New FTC Platform

[StarGazer]

Well, I have been really excited about the growth of the vex platform. In particular, I think the new WiFi control system is going to allow some amazing designs. However, I now see this about the new FTC platform:

http://firsttechchallenge.blogspot.com

-StarGazer

[Rick]

This looks pretty cool. New metal, new brain, aluminum gears. Should make for some interesting machines.

[Gdeaver]

This is a partial confirmation of what I suspected was going on. Notice that there is no mention of IFI. Seams this confirms the split. I believe NI did the development work for LEGO this explains the thread on NI this past fall. Now the question is do you do a VEX competition or a FTC competition?

[Billfred]

Color me perplexed that FIRST would announce something as major as a platform change for one of their competitions on a Blogger account that I can't find linked to anywhere on usfirst.org. The information presented seems to jive with everything we've been hearing through the grapevine (and heck, the guy in the video is doing a pull-up on a field-spec overpass), but I'm holding out a little bit longer to be certain. (Can someone more familiar with the building confirm whether that paint scheme on the wall is seen in FIRST Place?)

Originally Posted by Gdeaver

Now the question is do you do a VEX competition or a FTC competition?

Whichever better inspires your team. In my mind, either can be a viable option.

[fredliu168]

I think a main concern for teams is the cost of the new kit. A lot of teams poured money into VEX thinking it will last them a long time. Now that a new kit is the platform for FTC, many smaller teams will not be able to afford enough parts. Since FIRST is working with several providers for the parts rather than IFI Robotics, I think it shows that it would cost a great deal more than the $300 VEX starter kit.

Another concern is the use of machining and powertools. VEX was great because you could build your entire competition bot with a wrench and two allen keys (which I did), and can still be extremely competitive. If the new platform requires a lot of machining like in FRC, this will put teams without access to the proper tools at a huge disadvantage.

Another thing I'd like to point out is the time issue. Many students do FTC rather than FRC because it is a lot less time consuming. This is an especially big factor for seniors. With VEX I've always said you can build a competitive robot in one day (and I've proved this). If this new kit is a lot more time consuming, many teams will choose not to do it.

There are my three points about the new platform. Of course, I don't know anything about the new platform I just based this on

"We're making the change to give our teams the raw material they need to solve real robotics challenges that exist today. The new kit is a true robotics prototyping platform. It includes a variety of components from sensors, to motors, to metal, that represent current technology."


One thing I have to point out. I love the aluminum gears as well as the extremely powerful aluminum.

As of now both IFI and FTC Competitions look appealing.

Originally Posted by Billfred

Color me perplexed that FIRST would announce something as major as a platform change for one of their competitions on a Blogger account that I can't find linked to anywhere on usfirst.org. The information presented seems to jive with everything we've been hearing through the grapevine (and heck, the guy in the video is doing a pull-up on a field-spec overpass), but I'm holding out a little bit longer to be certain. (Can someone more familiar with the building confirm whether that paint scheme on the wall is seen in FIRST Place?)

Wow, I never even considered the idea that this could be a hoax. If it is, its got to be the best hoax I've ever seen XD

I've just noticed that stargazer, the CD member who posted this blog has 1 post and just joined. Could mean nothing...

[KathieK]

It is not a hoax. It is a blog being written by Ken Johnson (Program Director) to provide information to FTC teams about the change in platform. It was released to Affiliate Partners and Regional Directors yesterday. An official announcement will go out to teams early next week.

[basicxman]

hey we might get to use pneumatics

but seriously i run a small team on a 1K budget, if i need power tools, thats my budget gone, wheres the kit!? i'd rather stick with FIRST but i think they're forcing me to go with a vex competition

[Akash Rastogi]

Originally Posted by basicxman

hey we might get to use pneumatics

but seriously i run a small team on a 1K budget, if i need power tools, thats my budget gone, wheres the kit!? i'd rather stick with FIRST but i think they're forcing me to go with a vex competition

If you need help with powertools, you could just find an FRC team in your area.

