed 1Fisher-Price motor but we all (should have) received 2 in the KoP and per team update #1 we may use 2. Additional servos identical to the ones in the kit are allowed.

By my count you can use on the robot at any time:
4 - CIM
2 - mini-bike
2 Fisher-Price
2 Globe
2 of the window motors with 1 left and 1 right
1 of the "other" window motors either left or right
2 Banebots motors (one supplied with the gear box, one without)
1 small Mabushi motor
As many of the servo motors as you can make use of

(I am going from memory here so if I missed any someone please add to the list.)

Unfortunately, our dear friend, Mr. Van-Door, passed away this past year and won't be here to help us out.

Please see rules R27, R45, and R46 in the manual and update number 1 for more information.

[Jared Rillings]

Thank you for answers they definatly solve alot of confusion.

[andrew_4_life]

I know it states you cannot use motors from any of the previous kits, but it also says you can use 1 or 2 addition 2.5" cim motors, so can you use 2 additional 2.5" cim motors from previous years? And have a total of four 2.5" cim motors (2 new from this years kit, 2 from last years kit).

....

[Cuog]

You may use the extra motors, FIRST really has no way of knowing when/how you got them.

And look at the sig, it will answer all your questions

[Peter Matteson]

Originally Posted by andrew_4_life

I know it states you cannot use motors from any of the previous kits, but it also says you can use 1 or 2 addition 2.5" cim motors, so can you use 2 additional 2.5" cim motors from previous years? And have a total of four 2.5" cim motors (2 new from this years kit, 2 from last years kit).

....

Just verify they are in fact the same part numbers. The output shats were different in 2003 and earlier.
Pete

[Cuog]

Originally Posted by Peter Matteson

Just verify they are in fact the same part numbers. The output shats were different in 2003 and earlier.
Pete

Good point, I didn't know that

[Dominicano0519]

Originally Posted by andrew_4_life

I know it states you cannot use motors from any of the previous kits, but it also says you can use 1 or 2 addition 2.5" cim motors, so can you use 2 additional 2.5" cim motors from previous years? And have a total of four 2.5" cim motors (2 new from this years kit, 2 from last years kit).

....

<R46> Items specifically PROHIBITED from use on the robot during competition matches
include:
 Primary 12v batteries different from those provided in the KOP
 More than one primary battery, or more than one back-up battery
 Circuit breakers different from those provided in the Kit Of Parts. Note: the
Snap Action brand circuit breakers provided have unique “trip” characteristics.
No substitute brands are permitted.
 Fuse panels different from those provided in the Kit Of Parts.
 Electric motors different from, or in addition to, those in the Kit, with the
exception of those specifically permitted by Rule <R45>.
 Any air compressor other than the one provided in the Kit Of Parts.
 Hydraulic fluids or hydraulic components.
 Lasers of any type.
 Speakers, sirens, air horns, or other audio devices that generate sound at a
level sufficient to be a distraction or hindrance affecting the outcome of a
match.
 Electric solenoid actuators (note: electric solenoid actuators are NOT the same
at pneumatic solenoid valves – the latter are permitted, the former are not).

as long as first doesn't explicitly ban that motor you can use it,
for example, the cim motor has not changed so therefore you can use previous years cim motors etc..





<R45> Items specifically permitted on 2007 FRC ROBOTS include:
 Additional HITEC HS-322HD Servos.
 Additional Victor 884 speed controllers and Spike relay modules, as needed.
 One additional 4-slot Maxi-block circuit breaker panel and utilize it on their 2007 ROBOT in
addition to, or in replacement of, the circuit breaker panels provided in the Kit Of Parts.
 One or two additional 2-1/2” CIM motors (part #FR801-001) in addition to those provided in
the Kit Of Parts. This means that up to four, and no more, 2-1/2” CIM motors can be used
on the ROBOT.
 One additional 3” CIM “Minibike” motor (part #FR801-005). This means that up to two, and
no more, 3” CIM “Minibike” motors can be used on the ROBOT.
 Additional solenoid valves, air cylinders, and connecting fittings.
 One or two additional Clippard air storage tanks (Clippard Part Number AVT-32-16),
equivalent to those provided in the kit. This means that up to four, and no more, Clippard air
storage tanks can be used on the ROBOT.
 Pneumatic pressure relief valves identical to those provided in the Kit Of Parts (Parker Part
Number PV609-2).

[andrew_4_life]

What about Rule 27 which states that previous part cannot be used

<R27> Motors, pumps, and, Robot Controllers from previous robots can not be used in addition to those provided in the 2007 Kit Of Parts. They may be used as direct one-to-one SPARE PARTS for those provided if the provided part fails or is damaged. They can only be used if they are identical to the part being replaced.

I'm assuming if the part are identical they can't tell that we are using the same motor from previous robots.

[T3_1565]

one may assume, yet at the same time, they are sneaky like that, and may know by some means that we don't know about, best be on the safe side