ELEVATED but not hanging?

[Kevin Sevcik]

Someone sanity check me on this. I just did a double take on closely reading the ELEVATED definition:

ELEVATED: A ROBOT that is completely above the plane of the PLATFORM and in contact with the TOWER shall be considered ELEVATED

It's missing the "and only in contact with the TOWER" or "only supported by the TOWER" that I've been conditioned to expect. By my reading, a robot sitting on top of another robot, 21" off the ground, and touching the TOWER = ELEVATED. I can't see anything that argues against this. I'm Q&A-ing it, but it seems legal to me at the moment. Comments?

NB: So a triple-stack of robots near a tower could = 5 points?

[kirtar]

I'll add to what you said and say that the robot on top reaches out to touch the tower (otherwise it's not elevated).

[Kevin Sevcik]

Followup that I also Q&A-ed. SUSPENDED says only touching an ELEVATED/SUSPENDED ROBOT. I'm now curious if an otherwise SUSPENDED robot is downgraded if it touches the TOWER. Sure makes things harder, doesn't it?

[kirtar]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

Followup that I also Q&A-ed. SUSPENDED says only touching an ELEVATED/SUSPENDED ROBOT. I'm now curious if an otherwise SUSPENDED robot is downgraded if it touches the TOWER. Sure makes things harder, doesn't it?

How it is currently stated, that is the only interpretation that I can see. That extra point (in comparison to hanging from the tower) is for hanging off of another robot, so they have to make it so you can't just hang off the tower and touch another robot.

[Phoenix Spud]

I believe you would only get 2 points for that strategy since the middle robot is touching the bottom robot, and therefor not SUSPENDED by the top robot. This means the bottom and middle robots would not receive any bonus points, but the top robot would receive 2. Does that make sense.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by Phoenix Spud

I believe you would only get 2 points for that strategy since the middle robot is touching the bottom robot, and therefor not SUSPENDED by the top robot. This means the bottom and middle robots would not receive any bonus points, but the top robot would receive 2. Does that make sense.

Oh-o. But you're reading your standard, everyday, common sense definition of SUSPENDED into things. This is Breakaway we're talking about. If you have a stack of 3 vertical robots, the middle one is 21" up and touching the tower, and the top one is only touching the middle one... Then I think the middle one is ELEVATED, and the top one is SUSPENDED, as it's only touching the ELEVATED robot below it. (Yes, I just said a robot was suspended by another robot below it. I didn't write the rules.)

[JesseK]

All I know is that I would not want the risk of being the 'top bot' in a 3-robot stack. That's a fantastic catch nonetheless Kevin; I wonder if that interpretation is within their intent and thus will hold up without change.

[Brian Ha]

Safe to say don't set your robot up for this, but if you find out that you can all the way bro

[TomH]

Originally Posted by Kevin Sevcik

Someone sanity check me on this. I just did a double take on closely reading the ELEVATED definition:It's missing the "and only in contact with the TOWER" or "only supported by the TOWER" that I've been conditioned to expect. By my reading, a robot sitting on top of another robot, 21" off the ground, and touching the TOWER = ELEVATED. I can't see anything that argues against this. I'm Q&A-ing it, but it seems legal to me at the moment. Comments?

NB: So a triple-stack of robots near a tower could = 5 points?

I have been debating this for some time (last few days) and the video (although I am told NOT to trust which is SUPPOSED to give an understanding of the game) does show it not once, but twice that being on the platform is considered elevated. If it is, then a triple stack would be worth 8 points, considering a plane is a flat surface that has generally no thickness, but if is not, then it is worth only 5 points as you said.

[kirtar]

Originally Posted by TomH

I have been debating this for some time (last few days) and the video (although I am told NOT to trust which is SUPPOSED to give an understanding of the game) does show it not once, but twice that being on the platform is considered elevated. If it is, then a triple stack would be worth 8 points, considering a plane is a flat surface that has generally no thickness, but if is not, then it is worth only 5 points as you said.

The triple stack mentioned is near the tower, not on the platform. To clarify (how I read it), you have a robot that drives up next to the platform that has for example a flat surface on it and it deploys a ramp. A robot gets on top of it (touches the tower), and somehow another robot puts itself on top of that one (and is not touching the tower). This would be one elevated, one suspended, for 5 points.

[Kevin Sevcik]

Originally Posted by kirtar

The triple stack mentioned is near the tower, not on the platform. To clarify (how I read it), you have a robot that drives up next to the platform that has for example a flat surface on it and it deploys a ramp. A robot gets on top of it (touches the tower), and somehow another robot puts itself on top of that one (and is not touching the tower). This would be one elevated, one suspended, for 5 points.

That was my thinking, yes. Slightly more practical implementation probably has the top bot mount the middle bot and then the middle bot mount the base bot. This only brings it down to about 10.5 on the 11 point scale of complete insanity, of course. I'm not proposing that this makes much sense, but it IS an interesting insight into the rules. Well, that and the somewhat warped workings of my brain.

[Paul Copioli]

Another interesting way to think about suspended is this:

Let's say robot 1 is elevated such that the bottom of the robot is at 24" by doing a pull-up on one of the horizontal bars on the tower. It now "sticks out its tongue (made of LEXAN, of course) and lays on the platform. If it stays within the 85 inches and another robot drives on the platform and is only on the LEXAN, then that robot is SUSPENDED and worth 3 points. The totla for that maneuver is 5 points.

[XaulZan11]

Originally Posted by Paul Copioli

Another interesting way to think about suspended is this:

Let's say robot 1 is elevated such that the bottom of the robot is at 24" by doing a pull-up on one of the horizontal bars on the tower. It now "sticks out its tongue (made of LEXAN, of course) and lays on the platform. If it stays within the 85 inches and another robot drives on the platform and is only on the LEXAN, then that robot is SUSPENDED and worth 3 points. The totla for that maneuver is 5 points.

Were you listening in on our design meetings?

[BrianCloutier]

The scary thing is, I've read all of the rules and what you guys are suggesting *is* legal (so far). Keep up the good work, and I love the Lexan idea, I'm bringing it up in our meeting tomorrow.

[KGood]

They might correct this in a rule update, but the GDC has a habit of leaving some rules open to ambiguity to let teams be creative.