disappointment loss at san diego regional

[Tri_Lam]

in match 54 of san diego regional we suffered a dissapointeng loss. at the end of the match we were on the edge staring through the plexy glass watching the ref's mesuring the height of our robot. the initial score (no bonus) was 16 red to 4 blue. we were partially on 1197's ramp. we see the ref's assessing the height of our robot. they cant get an accurate reading. we see the ref run to the tables and grabs a mesuring tape. turns out we were off by 16th of an inch. so this is my warning for all of you out there if you go up a ramp they'll mesure you even to a 16th of an inch. at this point we here of a penalty for red and final was 6 red 4 blue either way if we got our robot on top of our ally we woulda won. so do your best to CLIMB THOSE RAMPS GUYS GL and hopefully this wont happen to you too. watch the vido of match 54 when it comes out and you will see for your self..........

[burkechrs1]

The SHIFT key is a great thing =D

But yea, that does stink. Close matches are always the hardest ones to except. I always found it harder to take a loss if we lost by 2 points rather than by 40...

[Jeremiah Johnson]

See SF-3, MWR 2005 for another dissappointing loss... I'm sure most people on here have heard about it and all of the kids on 648 are over it (parents can't come to terms yet). "Walk it off." I'm sure you guys will do great tomorrow (or today).

By 1/16th of an inch?? Wow... they are nit-picky this year, aren't they? That's amazing.

[Cowmankoza]

Not to sound like a royal pain, but the ref's jobs are to enforce the rules, and the rules state you either have to be 4" or 12" off the ground for a bonus, not 4" or 12" give or take a little bit.

[JBotAlan]

Originally Posted by Cowmankoza

Not to sound like a royal pain, but the ref's jobs are to enforce the rules, and the rules state you either have to be 4" or 12" off the ground for a bonus, not 4" or 12" give or take a little bit.

I agree and would insist that the same ruling be enforced if it was our bot that didn't make it by a bit.

That doesn't keep it from inhaling audibly, though.

JBot

[Lil' Lavery]

Yeah, it's disappointing, but they gotta be strict about it. If they give you 1/16th", when do the stop? Next time, you're 1/16th" from 1/16th" (totaling 1/8th"), etc.

[Steve_Alaniz]

I empathize with you on being disappointed but let me point out that you are not considering the opposing alliance. They too want to win but you must win fairly and according to the rules. Think how they would have felt if they lost because the referees gave you a 1/16" bonus. Insignificant as that seems it DID determine the winner.
I think this is where FIRST teams shine most. When we take a disappointing loss and take a deep breath and congratulate the winners for a great performance. It doesn't make it any easier but just as you'd like them to acknowledge your victory, bitter as it is you can't take away from them in theirs....
(That being said let me just also say... I HATE TO LOSE!...but I seem to be becoming an expert at it...) The real world is a maddening place!
Sometimes you kick their bot and sometimes they kick yours.
Better luck in the future!

[EmilioM]

San Diego was choc full of close/disappointing losses. We (1717) were involved in three, two of which we came out on the less favourable end.

Close loss: When allied with 1332 and 980 against 1572 2193 and 835, 1332's rails for their roll-out ramps deployed early incurring a 10-point penalty (at the time) for extending beyond the 6-foot box... Come the end of the match, we lift both robots 15" unfortunately, the aforementioned rails hung over and were incontact with the ground, negating our successful lift of 1332. The score pre-penalties was 32-23 our alliance, but then when the penalty was assessed the final score came out to be 22-23. Ouch! However we later learned that 1332 was in fact NOT in violation of the 6-foot box rule and shouldnt have been assessed the penalty, thus giving our alliance the win. Unfortunately, this was discovered after 2 more matches had been played and, according to the head ref, the ruling could not be changed (similar to challenges in pro football)... This should be the subject of another thread in its own right: Overrulings that could swing the match even after more matches have been played.