[basicxman]

Originally Posted by lilstogi11

If you need help with powertools, you could just find an FRC team in your area.

true but only (i think i havent found anyone else) team here in burlington is my FTC team and Rambotics (m.m. robinson high school which is half an hour from my house my brothers go that school but i wont) but i doubt ill really be able to borrow power tools

[ManicMechanic]

Next question: How is the split going to affect this forum? At the moment FTC/FVC is a sub-folder of Vex. I hope that questions regarding Vex can still be posted and answered here, even if it's not a formal FIRST program.

[Barry Bonzack]

Last I heard, Intelitek was planning on having a program for the new platform. PITSCO is the maker of ROBOLAB, the old RCX program. Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe they also made the NXT Software, based off of LabView. Will we be able to program in multiple languages for the new FTC platform I wonder?

Metal gears will be nice, the plastic ones breaking and slipping get on my nerves. I am curious how this will affect cost.

You'll recognize the packaging, it's based on the LEGO NXT controller but will do a lot more than your standard NXT. More on that to follow.

Does this mean it will look like an NXT, or will the "brick" look different?

[fredliu168]

Originally Posted by ManicMechanic

Next question: How is the split going to affect this forum? At the moment FTC/FVC is a sub-folder of Vex. I hope that questions regarding Vex can still be posted and answered here, even if it's not a formal FIRST program.

You can always try www.vexlabs.com. They have a great forum and questions usually get answered extremely fast.

I'm hoping a team will step up and make a forum like CD deticated to FTC. There are around 800 teams (I think) for FTC now, it would be nice to have another forum. Also a bluealliance or SOAP (video archiving) for FTC would be nice as well. I don't have the skill or time to do this =S.

[StarGazer]

...or it could be that I am a regular forum member who didn't want my name on the post

While it hasn't been officially announced, I was told that it could be communicated at this time.

Everything isn't settled yet as they are still looking to get feedback on kits that have been distributed before they settle on the official kit contents. I am particularly interested in the controller. I was told that the system is based on NXT with 10x more memory and around 40% faster than the vex (processor speed?). If it uses an ARM processor like the LEGO NXT it could be quite capable. Their cost target for a kit is $1000 (I don't know what they plan to include and what extras will be available).

The cost of $1000 is going to be a real issue for some programs.

-StarGazer

[basicxman]

Originally Posted by fredliu168

I'm hoping a team will step up and make a forum like CD deticated to FTC.

your wish is being answered

[MentorDanK]

First of all I really like the First organization and competition format. They stand for a the right stuff. I don't want to be too judgemental until I hear more about the new fomat. BUT,

I agree with the concerns of additional costs and time requirements of students that are already taxed with school work. We had a constant problem getting students to build meetings because of other commitments. Many just don't have the time to commit to an FRC type format.

In a time of school budgets that are being reduced the cost of the new new format will discourage schools from getting involved. Also in our area many students are being put into portable class rooms with no access to any special power tools. That was one of the attactive features of the Vex format. We had 2 teams design and build there robots using minimal power tools, in a portable class room.

For several years the company that sponsors my FTC teams sponsored an FRC team. Because of the expense, the dificulty of getting a facility with the proper tool, space requirements and mulitple schools to form a single team with enough students, the teams would work for a year or two and then folded. Another problem they had was attracting teachers to sponsor the teams. We only have one teacher willing to stay after school and put in the hours required.
Now the company sponsors 4 teams from 2 schools and was planning on expanding to 1-2 more schools next year. With the added expense of the new format they may only have funding for 1 team for each of the existing 2 schools. I'm sure that our sponsors will step back and take a hard look at supporting the Vex run competition. Its just sounds like more bang for the buck.

Something that I have not seen any comments about was team size. In the new format will the team size still be restricted to 10. I would hope that it would increase to 20 because the tasks will be more involved.

I think that the improvements in sensor and gears would be nice, but I'm not sure they will be worth the cost.