Blocking your own trailer

[Brad Voracek]

I know there was a previous thread on it, but no consensus seemed to be reached and that topic was getting way.. off topic.

It seems to be this is a hugely viable strategy, and I don't want to end up wasting a week designing for it, for it to then become illegal.

Is the general consensus if you find a way to stay within the size limitations, you can cover up your own trailer?

=/

[BigWhiteYeti]

I'd be shocked if the game designers don't eventually say that physically covering your goal is illegal. Even if there were a hole in the rules that may allow it, I think they would call you for a violation of the spirit of the rules.

[bduddy]

Originally Posted by BigWhiteYeti

I'd be shocked if the game designers don't eventually say that physically covering your goal is illegal. Even if there were a hole in the rules that may allow it, I think they would call you for a violation of the spirit of the rules.

Now, I wouldn't be surprised if some rule to that effect is introduced today or tomorrow, but what in the rules as they stand now makes you think that the "spirit of the rules" bars you from covering your goal?

[ericbarch]

Although the rules might allow it...would we really want games with all the trailers covered and robots just driving around without being able to score anything?

I'm guessing they'll clarify in the near future though.

[jmarsh24]

Rules state you cannot go out of the dimensions of your robot, therefore not allowing you to cover up your robot.

[dodar]

Originally Posted by jmarsh24

Rules state you cannot go out of the dimensions of your robot, therefore not allowing you to cover up your robot.

Yes, that is true but some teams are thinking about retracting the trailer inside their robot and then covering the top or covering it somehow or just retracting it in so it is harder to see

[Chris Fultz]

Actually,

<R16>
Once the MATCH has started, the ROBOT may assume a PLAYING CONFIGURATION that is different from the STARTING CONFIGURATION. The ROBOT must be designed such that the PLAYING CONFIGURATION of the ROBOT shall not exceed the dimensions specified in Rule <R11>.

This would imply that if your total robot stayed within the maximum size, then you could have some extension (that might be a cover).

(note - not saying it is legal or in the spirit, just listing what the rule says)

[384 huband44]

Originally Posted by Chris Fultz

Actually,

<R16>
Once the MATCH has started, the ROBOT may assume a PLAYING CONFIGURATION that is different from the STARTING CONFIGURATION. The ROBOT must be designed such that the PLAYING CONFIGURATION of the ROBOT shall not exceed the dimensions specified in Rule <R11>.

This would imply that if your total robot stayed within the maximum size, then you could have some extension (that might be a cover).

(note - not saying it is legal or in the spirit, just listing what the rule says)

so if we keep it at the limit of the box then we can extend an arm backwards to decrease the chance of a ball making it into the trailer?

[Travis Hoffman]

Originally Posted by dodar

Yes, that is true but some teams are thinking about retracting the trailer inside their robot and then covering the top or covering it somehow or just retracting it in so it is harder to see

These are questions that should not be lumped together. I'll start a list of questions that might be asked in the Q&A. Feel free to modify them and add new ones to the list.

1. If a robot is built with, say, a 24x24 footprint, is it allowed to expand beyond that to the max 28x38 footprint dimensions?

2. If #1 is permissible, can the 28x38 max footprint of the robot overlap with that of a trailer, self-towed or otherwise?

3. If #2 is permissible, are teams allowed to erect a cover/diverter above the portion of a self-towed trailer which overlaps the 28x38 max footprint?

4. If #2 is permissible, are teams allowed to employ descoring mechanisms to extract game pieces from trailers? [My "gut feeling" says this will not be allowed.]

5. If #2 is permissible, excluding the obvious exception of the trailer hitch point, may a robot contact any part of a trailer other than its bumpers?

6. Can the 38" dimension be the "wide" dimension of the robot? [I'm almost positive this will be allowed.]

Until the opening of the Q&A on Wednesday or the release of a Team Update, further speculation is pointless, and a consensus opinion is meaningless.

[bduddy]

Originally Posted by Travis Hoffman

These are questions that should not be lumped together. I'll start a list of questions that might be asked in the Q&A. Feel free to modify them and add new ones to the list.

1. If a robot is built with, say, a 24x24 footprint, is it allowed to expand beyond that to the max 28x38 footprint dimensions?

2. If #1 is permissible, can the 28x38 max footprint of the robot overlap with that of a trailer, self-towed or otherwise?

3. If #2 is permissible, are teams allowed to erect a cover/diverter above the portion of a self-towed trailer which overlaps the 28x38 max footprint?

4. If #2 is permissible, are teams allowed to employ descoring mechanisms to extract game pieces from trailers? [My "gut feeling" says this will not be allowed.]

5. If #2 is permissible, excluding the obvious exception of the trailer hitch point, may a robot contact any part of a trailer other than its bumpers?

6. Can the 38" dimension be the "wide" dimension of the robot? [I'm almost positive this will be allowed.]

Until the opening of the Q&A on Wednesday or the release of a Team Update, further speculation is pointless, and a consensus opinion is meaningless.

#1=Yes.

Originally Posted by Section 8

<R16>
Once the MATCH has started, the ROBOT may assume a PLAYING CONFIGURATION that is different from the STARTING CONFIGURATION. The ROBOT must be designed such that the PLAYING CONFIGURATION of the ROBOT shall not exceed the dimensions specified in Rule <R11>.

Nos. 2-4 are, in my opinion, currently legal. I would not be surprised if some of them are not by tomorrow, though.

#5=Yes.

Originally Posted by Section 7

<G29>
Arena Interaction –ROBOTS may push or react against any elements of the ARENA, provided there is no damage or disruption of the ARENA elements.

#6 has always been legal, and there is nothing in the rules that leads me to believe anything has changed this year.

[Killraine]

Originally Posted by Travis Hoffman

4. If #2 is permissible, are teams allowed to employ descoring mechanisms to extract game pieces from trailers? [My "gut feeling" says this will not be allowed.]

#4 is definitely illegal, I'm looking for the rule now, but I remember reading that balls can not be taken from the trailers after being scored.

[Jinx]

Seeing that teams are brainstorming an air defense, how effective do you think that would be?

My team thinks its a rather great idea and so do I but the mathematics seems to worry me... I may be thinking far to ahead but its better early than never...

[Josh Drake]

Two words: Bill's Blog

[bduddy]

Originally Posted by Killraine

#4 is definitely illegal, I'm looking for the rule now, but I remember reading that balls can not be taken from the trailers after being scored.

I think you may be mistaking it with the rule where if a trailer tips over, all balls in it still score. I don't think there is, as of yet, any rule that says what you are saying.

EDIT: Just noticed this-http://frcdirector.blogspot.com - which states that "the Game Design Committee’s intention" is that de-scoring, goaltending, and under-robot fans are not allowed. So I wouldn't make plans to use any of them, but it is still my opinion that they are technically legal. Until today's Team Update, that us...

[Jinx]

What if the fans were placed near the top? Would that violate any rules?