Close win: In SF2-1, our blue alliance (1717 294 and 368) was against the red alliance (968 1834 and 1540). The initial final score of the match was 82-48 in favor of the red alliance. Both us (1717) and 968 had lifted two robots over 12" for 60 points apiece, however it was revealed that 1834 on the red alliance was in contact with the wall and therefore deducted 30 points from the ted alliances score giving them a 52-48 win. We were initially awarded only 30 points because the refs ruled that 368 had a ringer in their gripper that extended beyond the home zone and was therefore out of the home zone and didn't count as lifted. However, thanks to the keen intuition of one of our students, we called a time out and I ran back to the pits for a rulebook. We were able to overturn the ruling as the rules stated that the ringer only counted as part of the robot if it was in contact with the ground. The final score: 78-52 blue alliance, giving us a close and overjoyed win. Lots of jumping and hugging took place

Close loss: In finals match 2, our aforementioned elimination round alliance already had one win on our opponents, the red alliance, of 330 696 and 835 and had to win this match to win the championship. Red got a row of 6 for 64 points and we had 12 points of ringers on the rack. With time running out, our alliance partners broke through red's defense and the last of whom was driving onto out panels with about 1 second left. We pressed the button to release the gas springs just as time ended... Well, only 3 springs deployed, the cables that released these springs were hand-tuned to be simultaneous so if 3 deployed and not 4 that means the time differential between the end of the match when the robots were deactivated and that last cable being pulled was minimal - a tenth-second max. We have a "buzzer" system so all that had to occur was that last cable releasing the spring and we would have won... Needless to say, we lost and proceeded to lose the next match thanks in large part to superb defense played by te entire red alliance. It's just heartbreaking to know that you were but a split-second from winning the championship. Grr... lol.

Good luck to the champs 330 696 and 835 in Atlanta, represent Southern California well

[sanddrag]

Not to worry. It happens. We were about 1/2" short lifting 980 to beat 330 at Los Angeles, forcing a 3rd match. In San Diego, we were 2 points shy (in our last match) of grabbing 2nd seed (I think). You guys know you had a great robot. There is still the post-season.

[EmilioM]

Of course. And we're already in full-swing setting a foundation for next years team to rely upon... Lots of outreach and communication with possible corporate sponsers as well as a full website rebuild (shh... dont tell our mentor , its a surprise ) You guys had a great robot as well... Show Atlanta that lifter hybrids are the real thing lol.

[rsilverstein]

Disappointing win/loss: The Final Match at the Wisconsin Regional.
61-62. One point is the difference from going to Atlanta, and not.

[Christina]

Originally Posted by EmilioM

Close loss: When allied with 1332 and 980 against 1572 2193 and 835, 1332's rails for their roll-out ramps deployed early incurring a 10-point penalty (at the time) for extending beyond the 6-foot box... Come the end of the match, we lift both robots 15" unfortunately, the aforementioned rails hung over and were incontact with the ground, negating our successful lift of 1332. The score pre-penalties was 32-23 our alliance, but then when the penalty was assessed the final score came out to be 22-23. Ouch! However we later learned that 1332 was in fact NOT in violation of the 6-foot box rule and shouldnt have been assessed the penalty, thus giving our alliance the win. Unfortunately, this was discovered after 2 more matches had been played and, according to the head ref, the ruling could not be changed (similar to challenges in pro football)... This should be the subject of another thread in its own right: Overrulings that could swing the match even after more matches have been played.

I'm going to address this...because I'm the one who saw the penalty...and I want you guys to have the real story.

We did not give a penalty for 1332 this round. We actually gave the penalty for 1717. When 1717 deployed their ramps, the corner of the ramp came out of the home zone. I'm the one who flagged it, so the head ref came over to me and another ref asking what had happened since 1332 wasn't 72" and I had told him that the penalty was for 1717. He was so relieved because he thought that he had made a mistake that cost the win for a then undefeated robot.

The head ref did say that 1717 was a very gracious team and that they handled the situation very very well, so kudos to you guys!

*does the penguin dance*

[EmilioM]

Originally Posted by Christina

I'm going to address this...because I'm the one who saw the penalty...and I want you guys to have the real story.

We did not give a penalty for 1332 this round. We actually gave the penalty for 1717. When 1717 deployed their ramps, the corner of the ramp came out of the home zone. I'm the one who flagged it, so the head ref came over to me and another ref asking what had happened since 1332 wasn't 72" and I had told him that the penalty was for 1717. He was so relieved because he thought that he had made a mistake that cost the win for a then undefeated robot.

The head ref did say that 1717 was a very gracious team and that they handled the situation very very well, so kudos to you guys!

*does the penguin dance*

Christina, thank you very much for clearing that up, I'm sure we'll see that and all feel very bad for misjudging the refs when we watch all our vids... As to the head ref (and yourself), send thanks from 1717 as a whole. When we confronted him and asked him about it he handled the situation with class and professionalism. He may have relayed what you said to some of my teammates and that information may not have found its way to me (seeing as we have a very large team). Thanks again, and wonderful job reffing the event, you guys very spot on every time, you all deserve recognition

*does the penguin dance right back*