"DIN rail" or Not

[BlackShadowFox]

Well this has been bothering me for a while now. As like many of you we all don't enjoy the new power distribution block for it being big and heavy and not making much sense in our application at certain "POINTS" like when using one atc fuses panel. But anyhow to the question in mind is:

Is there any rules on how to mount the power distribution block?
Such as do we need the DIN rail or could we make our own way?

For people who are confuse about what I'm talking about it is quite simple, i would like to mount the power distribution block in pieces (like black and red) sideways using a different mounting method.

So can you find any problem with this simple mounting change?

Also if you look in the 2007 wiring diagram the 2 atc fuse panels are wired on separate positive wires from the distribution block as for the negative uses one wire why from the PDB. I know ground is common but this wiring diagram is misleading. anyhow don't get cared away on this last part but focus on the mounting topic.

[Billfred]

I can't find anything in the 2007 manual that requires the use of the DIN rail. (That isn't to say that there isn't something in there, just that I can't find it.)

That said, I also can't think of a good way to mount them outside of the DIN rail. If you can get that one to pass inspection, more power to you.

[MrForbes]

Originally Posted by BlackShadowFox

i would like to mount the power distribution block in pieces (like black and red) sideways using a different mounting method.

If the different method involves modifying the blocks in any way, such as drilling holes in them, then it would probably be illegal.

What did you have in mind?

and I wonder if they'll continue to use the distribution blocks? I don't see many problems with them (getting the screws that hold in the wires tight is one issue), but other folks sure do complain about them.

[AdamHeard]

Originally Posted by squirrel

If the different method involves modifying the blocks in any way, such as drilling holes in them, then it would probably be illegal.

What did you have in mind?

and I wonder if they'll continue to use the distribution blocks? I don't see many problems with them (getting the screws that hold in the wires tight is one issue), but other folks sure do complain about them.

plenty of problems there. A single loosening can cut power to the whole robot.

enough said.

[BlackShadowFox]

Well i will tell you this that the idea will not alter or tamper with th PDB components.





Your going to kick yourself for this as for my idea is simple. Well here you go the only thing that is different is using a square frame tubing part. If you have messed around with the PWB parts you would notice that you could pop/snap on the red and black parts and are not required to SLID them on. So in result I can mount them in multiple way without the DIN rail

[FourPenguins]

I'm sorry, but could you draw a diagram or something? I'm not quite getting your explanation.

[BlackShadowFox]

well I can't do much with MS paint and i don't have it in my inventor files.

Note even if someone sends me the file, my inventor is to old for some of the newer files and i my not be able to open it.

So Here we go I will try to draw it with words. hmmmmmmmm
Ok now vision the square tubing. Now bring in the PDB positive and negative parts. now you know that on the bottom of those parts there are plastic hooks on each side. well now Hook the PDB parts on the open parts of the tubing. i Hope that helps

[techtiger1]

The din rail was not my favorite thing in the beginning either. However we learned a few useful things about it. Tinning the wires is a must and you need a fairly good soldering iron to do this given the required gage wire. This is important because of the Allen cap screw contact method it makes it so if you don't eventually you'll tighten the screw so much it will move all the wires to the side causing bad contact. Finally you can cut the rail it self to use what ever you want and it really isn't that much weight.

Just a few things,
Drew

[BlackShadowFox]

i Agree with what you are saying but for my design i need to use this method i came up with in order for it to fit.

[Doug G]

Originally Posted by techtiger1

The din rail was not my favorite thing in the beginning either. However we learned a few useful things about it. Tinning the wires is a must and you need a fairly good soldering iron to do this given the required gage wire. This is important because of the Allen cap screw contact method it makes it so if you don't eventually you'll tighten the screw so much it will move all the wires to the side causing bad contact. Finally you can cut the rail it self to use what ever you want and it really isn't that much weight.

Just a few things,
Drew

I agree that the DIN rail, when cut down to size, is not much weight - heck you can probably save more weight using smaller nuts and bolts in many of these robots. Also the many complaints I've heard about wires coming out of the blocks is usually due to not providing adequate strain relief and proper securing of the wires around the block.

[MrForbes]

My only experience with wire coming out of the block, was caused by the screw not being tightened all the way. After the screws were all tightened, we never had any problems with them.

[IndySam]

I love the fact that we switched over to the DIN rail last year. It's real world stuff that you will become very familiar with when you start your career's.

[Pavan Dave]

Don't shoot me for saying this but I didn't mind the PDB after a while. Especially after we found a solution to making the wires stay.

The solution can be found in this post in this thread.

[Al Skierkiewicz]

OK,
Time to clear up a few misconceptions and fix some other notions.
1. I believe that the DIN rail is a required part of the Power Block. Although I have seen aluminum DIN rails, they are not easy to find. The steel rail when cut down to size (you do not need to use all of the blocks) is fairly light in the big scheme of things. The DIN rail is the designed mounting for this system and allows all the components to be firmly mounted and held together.

2. The wires pull out of the block for two reasons. One is the screws are not tight and two the wire is not stripped to specification of 5/8". Any shorter and the wire doesn not fill the entire depth of the clamp and the result is the wire will be forced out like a banana from a peel. As you tighten the clamp and wire is forced further out, the screw will seem loose and you will tighten it causing more more wire to be pushed out. The use of wiring retention devices and strain relief will only delay the failure of an improper strip, it will not prevent it.

3. Tinning the wire prevents the wire from being squeezed out of the clamp but prevents full contact between the clamp and the wire. This raises the series resistance and causes spot heating.

4. Although the IFI distro panel is a far better alternative in this application, I do not think it will return in the future. As a second best choice, last year's distro block fills the need for both veteran and rookie alike. I expect it to return in the 2008 KOP.

5. Although the power drawing was a little misleading, good practice recommends (read that as "requires") separate return wiring for each fuse block in use. What ever current passes through the red wires also pass through the black wires. Don't fall into the belief that no current flows in the common wiring. #6 or larger on both red and black wires, please. Daisy chaining of the fuse block power wiring causes all current from the block at the end of the chain to flow through the next block in line.

[scott]

If you do not like the DIN mounted AB Terminals, sorry but if you are going to be continuing on into Industrial Controls after Robotics they will not be going anyplace. I build Industrial Control panels for Frakes Engineering and these are standard, though we do not use anything this large.

Also on Team 447, we have been using terminal block strips for a couple years. They make it very nice when trouble shooting and when replacing components.

Check for what the torque setting should be for the terminals, we have never had a problem with them coming loose when torqued properly.